Manual Swap Planning

Hey Everybody,

I have lurked around this board forever, and am needing some help. My truck is a 2014 Express, RCSB, 2wd, Hemi, with a 65RFE and 3.92's. My plan when I bought the truck (admittedly before doing any research or I most likely would have ended up with a Chev - their aftermarket is just so much larger it seems), was lowered, with a blower and a 6 speed stick swap.

I love the torque PD blowers make, and after doing a ton of research I don't think there is a way that will make both me and a 65RFE happy with a TVS2300 on the Hemi. I have heard L and M can build a great tranny, but I'm not really into the whole lift to shift, down shifting manually to pass on the highway etc. It just seems like a bandaid.

I love driving standards, and would like to put a T-56 in the truck. Weight would be similar enough to the heavy Challengers that I don't think the gear ratios would be and issue, and I may go to 4.56's anyway. I need help with the technical stuff. I know I am looking at:

-tranny (really a takeaway from any 5.7 R/T should bolt up as far as I can tell) Stock tunnel should be fine, hole in floor for shifter no biggie
-Crossmember
- Driveshaft
-Clutch pedal assembly, and secondary clutch fluid master and line
- 8 Speed steering column covers to remove column shift

That stuffs straight forward. I'm worried about the tuning. Will the ECM/PCM freak out? Can you tune the auto inputs out, and the t-56 inputs in to retain stock speedometer?

I don't believe this swap has been done on a 4th gen, why is that?

Appreciate any input, hoping to make this informative for anyone who wants the same swap.

Thanks!
Pat

Yes the ECM/PCM will freak out and will not be getting signals it needs to operate, also speedo and other stuff like this.

The hard part to all of this is there are no manual options for a gas 5.7L ram with a manual trans so is not just a simple retune process from OEM data.
I have been looking here and there for info and doing a little research but I haven't gotten far on the tuning portion but the hard parts to do the swap and easiest way I can think of is to use SRT-10 parts, tranny etc etc, but I am still not sure about the sensors on the trans and you will need a custom bellhousing or adapter and also a custom pressure plate to fit the V10 clutch.

All in all there is no easy answer or know way that I have found yet for a gas half ton conversion and tuning.

I don't see why we can't make our trucks think they're a 6spd Challenger.
Need to switch from our tone ring speedo sensor to the tailshaft of the Chally's TR-6060. You also got switch to the starter to fit it to the passenger side, then you might get into fitment issues with the exhaust.

Thanks guys, this is a start. R/T, have you actually looked into the tuning capability for the ECM/PCM? Or swapping the computer over form a 6speed hemi car? The SRT-10 conversion is interesting but seems needlessly complicated. I can't imagine a 3 gen Viper computer having much in common with a 4 gen truck. The T-56 or TR 6060 would be bolt on mechanically with the right parts.

The starter I didn't know was on the other side, that's interesting. If a change was required though that's just wiring and exhaust fab, no biggie.

There are a ton of guys that are dumping 6 speed combos into older cars. What are they doing that we can't? I think I'll start looking into this. I mean worst case scenario, couldn't we run a standalone ECU, and cut out the PCM portion? Run a Racepak or aftermarket gauges for a cluster. Unless it's something I am totally unfamiliar with, all the creature comforts of the interior are off a BCM anyway right? I know if you have the cash Arlington can put an NAG-1 in now and run just like factory so this can't just be impossible.

performancetrucks.net has a massive collection of GM data, is there a resource like that available for the Hemi community that I haven't found yet? Like I said I am new to heavy Mopar modding, but I really like this truck and don't want to give up on it yet.

I have done a 6speed swap on a 07 CTD G56 to 48re and vise versa.... it was a pain in the ass and we ended having to get a stand alone controller for the manual to auto cause all the tuning failed.
As for tuning i have mot personally talk to someone like sean or jay to get their input yet, im trying to see of all the hard parts can even work before i feeel the need to waste someones time on figuring out tuning. From my research so far and going off experience with the CTD swap having parameters to work with will make it easier if not the only way possible imo. Im no expert but just going off what i have done amd research so far and it doesnt look promising.
I have talked to some about the challenger as a donor and that seems like a visble option but the shifter will need to be worked into the equation and that is where the srt10 can come into play for pedal assembly with clutch resevoir.
As for getting the ram to think its a challenger wont work if you want to keep smog into play and i am also not sure how all the computers would interface into the equation since its more than just the ecm/fcm thst come into play.
You could theoretically swap a whole system down to the radio out of a challenger but by that point the cost is so crazy its not worth it, you could design a titanium auto trans for the cost....
All in all im skeptical of it actually working andvwill take a skilled shop to beable to pull it off. But at the same time anything is posdible with enough time and $$$

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R/T_Fire said:

I have done a 6speed swap on a 07 CTD G56 to 48re and vise versa.... it was a pain in the ass and we ended having to get a stand alone controller for the manual to auto cause all the tuning failed.
As for tuning i have mot personally talk to someone like sean or jay to get their input yet, im trying to see of all the hard parts can even work before i feeel the need to waste someones time on figuring out tuning. From my research so far and going off experience with the CTD swap having parameters to work with will make it easier if not the only way possible imo. Im no expert but just going off what i have done amd research so far and it doesnt look promising.
I have talked to some about the challenger as a donor and that seems like a visble option but the shifter will need to be worked into the equation and that is where the srt10 can come into play for pedal assembly with clutch resevoir.
As for getting the ram to think its a challenger wont work if you want to keep smog into play and i am also not sure how all the computers would interface into the equation since its more than just the ecm/fcm thst come into play.
You could theoretically swap a whole system down to the radio out of a challenger but by that point the cost is so crazy its not worth it, you could design a titanium auto trans for the cost....
All in all im skeptical of it actually working andvwill take a skilled shop to beable to pull it off. But at the same time anything is posdible with enough time and $$$

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

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I do ok, nothing too crazy, just an Air Traffic Controller in Canada.

I've been looking into the TR-6060 swap kits you can get right from Tremec for a Hemi, and I think that the hard parts are the easiest part of the swap. Hemi designed clutch assembly, custom mounted hydraulic clutch pedal assembly, custom drive shaft, etc. I think $4000-6000 would have everything in.

I still can't find any good answers for tuning though. I think this : https://www.summitracing.com/int/parts/dak-sgi-5/overview/ could probably be used to tune the new tranny's speedo output signal to allow it to get pinned into the factory harness, however I'm still not sure how that would tie into the TC/ABS system which is a problem. We don't have smog testing up here where I am so that doesn't worry me.

I've been leafing through a lot more stick shift GM building on performancetrucks.net, and have come across a few who have pulled all the factory wiring and remade the harnesses themselves as simply as possible. Basic sensors to allow the engine to run on a tuned ECU, no PCM, speedo signal from a speedo healer (so I actually think the stock cluster should stay as OEM pretty easily). TC/ABS system delete (summer driven only so not really worried about it). Heater controls in my Express are the separate knobs so that system doesn't change.

It would be incredibly time consuming, but if someone can tune a hemi dropped into an old Mopar I don't see why this couldn't be done. I'm thinking though of dropping th 6 speed sway for a year, and running a low boost D1SC plus tranny cooler next summer and babying that. Run that for as long as it lasts - which if Moe's racetruck is anything to go by that might be a long time if treated properly - and slowly start acquiring hard parts. It would be nice if someone else wanted to attempt this at the same time with other input to bounce back and forth and work together - any takers?

Raven said:

I do ok, nothing too crazy, just an Air Traffic Controller in Canada.

I've been looking into the TR-6060 swap kits you can get right from Tremec for a Hemi, and I think that the hard parts are the easiest part of the swap. Hemi designed clutch assembly, custom mounted hydraulic clutch pedal assembly, custom drive shaft, etc. I think $4000-6000 would have everything in.

I still can't find any good answers for tuning though. I think this : https://www.summitracing.com/int/parts/dak-sgi-5/overview/ could probably be used to tune the new tranny's speedo output signal to allow it to get pinned into the factory harness, however I'm still not sure how that would tie into the TC/ABS system which is a problem. We don't have smog testing up here where I am so that doesn't worry me.

I've been leafing through a lot more stick shift GM building on performancetrucks.net, and have come across a few who have pulled all the factory wiring and remade the harnesses themselves as simply as possible. Basic sensors to allow the engine to run on a tuned ECU, no PCM, speedo signal from a speedo healer (so I actually think the stock cluster should stay as OEM pretty easily). TC/ABS system delete (summer driven only so not really worried about it). Heater controls in my Express are the separate knobs so that system doesn't change.

and slowly start acquiring hard parts. It would be nice if someone else wanted to attempt this at the same time with other input to bounce back and forth and work together - any takers?

Click to expand...

I figured that would be about the cost also, maybe a little more. But I am still unsure on the tuning also, you could get it to run like an old hotrod conversion but in most cases those are very basic systems and dont use all that are in the truck like the EVIC, ABS, security, even down to the stereo, that is where things get complicated. in many cases these systems are abandoned and or stripped out of the tune somehow or faked that they are there.
Me personally want it to be as if it came of the production line. I haven't had time to look into it but I have wondered about a stand alone controlled used alot in pulling trucks trans swaps but do it for a manual, but again comes in the tuning on what parameters to even use since there is nothing to follow. I have heard of 6.4L equipped g56 trans trucks, if this is the case that may be a base line to get tuning from to make the hard parts to work like they should like it was designed that way.

I am interested in doing this myself and want to look into some of your parts to see if they will be easier than my brainstorming. but I'm no where close to starting this project but will and will keep researching and watching what you are doing and figure out.

fwiw I emailed B&G Performance and they think they can recalibrate my auto PCM to stay out of limp mode with a manual trans. They can't guarantee no constant CEL though. I'm going to try putting a G56 from a '06 2500 in my '11 2500. Mechanically it'll be cake. I can even use factory interior trim pieces from a CTD truck.