LED Light Bars, "fog lights" or HID-lite, to improve crappy lo-beam illumination?

[I know this post is long, but I believe if I provide as much info as possible, you guys will be able to give the most applicable suggestions.]


2014 Tradesman 2500.... Got it Monday before last. Super basic, all the options were geared to towing. I have no idea if my headlights are quads, halo(gen?)s, duals, projectors (or even if those are terms applied to headlights). I live in the county: winding and hilly 2-lane undivided highways with no shoulders, no street lights, (Farm-to-Markets for my fellow Texans)... 9 miles from the nearest "town", 25 miles from a county-seat. My only complaint about this truck so far is that forward low-beam lighting sucks. Harsh top cut off, poor spread and weak lower illumination... like I'd imagine the view thru a Sherman tank periscope would look. The top cut-off is especially bad when nearing the bottom of a downhill stretch, or when approaching an uphill section. It also seems like lo-beam throws only 50 yards, while hi-beams throw past 100yds; if an oncoming car is at 99yds, there's a 49yd gap of darkeness beyond my low-beam range. I'd like to soften the top cut-off so I can get a deer's eyes to glow farther out ahead of me (like in that 50yd dark zone), and also get more light into the edges/ditches. When I turn from one county road to another, I pretty much can't see the road I'm turning onto and have to guess... that's not the contingency I was planning for when I got 4WD.

Obviously, I need to improve my lighting, but that is where my certainty ends. There seem to be so many options, none of them 100%, and thus I'm baffled. I'd prefer not to cut & drill metal, and have minimal wiring mods (plug-n-play harness adaptor plugs are good). I like the look of curved light bar and think it would fit nicely in the bumper slot between the tow-hooks (see Installed 42" curved led light bar in 2014 sport bumper - DODGE RAM FORUM - Dodge Truck Forums ). Maybe if I get a "spot only" version (if available) and aim it downward a bit to keep from blinding other drivers?

It might be nice if I could wire them into the low-beam circuit. But best of all would be wiring it to the parking light circuit (so they are kinda like DRLs, plus enhanced nite illumination under both hi- & lo-beams).

Would I do better to get a couple like this and mount them pointing outward-ish?
SLIM2X18W Spot LED Work ATV 4x4 Offroad Light Fog Driving Bar CREE Truck SUV Car | eBay

Or, am I totally missing another option? Is there a better more cost effective way of improving my low-beam lighting without a bunch of fabrication and rewiring? What's the story on this?
Retroshop HID Headlights/Foglights install photos. - DODGE RAM FORUM - Dodge Truck Forums I'd like to keep it under $500, so $2K HIDs are out. But there might be some aftermarket drop-in replacement headlight modules that might solve my problem?


-- Needing more throw and dispersion, without blinding oncoming traffic


P.S. This truck is not for show but for work. So I don't need glamor, but I don't want ghetto look either.

P.P.S. I'm going to need some rear illumination too... kinda hard to back into a spot between the trees. But that will be a separate post.

Why don't you just swap out your factory headlamp bulbs for Silvania Silverstar? Plenty bright enough. The Ultras are supposed to go farther and brighter but honestly I didn';t see a difference between them. Since you have quads, it's a matter of changing 6 bulbs (the quad headlights and the fog lamps).

This is what you're looking for.


AutoZone.com Enlarged Image

Here is a thread I posted a long time ago. It should help you.


http://www.ramforum.com/f75/headlight_bulb_change-22053/

Drop in hids make a good difference and your not limited to their usage like you are with a led bar, id honestly seriously consider a hid projector retrofit, did one on my wifes car and it almost embarasses my truck with factory projectors with drop in hids and a 20" led bar, projector retrofit worth every penny and legal to drive with unlike led bars


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Birddog said:

Here is a thread I posted a long time ago. It should help you.

http://www.ramforum.com/f75/headlight_bulb_change-22053/

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Good god! What happened to simply reaching behind the housing, turning the bulb flange 45degrees and pulling it out? Great write up! Did the silverstars also add dispersion? I see they are brighter.

iam_canadian22 said:

Drop in hids make a good difference and your not limited to their usage like you are with a led bar, id honestly seriously consider a hid projector retrofit, did one on my wifes car and it almost embarasses my truck with factory projectors with drop in hids and a 20" led bar, projector retrofit worth every penny and legal to drive with unlike led bars

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Click to expand...

Sorry if I seem dense here, but can you point me at an example of a "drop-in HID" for my truck? I've looked at JJ's Retroshop stuff and my eyes glaze over with all the variations: TYC, Canibus, RGB auroras, mikimotos, FXRSs....

For the price the Silverstars are not worth it, IMO.

HIDs are definitely the answer sir..... I have 6000K in my factory projectors and fog lights. The set I bought had the CANBUS ballasts, which are essentially plug and play. And they work fantastically.

Here is a pic of mine shining on a fairly dark street before I got into the neighborhood. This was with the fogs and the headlights. You can see the projector cutoff pretty well on the fence to the right.

you can mount a 20 or 30 inch light bar in between your tow hooks on the 2500. if you go with an amazon opt7 light bar you would be looking at about 200 bucks with brackets.

A 30" LED bar would definitely do the trick!

I actually ordered a 20" for behind the grill. I am installing it tomorrow (Friday).

I will post a thread when I am done.......

plarkinjr said:

Good god! What happened to simply reaching behind the housing, turning the bulb flange 45degrees and pulling it out? Great write up! Did the silverstars also add dispersion? I see they are brighter.



Sorry if I seem dense here, but can you point me at an example of a "drop-in HID" for my truck? I've looked at JJ's Retroshop stuff and my eyes glaze over with all the variations: TYC, Canibus, RGB auroras, mikimotos, FXRSs....

Click to expand...

Dont know how to post a link from my phone lol, on his website under the hid, led section second page you'll find the quads like i pictured, chose the canbus adapters for simple plug and play,


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Birddog said:

Why don't you just swap out your factory headlamp bulbs for Silvania Silverstar? Plenty bright enough. The Ultras are supposed to go farther and brighter but honestly I didn';t see a difference between them. Since you have quads, it's a matter of changing 6 bulbs (the quad headlights and the fog lamps).

This is what you're looking for.


AutoZone.com Enlarged Image

Click to expand...

The big problem with Silverstars is that they don't last.
You're constantly changing bulbs and they're expensive to boot.

I've been looking into lighting options as well and may go with retroshop as someone else mentioned.
Before I do anything I'll get a price on some factory projectors, but I'm guessing they aren't cheap.

plarkinjr said:

Good god! What happened to simply reaching behind the housing, turning the bulb flange 45degrees and pulling it out? Great write up! Did the silverstars also add dispersion? I see they are brighter.

Click to expand...

Yes, they add dispersion as well as distance. I tried the Ultras which are also by Silvania and they are slightly brighter. IMO they aren't worth the extra money you're spending but the Silverstars are. It's a hotter bulb so they don't last as long as stock bulbs but they still last quite a long time. I've used HIDs before and while they are brighter, they are also more expensive and they still burn out. You also run the risk of getting a moving infraction if a cop knows how to argue his case. DOT housings are not designed to hold HIDs. It throws the light up as does your high beam, which you know is illegal to operate approaching traffic. For this reason Jeremy at Retro sells the Marimoto lenses. These provide a cut off so the light dispersion is not in the eyes of oncoming traffic. Back to square one... The Silverstars are a good buy for your money. If you have $400-500 to get them done correctly, I would suggest Jeremy's 55 watt HID with retro fitted housings and the HID Marimoto lenses. You can't go wrong.

I don't recommend using a LED light bar to supplement low beam light. As Birddog said as well, don't put HIDs in a reflector housing (what quads and duals are). The reason for both of these is they suck for the person in front of you and the one coming at you. If you want HID easiest route is fine a projector housing and HID kit. JJ can hook you up with this. If you want ultimate light have him swap out the OEM projector for a FXR projector. This will be the best low beam set up you can get in my opinion. It will set you back a pretty penny though.

iam_canadian22 said:

View attachment 38470
Dont know how to post a link from my phone lol, on his website under the hid, led section second page you'll find the quads like i pictured, chose the canbus adapters for simple plug and play,


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Click to expand...

OK, so if I'm reading you right, and the site right....
namely 2013+ Dodge Ram HIDs

and assuming I have quads (means separate bulbs for HI and LO, right?), then I can put HID into my existing housings (no projectors?) for as little as $155 for LO and $155 for HI, meaning $310 for the full set. But if I'm spending the coin, I'd drop in another $20 for 50W over 35W.... I can do that. Is that for real????

And why would I want to spend an extra $30 for the MOPAR harness?

Then I can later put the mondo curved LED bar in for hi-enhancement.... or something else if I end up with bull-bars/brush-guards.

P.S. I ordered CREE replacements for reverse and cargo lights from retro-solutions.com Seems easy enough on the reverse.

I don't have a 4th gen but I agree that a drop in hid kit from retroshop is the way to go. I ran silver stars for a while and the difference is night and day.

I wouldn't bother putting an HID drop in kit in a non-projector housing,
too much light scatter that blinds oncoming traffic unless you adjust the aim really low.
HID bulbs just don't belong in a reflector bowl (IMHO)

that kind of upgrade gives HID's a bad rap (AKA douche-bag HID)

the key to awesome output is a nice clean cut-off from an aftermarket projector retro fit

FX-R FTW!!!



Stock 13+ projectors are okay at best,
but nothing beats a dedicated Morimoto retrofit

0212353 said:

Few shots of the OEM Haloegen projectors vs OEM with HID vs FXR with HID

And yes......you can't see the FULL width. I'm in the basement, its raining, and not dark out. But, gives you an idea....

And - yup....camera was set on the SAME settings, pics were cropped, but no editing done to them.


OEM Halogen closeup

OEM projector, HID'd (drop in kit) - close up

FXR Retrofit, HID'd, close up

OEM Halogen

OEM projector, HID'd (drop in kit)

FXR Retrofit, HID'd

Click to expand...

BlackRamHemi said:

I wouldn't bother putting an HID drop in kit in a non-projector housing,
too much light scatter that blinds oncoming traffic unless you adjust the aim really low.
HID bulbs just don't belong in a reflector bowl (IMHO)

that kind of upgrade gives HID's a bad rap (AKA douche-bag HID)

the key to awesome output is a nice clean cut-off from an aftermarket projector retro fit (emphasis added)

FX-R FTW!!!

[image]

Stock 13+ projectors are okay at best,
but nothing beats a dedicated Morimoto retrofit

Click to expand...

OK, again forgive my ignorance, but why are (some of) you guys so impressed by cutoff? With my OEM halogens, the cutoff is bad enough! Look thru binoculars at the horizon. Awesome image, right? Now, without moving your head or the binos, try to look at that airplane flying overhead. Fail. That's what my cutoff is like when I'm approaching a hill... not until the truck begins upslope can I see anything in the road beyond where the upslope begins. Why do I want MORE of that? Seems like scatter is a GOOD thing, aside from blinding other drivers. My '98 Dakota doesn't have any discernible cutoff and other drivers don't seem to mind.

Maybe I'm best to limit the lo-beam drop-ins in my OEM bowls to 35W lows, and go for 50W on the highs? Both would still make my OEM halogens look like lanterns, right?

If I went with say Retro Shops drop-in, could I later upgrade to projectors and reuse the investment in drop-ins?

And whats a Morimoto vs FX-R? I thought they were both types of projectors. Your post seems to indicate they work together. And "TYC" is an exact replica of OEM projectors, if I'm not mistaken, right?

You cant just add more light without blinding on coming drivers...its actually illegal
and HID users typically get a bad rap when it's not done by a professional installation/aiming.




This is what a good cut off does to minimize blinding anyone coming towards you...




Have you seen this video Jeremy posted on youtube?
RetroShop.us - 2010 Ram with '13 Ram Heads / FX-R retrofit, 50W Ballasts, Osram CBI bulbs - YouTube

The cut off shield built into a projector is controlled by a solenoid
You don't have to have it on all the time, its just to keep the light on the road directly in front of you
and out of oncoming traffic eyes.

You can adjust the height of line of the cut off with the aim adjuster to any height you want.
Most recommend it be placed just below the side mirror of a car 25' in front of you.

Bi-Xenon Projectors operate in two modes (Bi)

Technology: How a bixenon headlight projector works with a quick lights-on demo - YouTube

Cut-Off shield on (fence distance just over 120') Low Mode


Cut-Off shield off (Hi Mode)



Reflector lamp


Projector lamp


Morimoto makes many projectors, the FX-R 3" is just the model preferred for the new 13+ Projector lamps

The Retrofit Source | Innovative Headlight Upgrades

The kit is not that expensive, biggest part of the cost is the retro fit itself
because the lights have to be heated to release the sealant before they are carefully disassembled



once the Morimoto projector is installed the lamp has to be re-assembled and re-sealed.

If you wanted HID's for your reflector lamps Hi and Low,
you would need 4 bulbs and 4 ballasts, 4 canbus adapters (or 2 relay wiring harnesses).
($310)

With a projector you only need 1 HID kit that works as a high and low beam.
You dont have to upgrade to 13+ projector with HID upgrade ($780)

Jeremy can also retro fit your quad with a Morimoto mini (2.5") projector with HID kit for $550
(add $200 if you want him to supply TYC quads and you keep yours)

Yes TYC makes oem replicas of projector, fogs, quads and tail lights.

BlackRamHemi said:

(lots of good info deleted)

Reflector lamp


Projector lamp


Morimoto makes many projectors, the FX-R 3" is just the model preferred for the new 13+ Projector lamps

The Retrofit Source | Innovative Headlight Upgrades

...

If you wanted HID's for your reflector lamps Hi and Low,
you would need 4 bulbs and 4 ballasts, 4 canbus adapters (or 2 relay wiring harnesses).
($310)

With a projector you only need 1 HID kit that works as a high and low beam.
You dont have to upgrade to 13+ projector with HID upgrade ($780)

Jeremy can also retro fit your quad with a Morimoto mini (2.5") projector with HID kit for $550
(add $200 if you want him to supply TYC quads and you keep yours)

Yes TYC makes oem replicas of projector, fogs, quads and tail lights.

Click to expand...

This was a great post, and it's all coming into "focus" (if you will)....
The graphics above where it compares the light beams... I believe it has finally clicked: With reflectors, the "beam" gets lower as distance increases (sort of like the ballistic curve of a rifle bullet). But with the projectors, the beam doesnt drop with distance (or at least not as much) because the lens is still putting the central portion of the beam while the shutter is chopping off the stuff that would normally "leak" upward.

But still, if you look between time marks 0:20 and 0:30 on Jeremy's drive-demo video, you'll see that box of darkness come down as he drives down. It is so weird and annoying. I guess I'll just have to get used to that.

So, about the $780 3" set vs the $550 2.5" set.... are folks generally happy with the less expensive one? I kind of prefer the look of the chrome reflectors left behind in the 2.5" quad set.
And I can put the extra $200 into an LED bar to get even more spread into the ditches.

Would you say the 2.5 quad is 300% better than what I have while the 3" set is maybe 400% improvement?

Thanks again for an excellent explanation with "charts and graphs" to illustrate it correctly.

A Morimoto Mini H1 Retro Fit in your quad would outperform a stock 13+ Ram Projector with HID drop in kit*.

and cost less doing it.

Remember you also need a $110 adapter if you swap your quad for a 13+ PJ lamp.

The 3" FX-R will not fit into a quad housing,
But it would be the best output of all options, but only for a 13+ Projector
...and now you're into it for almost $1400 (with adapter)

*Stock Ram +13' projector was designed for a halogen bulb,
the lens is not optically clear, slight purple tint, so the cut-off is slightly obscure/blurred.
an HID bulb in that pj will be better than the stock halogen bulb it comes with factory,
but no where as good as the FX-R, that's the top dog and appropriately the most money.


Sounds like this is your Best option for what you're looking for:



The price is $200 less if you send JJ your lights

plarkinjr said:

OK, so if I'm reading you right, and the site right....

namely 2013+ Dodge Ram HIDs



and assuming I have quads (means separate bulbs for HI and LO, right?), then I can put HID into my existing housings (no projectors?) for as little as $155 for LO and $155 for HI, meaning $310 for the full set. But if I'm spending the coin, I'd drop in another $20 for 50W over 35W.... I can do that. Is that for real????



And why would I want to spend an extra $30 for the MOPAR harness?



Then I can later put the mondo curved LED bar in for hi-enhancement.... or something else if I end up with bull-bars/brush-guards.



P.S. I ordered CREE replacements for reverse and cargo lights from retro-solutions.com Seems easy enough on the reverse.

Click to expand...

If you chose to go drop in you want yo select the one for quads not the one listed 13+(those are just the stock projector models), i do highly recommend spending the extra for a projector upgrade like the mini h1, awesome performance and light output is amazing


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