Diesel vs Gas

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SouthTexan

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This^

I, on the other hand have owned both. For me, the gasser just fit MY situation better (very short commute/extremely cold temps in winter/not towing heavy). No more, no less.

This is NOT me bashing the diesel (SouthTexan) simply what works better for me.

To each their own definitely applies here! :)

Why was I named in thinking you were bashing diesels here?

As I said earlier in this very thread.....


Although this is more of a "why I chose a ____ versus _____" thread instead of diesel versus gas thread as the title implies. That kind of thread would be an all out war with me against just about everyone else here it seems. Which is okay because that is just how I like it.

Here is my take on it as I have stated many times before. I chose what I chose because I wanted it. Pure and simple. Do I "need" a diesel? No, the 6.4L would probably do 99% of I need it to do albeit in a different manner that I do not like. Everyone has their own reasons why they bought what they did, and not everyone's reasons are the same. Neither is what everyone looks for in a truck. To say the 6.4L is the end all be all engine for everyone is just as false as saying the Cummins is the end all be all engine for everyone. However, I wanted a Cummins over the 6.4L or the 5.7L and don't really feel the need to justify why by pointing out the negatives of the other.


Everyone has their reasons and some like what you stated are valid. Some reasons are not valid and those are the ones I debate. Don't confuse me debating the non-valid reasons for me thinking that all reasons are bashing like many other people here do. Some people here have the mindset that it is all or nothing. That if you even think that one reason is invalid then you must think all reasons are or if you dislike one thing about the 6.4L then you hate it all. I don't share that mindset. Everything has it's good and bad.
 
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cc rider

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This is not in response to anyone. Just a statement. Saying a diesel can out tow a gasser is incorrect. You obviously have to consider year of vehicle/setup. There are several older diesel trucks that the 6.4 can out tow. There is also the guy who thinks that cause he has a diesel he can pull any triple axle trailer. I think both the 6.4 and the cummins are awesome engines today. If I had more use for it, i would get a diesel. I know I would have a rock solid workhorse.
Now, some people just get them cause they like the "c" badge and it gives them balls, which is fine if you have the money. I guess you could always debadge, re apply a cummins badge, and try to make the truck sound a little more diesel like :) . Some have no use for them and get them to "compensate" (we all know who you are).
Of course a NEWER cummins truck is going to kick the 6.4's ass pulling something up a hill. But, I can find an older cummins engine that my truck is rated to out pull too. Yes other factors are involved such as frame, etc. Im speaking strictly tow ratings for max. towing. I know that the manufacturers overestimate. Im glad they are getting stricter with the standards though. I use to think cause ram/ford said you can tow 10k , that was the case. I learned a lot from this forum and other reading. I think my truck does great with 13-14k. Im only on flat lands and its always freezing here. I dont want to have to put a blanket on my baby. Would I want to tow its max. rating of 15k? Not everyday. But, if I needed to do it here and there , I know it could. I know a lot of guys that dislike the mds, but i think its great. I have tried driving like a granny before just to see what kind of mileage i would get. This is with the 4.10. I was averaging around 18mpg going 55 on the highway and when trying to take it as easy as possible on inner city 30mph roads (coasting a lot), I was showing getting more than that. Of course , thats crawling speeds. But , it was just to see what the max. economy i could get was. I know its not being realistic.
Anyway, I use my rig to pull my rv and occasionally use the bed for heavy items. No need for a diesel here. As a matter of fact, I would guess and bet the 6.4 would more than serve 90% or more of the people that buy these trucks (landscapers, majority of rv owners, etc).
 

PCT

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Because every hd thread turns into a gas vs diesel battle I'll setup the octagon ring to go old school mma style battle on why YOU think one is better than the other. And YOUR choice for driving either.

I'll go first. I've owned both. 05 5.9L 3500 QCLB dually, 2010 6.7L 2500 CCSB fully deleted and now a 2015 6.4L 2500 CCSB. Towed with both and hands down both diesels will out tow the 6.4L. The 6.4L I can tell I have something behind me, not do to handling, but power. I don't tow very often anymore, during the winter months I'm off work so may only drive 15-20 miles a week. 95% of my trips are in the 6-15 mile round trips. I had a 1/2 ton 5.7L in between my 05 and 2010, and just towing my 5x10 trailer w/lawn mower (20 hp 42" deck) I felt under powered and could feel the trailer behind me. So for me I wanted to stay in a 2500, didn't need a diesel anymore (wanted, and liked it). So I wanted to give the 6.4L a shot. It does what I need it to do and don't is better as a dd for me.

As far as mpg goes, I'm getting about the same do to my commute. Pay less at the pump, not by much due to running 89 octane. Plus being back into a new truck I have a warranty again. Yes I know I can get a aftermarket warranty.

I haven't owned or driven a 2500/3500 with the 5.7L so I can't comment on how they tow.

I was once under the mind frame that a gas 2500/3500 was useless and they should only be diesels. But that was viewing older big block and some newish small block trucks and thinking more about the 5 mpg they probably got towing then for reasons you'd buy one.

I had the exact idea and made a gas vs diesel thread too. :roflsquared::roflsquared::roflsquared:
 

drittal

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. Saying a diesel can out tow a gasser is incorrect. You obviously have to consider year of vehicle/setup. There are several older diesel trucks that the 6.4 can out tow. There is also the guy who thinks that cause he has a diesel he can pull any triple axle trailer.
Your 6.4 is rated to tow 2400lbs more my my father's old 1998 3500 DRW Cummins with 4.10.



...and try to make the truck sound a little more diesel like :)
You need the $10 diesel conversion kit. Wire with nuts an washers suspended over the exhaust manifolds to rattle, and a couple quarts of oil in the gas tank so it smokes.

Of course a NEWER cummins truck is going to kick the 6.4's ass pulling something up a hill.
Truth. An older one might as well. Turbo is NICE. I like my 6.4, but will keep an eye on the HD market. As a previous owner of an Ecoboost I liked the way it pulled, but complete lack of engine braking when towing concerned me. I keep reading the possibility of Ford doing a 5.0 EB motor for the SD line. Also the new 5.0 cummins in the Titan might spark the Big3 into dusting off their midsized diesels for the North American market. Truth be told, I think a 300-325 HP diesel would be a better fit than the current 6.6-6.7l for 3/4t. It should free up some payload and tow anything a 3/4t is rated to tow.


Anyway, I use my rig to pull my rv and occasionally use the bed for heavy items. No need for a diesel here.
Ditto.
 

cc rider

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I saw that.Maybe the mods will merge the two. This one seems to be getting all the action. The engine section would probably be a better place for it though.

I had the exact idea and made a gas vs diesel thread too. :roflsquared::roflsquared::roflsquared:
 
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1500ram12

1500ram12

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I saw that.Maybe the mods will merge the two. This one seems to be getting all the action. The engine section would probably be a better place for it though.
Wasn't sure on what was the best section to use
 
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1500ram12

1500ram12

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"he" is everywhere. Whenever a vs or engine option thread or post pops up, he knows
 

SouthTexan

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This is not in response to anyone. Just a statement. Saying a diesel can out tow a gasser is incorrect. You obviously have to consider year of vehicle/setup. There are several older diesel trucks that the 6.4 can out tow. There is also the guy who thinks that cause he has a diesel he can pull any triple axle trailer. I think both the 6.4 and the cummins are awesome engines today. If I had more use for it, i would get a diesel. I know I would have a rock solid workhorse.
Now, some people just get them cause they like the "c" badge and it gives them balls, which is fine if you have the money. I guess you could always debadge, re apply a cummins badge, and try to make the truck sound a little more diesel like :) . Some have no use for them and get them to "compensate" (we all know who you are).
Of course a NEWER cummins truck is going to kick the 6.4's ass pulling something up a hill. But, I can find an older cummins engine that my truck is rated to out pull too. Yes other factors are involved such as frame, etc. Im speaking strictly tow ratings for max. towing. I know that the manufacturers overestimate. Im glad they are getting stricter with the standards though. I use to think cause ram/ford said you can tow 10k , that was the case. I learned a lot from this forum and other reading. I think my truck does great with 13-14k. Im only on flat lands and its always freezing here. I dont want to have to put a blanket on my baby. Would I want to tow its max. rating of 15k? Not everyday. But, if I needed to do it here and there , I know it could. I know a lot of guys that dislike the mds, but i think its great. I have tried driving like a granny before just to see what kind of mileage i would get. This is with the 4.10. I was averaging around 18mpg going 55 on the highway and when trying to take it as easy as possible on inner city 30mph roads (coasting a lot), I was showing getting more than that. Of course , thats crawling speeds. But , it was just to see what the max. economy i could get was. I know its not being realistic.
Anyway, I use my rig to pull my rv and occasionally use the bed for heavy items. No need for a diesel here. As a matter of fact, I would guess and bet the 6.4 would more than serve 90% or more of the people that buy these trucks (landscapers, majority of rv owners, etc).


I agree a lot of what you said but not all.

I know a lot of guys who buy a diesel and don't tow just because they like how a diesel drives versus a gas vehicle or just because they like diesels in general. Is there anything wrong with that? I don't think so as long as they earn the money for it lawfully and is not getting any government assistance then I don't see anything wrong with it. I also know some that do buy diesels as status symbols. Again, I may not agree with it, but it is their money.

Although there are some that buy diesels to "compensate" for something, I do believe a lot of times non-diesel owners mislabel this just because they have "sour grapes syndrome". After all, from what I have seen that most HD truck owners tow in here they don't "need" an HD. Does that mean they are "compensating" for something? No, they just want an HD. Also out of most of the HD owners here, they don't "need" a 6.4L and the 5.7L would be enough to do what they need. Does that mean these 6.4L owners are compensating for something? I don't think so. They got the 6.4L because they wanted it just as someone who would buy a Cummins just because they wanted it, and I don't think there is anything wrong with either scenario.

As I said, most gaser HD owners that I personally know that talk about others "needing" a diesel when the topic comes up do so because they have the "sour grapes syndrome"(<-Google it). Even though they would like to have the power of the diesel and all it's benefits, they grow a disdain for diesel and diesel owners because they don't have one, don't have a need for one, or it was to much money for them to spend on the option. They figure that if they don't need one then nobody does and those who do are doing it for wrong reasons. In it's basic form, "sour grapes syndrome" is a growing dislike for things you don't have or cannot have even though you would like to and over time the dislike could turn into hatred. Am I saying everyone is like this? No, but I do know a lot of people that are and not just with diesels.

I have seen the very same people talk about other truck options. They bust peoples chops for having a "Laramie" package with all the bells and whistles saying they don't "need" all that stuff. However, when I get down to the bottom of where this animosity comes from I find that they wish they had those options too so they make fun of people who have them or tell them they don't "need" it just because they don't have it. Again, this is not the case every time, but it does happen A LOT. After all, what is wrong with someone buying an option like heated seats on a truck just because they want it and can buy it? Do they "need" it? No, but who am I(or anyone else) to tell people how to spend their own money if they want a heated seat option or a diesel option regardless if I think they "need" it or not?
 
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1500ram12

1500ram12

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I'm fighting the urge to get back into a diesel. The capabilities of a diesel engine, the sound, power of a diesel engine is addicting. Being practical vs having what I want is a never ending battle.

A new diesel is out of the question, finding another good used one with low mileage in the price range I want (without going out of state for one again) is kinda tough. I know if I was dead set on finding one I could. My wife would most likely leave me. 5 trucks and 6 years ago was supposed to be my last one. Always came up with a good reason to get something different. At this point I don't really have any good reason to get something different unless I lowered my payment which wouldn't happen.

Maybe I need a new mod for my truck
 

cc rider

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You sound butt hurt. If you wanna compensate with your diesel, that's fine. Your logic is silly. You're comparing a $8k motor to heated seats. I see a truck as a tool just like other things ;) You can have a 3500 with a 5.7 and just use it to haul stone, wood, etc. I think adding an $8k option is going a little crazy if you don't need it in my opinion. . Just curious how does a diesel drive? I could have easily afforded the Cummins. Just like I said, don't need it. Personally I like the way the gasser sounds too.

Blah blah blah yada yada yada
 

SouthTexan

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You sound butt hurt. If you wanna compensate with your diesel, that's fine. Your logic is silly. You're comparing a $8k motor to heated seats. I see a truck as a tool just like other things ;) You can have a 3500 with a 5.7 and just use it to haul stone, wood, etc. I think adding an $8k option is going a little crazy if you don't need it in my opinion. . Just curious how does a diesel drive? I could have easily afforded the Cummins. Just like I said, don't need it. Personally I like the way the gasser sounds too.


Actually the Laramie package is a $10k plus package going from a Tradesman crew cab 5.7L 2WD to a Laramie crew cab 5.7L 2WD. Don't believe me, look it up. So basically you can get a Tradesman crew cab Cummins for about the same as a Laramie crew cab 5.7L. Add in the 6.4L option and you will spending another $1.2k. It basically depends on which options are more important to you, a diesel or all the bells and whistles of a Laramie package. So are you going to tell people spending over $10k just on a Laramie package tjey are crazy because it is a don't "need" option?

Also, as I said in my post I didn't say everyone was that way so do you have something on your conscience?

Btw, enjoy those sour grapes.
 

SouthTexan

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Do the 2015+ diesels need unlocked PCM to tune?

No, it depends on which route you go. Module tuners like the Edge JWA or Stryker don't plug into the ECM.
 
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1500ram12

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This is a non butt hurting thread.
 

SouthTexan

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This is a non butt hurting thread.

Yeah he keeps accusing me of that, but at the end of most our debates he is usually the one screaming obscenities and insults while I am just sitting back laughing.
 
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1500ram12

1500ram12

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I thought 13+ diesel required ecm unlock to tune them, regardless of a standard tuner or using efi live? I haven't paid to close of attention to diesel tuning since I switched over to the 6.4L. I still check out cummins forum on a daily basis, but more for the HD talk and mods than performance.
 

SouthTexan

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I thought 13+ diesel required ecm unlock to tune them, regardless of a standard tuner or using efi live? I haven't paid to close of attention to diesel tuning since I switched over to the 6.4L. I still check out cummins forum on a daily basis, but more for the HD talk and mods than performance.

Module tuners like the Edge and Stryker don't plug into the ECM. It has a harness that plugs in between where the ECM injector harness plugs into the engine injector harness. Basically all it does is alter what the ECM is telling the injectors what to do. If you need to take it to the dealer then you just unplug it and reconnect the injector harnesses to each other.
 

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