High idle, pretty stumped

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Yeret

Yeret

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Got a break in the rain, so I went out to see what I could screw u...I mean, sort out.

Plugged in my scanner and went for a brief drive to see if I could catch the problem. I noted the TPS reading while sitting in Park and idling and went for a drive. Sure enough, the engine idled up so I shifted into park and noticed that the TPS was reading much higher than before. I gave the engine some throttle and noticed that the TPS was not responding right away so I revved the engine some. The TPS did eventually respond and the idle did settle back down, along with the TPS reading. Heading back and putting the truck in Park, I noticed that the TPS was not holding a steady reading like it should have.

Luckily, I still have my old TPS, which isn't bad (I only replaced it earlier this year as preventative maintenance) so I'm gonna swap it in and see what happens. If the issue is resolved, this will be the first time that I've had an issue with a Borg Warner part. And that's a little disturbing since half of the electronics that I've replaced are Borg Warner...
 
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Yeret

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Think I might be getting somewhere now. Swapped the old TPS in, ran the engine and it definitely reads smoother than the BW. Went for a drive, problem hasn't surfaced yet. Gonna drive for a few days and see what happens.
 

Shadow_Death

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Yep. I think I threw away my OEM Holley TPS by accident. I'm stuck with a Oriley's BWD part. I'll probably order a different part off Amazon and hope for the best tomorrow. I can say that Standard Motor Products is out of the question.

We distribute through traditional and non-traditional channels under our own brand names, such as Standard®, BWD®, TechSmart®, Intermotor®, Hayden®, ACI®, Four Seasons®, and through private labels.

I think I recall that this company also makes Duralast parts too.

Seems my only two options are Delphi and OEM. Mopar doesn't offer anything for a 96 anymore. :emotions122:
 
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Well, after a few days of driving, I can pretty safely say that a faulty replacement TPS was to blame for the idle problem. Haven't had any idle issues since I swapped the old one back on.

I do, however have a new little problem. It seems now that while cruising on the highway, if I hit a bump in the road, the engine briefly surges up about 200 RPM before returning to where it was. So, if I'm cruising 2,000 RPM and hit hit a bump, the RPM will jump to 2,200 RPM and then settle back to 2,000. Possible fault in my old TPS? I will say that the old TPS seems a little loose and if you tap on it, you can actually hear and feel something vibrating. Genuine OEM TPS is gonna set me back a hundred bucks though. Kind of a lot to spend on a guess but then, I'm pretty sure the TPS shouldn't "jingle" when you tap on it, LOL.
 

Shadow_Death

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Well, after a few days of driving, I can pretty safely say that a faulty replacement TPS was to blame for the idle problem. Haven't had any idle issues since I swapped the old one back on.

I do, however have a new little problem. It seems now that while cruising on the highway, if I hit a bump in the road, the engine briefly surges up about 200 RPM before returning to where it was. So, if I'm cruising 2,000 RPM and hit hit a bump, the RPM will jump to 2,200 RPM and then settle back to 2,000. Possible fault in my old TPS? I will say that the old TPS seems a little loose and if you tap on it, you can actually hear and feel something vibrating. Genuine OEM TPS is gonna set me back a hundred bucks though. Kind of a lot to spend on a guess but then, I'm pretty sure the TPS shouldn't "jingle" when you tap on it, LOL.

I think it's safe to assume that it shouldn't rattle like that. I've also noticed that same thing with my truck when I hit a bump. I work right off I-35 and right before I get to my turn into work I have to drive over some "bumps" on the service road and every time the truck bumps a little the rpms go up like the TC is unlocking for a moment before locking back. Mine also does this going down the highway. I'm going to order a replacement this weekend if i can budget it in. If not then I'll just have to tough it out for another week. Mine also does this weird loping as it drives. This is what caused me to pull the sensor like I did. I was actually able to pin it to the loping of the truck. Loping/Engine surge.

Edit: I forgot that I found my old Holley TPS in the glove box.

Edit 2: Mine doesn't rattle so I suspect mine just has crispy electrical internals. Once it gets hot in the engine bay this thing just freaks out.

https://imgur.com/a/4obtU

They probably used the crappiest internals they could get their hands on.
 
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Shadow_Death

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I found out that AutoZone uses Wells products now for their electronics. I cross-referenced the part number and it's literally a Wells TPS in a Duralast box. Went ahead and bought it. Instantly all my issues are gone except for that TC issue. So I did some digging and it seems there is a 5v wire in the transmission that handles the lock and unlock of the TC on these 46re. Some have reported it running through the insulation and shorting out on the side of the valve body and causing TC to unlock and lock back. I think if time and my budget allowes I'm going to drop the trans pan and change the filter this weekend. While I'm doing that I'll check on that wire.

Figured I would post these notes here. It does make sense as a short to ground wire as it only seems to happen when we hit bumps.
 
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Swapped in my new TPS yesterday. Idle issue remains resolved, engine seems smoother under part-throttle acceleration and that weird engine surging when I hit bumps has also disappeared. Now that the computer is in the "relearn" phase, hopefully everything stays okay.
 
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Been a week now and at this point, there is no reason to believe that a faulty TPS wasn't causing my problems. Since this topic has gotten far more views than I thought, I reckon I'll post some closing thoughts for those who may experience similar issues. Things learned...

-contrary to what I used to think, idle problems are not always an issue with the IAC or throttle body setting.

-my confidence in store-brand parts took a hit, especially since I had bought a mid-range-priced TPS. Granted, I could have gotten it exchanged but what's to say the problem wouldn't return two months later again anyway? There's a reason why genuine OEM parts are so much more expensive.

-once again, my Equus Innova scanner with live data function proves to be totally invaluable. Thanks to this, I was able to pinpoint my replacement TPS as faulty (unsteady readings, "sticking" with throttle input) despite an absence of CELs. A faulty sensor doesn't always trip the ECU's diagnostic module even when the engine is clearly having idle and smootheness issues, not to mention what appeared to be the torque converter unlocking in OD after hitting a bump. Live data readings are totally invaluable when it comes to tracking down buggy sensors that the ECU isn't noticing. It's like I've always said, computers are smart but they're not THAT smart.

-from this point on, genuine OEM or bust. They're expensive but they ****ing work. What else can ya say?

Thanks to all who gave input along the way. Hopefully the stuff provided in this topic will help someone else down the line.
 

Shadow_Death

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I figured I would update what I've found out this far. My issue with the TC locking and unlocking seems to have been solved with an extremely temp fix. I had some logic roll through my head. So here we go.

My OBD2 scanner doesn't detect any abnormalities in my TPS, even when hitting bumps and it unlocking the TC while crusising.

So I gave up thinking about checking for faulty wires the next time I do a trans oil change. Then it hit me, that feeling the truck is giving when it does it. When I hit a bump the truck drags... Almost like it's suddenly pulling a trailer. So I crawled under the truck and soaked the Center Support Bearing either WD40 because it was all I had. I drove it to work for the last 2 days and the problem seems to be gone.... At least until that WD40 dries up. So now the truck is going to be down until I can replace it. Machine shops aren't cheap unless there is another way to press it on and off.

I just shared this to point out for future readers that not all TC issues are electrical related.

TL;DR: My TC unlock and lock issues seem to be extra drag on the drive train by a failing Center Support Bearing.
 

Shadow_Death

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^ Center support bearing? Where/what is this?

It seems to be commonly known as Carrier Bearing. Parts stores call it Drive Shaft Center Support. I'm speaking specifically about the bearing inside that support. lol
 

dudeman2009

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Yeah, I've always called it a carrier bearing, but center support bearing also works.

Usually i'd just replace the whole thing where it bolts to the cross member as the rubber bushing that surrounds the bearing will crack and wear over time just like a tire or control arm bushing. If that goes out its almost like you don't have a carrier at all on a split drive shaft.
 
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