Anyone HAPPY with Borg Warner 44-44 / Auto 4WD

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mohemipar

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You have a nice long explanation of this t case I'm not going to disagree to much other then to say as I have said before it is a piece of crap.

Part of that is the programing part is the case its self.
For what you consider "normal" driving, i.e. city streets and highways it may be good enough for lots of people.
My "normal" driving is a tad bit different and I expect a t case to do as they had always done, when it says LOCK then that thing should be a full lock in the case period no ifs buts or maybes that's all this case has is buts and maybe.
I have had numerous times when this thing has not worked as a good transfer case;
1) stop on an slippery hill put the truck in park and it reverts to 2wd and starts sliding, lots of fun and a safety hazzard
2) be traveling on a side hill and trying to ease over slippery rocks and logs with inches to spare for your fenders and the rear end spinning and traveling sideways
3) backing up a grade on wet grass easing into a tight spot in low lock light throttle and the rear again has to slip before it does a damned thing with the front axle
4) cross a frozen brook with water on top of the ice and a steep bank to climb to get out, again creeping slow light throttle, just try and ease that damn thing up the bank, with almost no traction at the rear the only torque you get to the front is what the electric clutch gives and it will slip and over heat and cut out
4) head down a steep slippery grade in low 4 and first gear see how much traction and engine hold back you have as the rear end breaks loose and the front end has no holdback.

In conclusion yes I expect my fancy high dollar truck to be able to work and get me around as I have always been able to with 4wd, this is my 3rd winter with this truck and it does 80% of what it needs to, the other 20% it is a worthless piece of crap and at times a severe safety hazard, I do not like having to slam and bang my truck around to go were it sould be able to gently walk it's way around.

I was also in similar situations to those you described with my 1500 and it got frustrating. I think my clutches may also have been going bad. I'll take the simple 44-45 any day!
 

Ken226

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I bought a set of 44-44 clutches on eBay for 30.00

Lightly used, but in like new condition. Just so I'd have a set, in case they're needed.

So far though, my 44-44 hasn't exhibited the behavior others have described.

Not sure if I'd call it rock crawling, but a few weeks ago I was on a rocky mountain road with a steep grade. Basketball size rocks.

Even with the rear wheels digging out rocks and spinning, the front wheels pulled me along just fine.

On a few occasions, with both rear wheels spinning, the left front wheel hanging in the air, the front right pulled the truck over.

The traction control engages quickly, applying brakes to the airborne wheel and the grounded wheel pulls the truck right along.

On occasion the right, and sometimes the left rear would spin. That when instantly gets brakes and the opposite pulls right along.

Oddly, for all the trouble everyone is having, mine seems to be working as intended.
 

chrisbh17

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I think a lot of the "issues" with it are not understanding exactly how it should work....not just on the owners side, but mostly on the dealer/FCAs side too.

SOMEONE there must know what correct operation is, but I honestly think dealers saying "normal behavior" is because they think it really IS normal behavior. They dont know enough to say its not working as intended. Add to the fact that its probably not easy for them to test it ("sorry, cant use 4 Lock or 4 Low on dry pavement") and the intended operation of 4-Auto seems to be a mystery, exactly how can we/they prove its not working correctly?

I still feel like mine ISN'T working correctly, but of course with no snow around here lately I cant even try to prove it to myself much less a dealer.

@Ken226 were you ever able to find out if other xfer case clutches would fit? and i think there is something to what you may have stated earlier: manufacturing tolerances within the clutch packs lead to better or worse operation of the t-case. Would be interesting to see how hard it is to determine if we get a "good" one or not.
 

Ken226

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No, I havnt bought a set of 44-05 plates yet to compare against my 44-44 spares.

From pictures, the frictions have the same number of exterior spline lugs. The steels have the same number and shape of internal spline lugs.

From specs I find online, it's clear that the 44-05 friction plates are thicker. Even if they did fit in the basket, fewer would fit. It would result in less gripping strength but s longer wear life per plate.

As mine is working great and handles everything I throw at it, except in reverse, I'm reluctant to start experimenting.

I own a small machine shop and would love to machine some shims or spacers, and see how much difference tightening the clutch plate clearances would make.
I
need a spare 44-44 transfer case to strip apart and experiment on .
 

chrisbh17

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Interesting...let us know if you ever try to make your own!

I wonder what FCA/dealer/RAM would have to say if you mentioned poor 4WD performance when in reverse. Will they just say its meant to go forward only? In my case, poor 4WD performance in reverse might actually be an issue....I regularly back into my yard with loads of dirt, rock, mulch and I have to hop a curb to do so.

On my old truck, 4WD was 4WD so the front wheels pushed more than the rear wheels turned....now Ill spin the rear wheels on my grass for a bit before the fronts engage? Hopefully it doesnt take too much toll on my yard.
 

6.7CumminsDrvr

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I know the 44-44 to 44-45 swap has the issue shifting back to 2wd once 4lo is selected but im curious if anyone tried swapping a BCM from an Outdoorsman or Rebel? Dosent the Tcase get the shift commands from the BCM?
 

meedom

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Bump for a good BW 44-44 debate and info!
 

LouM

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Bump for a good BW 44-44 debate and info!
There is no good debate on this case if you expect your truck to be able to work and have a 4wd system that actually locks in low traction conditions,
if you want to spin your rears and dig ruts and throw rocks then have the front axle kind of work it's the case for you.
This piece of junk case has made me walk at least once each winter because it could not make the driveway even with studded snow tires, my wifes chevy Equinox AWD walked right up when we had an ice storm, the worthless Ram took several tries and required totally disabling the traction control (the truck would simply stop when using traction control)
 

TruckNut

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Mine does what I bought it for. I back our 4000# trailer up a steep gravel drive in 4Lo and it’s perfect.
 

yillbs

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There is no good debate on this case if you expect your truck to be able to work and have a 4wd system that actually locks in low traction conditions,
if you want to spin your rears and dig ruts and throw rocks then have the front axle kind of work it's the case for you.
This piece of junk case has made me walk at least once each winter because it could not make the driveway even with studded snow tires, my wifes chevy Equinox AWD walked right up when we had an ice storm, the worthless Ram took several tries and required totally disabling the traction control (the truck would simply stop when using traction control)

you're angry because you don't know how to use it. User error doesn't make it junk. You just need to be educated on proper operation it sounds to me. Clearly, by the number of people saying it works, there is something wrong with yours, or you. Arguing that others are wrong about it working merely because of your bad experience is somewhat on the ignorant side.
 

LouM

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you're angry because you don't know how to use it. User error doesn't make it junk. You just need to be educated on proper operation it sounds to me. Clearly, by the number of people saying it works, there is something wrong with yours, or you. Arguing that others are wrong about it working merely because of your bad experience is somewhat on the ignorant side.

You are a pompous little *******,
I am disgusted with this transfer case because it does not have a true locking function.
As far as being educated on how to use a transfer case, I would expect that I have a multitude more experience driving and using 4wd then you ever will. I have owned, used and worked on and with many 4wd vehicles IH, Chevy, Ford, Toyota, Suzuki, Dodge, Jeep, and now Ram and this isn't including tractors and large trucks
 

Black W900

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You are a pompous little *******,
I am disgusted with this transfer case because it does not have a true locking function.
As far as being educated on how to use a transfer case, I would expect that I have a multitude more experience driving and using 4wd then you ever will. I have owned, used and worked on and with many 4wd vehicles IH, Chevy, Ford, Toyota, Suzuki, Dodge, Jeep, and now Ram and this isn't including tractors and large trucks


If you have so much experience with these thing, you should be aware of the limitations of this system and what it is and isn't capable of.
My truck has it and it works just fine for the average guys 4wd needs.

Is it full locking?
No.
Does that really matter?
No.
Is it worth getting your panties in a *** and being an insulting putz?
No.
 

yillbs

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You are a pompous little *******,
I am disgusted with this transfer case because it does not have a true locking function.
As far as being educated on how to use a transfer case, I would expect that I have a multitude more experience driving and using 4wd then you ever will. I have owned, used and worked on and with many 4wd vehicles IH, Chevy, Ford, Toyota, Suzuki, Dodge, Jeep, and now Ram and this isn't including tractors and large trucks

If you're the idiot that paid 30,40 or possibly 50k for something and didn't know how it worked before hand, then that's on you. There isn't a single situation where the transfer case would not spin at least two tires. If you're getting traction control, put it on 4lock that's why it exists, to keep traction co tell at bay. If you're in 4lo and the truck doesn't spin any tires and revvs the motor, then you're ***** broke, go to the dealer.

Many people genuinely have issues that need to be corrected. We already know Chrysler is stupid, so show them it's broken, stand your ground. The dealer needs to prove to you it's normal. Find one of their demo 4wd trucks and have them show you it's normal. Don't be so passive. It's a light duty case but actually quite a nice little piece of engineering.
 

chrisbh17

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The only "issue" Ive had with it is in reverse (as expected). I back into my yard occasionally by hopping the curb while backing up. If I dont do it in a smooth motion (which I usually dont because I dont want to slam into the curb at speed), with the rear wheels on the grass past the curb and the front wheels still on the pavement, the time it takes to spin the rears and get 4WD to kick in *does* cause some ruts in my yard.

I was worried it would happen when Ken broke down the mechanics and operation of this xfer case, but aside from that Ive had no issues.

I think the biggest key is NOT to back off once the wheels spin. I think its natural to do so, especially for those of us coming from traditional xfer cases, but in the case (pun) of the 44-44, backing off throttle when the wheels spin just "resets" how long it will take to kick 4WD on. If we "power through it" so to speak, 4WD should kick in and seems to work well once it does.
 

Ken226

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I've had a few occasions to use mine since I last posted.

In deep mud a couple times, it worked as well as any other transfer case.

Once, at the river I nearly got stuck in a hundred yard mud bog. I managed to keep it moving and get out.

Despite the traction control trying desperately to keep the wheels from spinning, I managed to sling mud up the doors, onto the roof and totally encased the mirrors in thick black **** stinking mud.

The transfer case works fine though.

The only time I ever notice any slip between the front and rear wheels seems to be when the traction control starts kicking in.

It's never much though. Maybe 1/2 a turn, a full turn at most.

But I did by a replacement transfer case clutch pack, basket and rotor/stator plates just in case mine ever starts acting like Lou's.
 

ColdCase

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Its been discussed hundreds of times here and there are some members with wild and crazy ideas, get kinda emotional about it. It is a very good transfer case for elliminating operator error that can damage the drive train (RAM can then cheat on drivetrain robustness). But there is performance compromises, life is full of compromise.

There are certainly those that are happy and those that are not and are vocal about it. The transfer case has production variances that makes it generally useful as a mall cruiser, but often deficient as a working truck transfer case. There are some that seem to have gotten a good one, and RAM seems to have changed preload specs over the years. So newer years may function better than early ones.

Those that blame the customer for lack of research are full of themselves. Even with a ton of research, until recently few were aware of the compromises within this transfer case and they weren’t telling. RAM hid it well. Even today its far too easy to be duped. You can't blame lack of research, you could blame RAM for marketing with misleading information, perhaps because they think that it would hurt sales.

There are a heck of a lot of folks smarter than me that were duped by RAM's sly marketing. Some don't know it yet. The button says 4WD lock, and just about every other 4WD system locks in 4WD, my Jeeps do, my 2006, 2001,1994 RAMs all did. This one doesn’t even lock in 4WD low! It wasn't until discussions like this surfaced that many found out they were duped, not that I'm bitter. I spent extra for an auto case so I wouldn't worry about the spouse driving around the mall parking lot in 4WD and damaging something, while still having a lock under my command, same as our Jeeps. Its the kind of tool I thought I was buying... but no...

We have learned to live with it. In hazardous weather, I just park the RAM. If I want to tear up the yard or be embarrassed at the boat launch, we use the RAM. :)

I exaggerate of course. The compromise controversy is if you can live with a bit of wheel spin or would you rather not and not worry about burning up clutches. Some of us got around well with the open dif rear drive front heavy cars of the early 60s, mostly by being careful with wheel spin (a skill) and using the right tire. Tire rotation slip (spin) and you lose the stiction advantage of that tire. Most of the time that doesn't matter, but sometimes it does.
 
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homeguy

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If you want a true 4x4 get lockers. Otherwise you only have a 2 wheel drive when the truck it loosing traction


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ColdCase

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Yeah my jeep has automatic rear lockers with variable slip (0 to 100% open). It would be nice to have the same system in a RAM.
 

6.7CumminsDrvr

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Selectable rear locker is an option on the new Ram..........little late to the party but a step in the right direction.

Only hope they apply this type approach to the new HD’s and an “off road” package.
 
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