Synthetic Oil

Oil of Choice

  • Castrol Syntec/Edge

    Votes: 236 8.5%
  • Royal Purple

    Votes: 327 11.8%
  • AMSOil

    Votes: 400 14.4%
  • Valvoline Synpower

    Votes: 160 5.8%
  • Mobil 1

    Votes: 994 35.8%
  • Other

    Votes: 662 23.8%

  • Total voters
    2,779

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Nutshell

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It just goes to show how are motors are so individual while all being Hemi's. While one may love PP, another hates it and runs great on Mobil 1.

Go figure. My current combo is working great and that was after much trial and error.
 
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raven3

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Maybe the CU wear (151 ppm) on the two year 5k OCI < CU wear (188 ppm) on the one year 5 k OCI ,
because as the engine wears from usage, the bearing wear rate decreases.

The high CU concentration could be a result of using a Polyolester(POE) type base oil.
Understand this type of oil is highly hydroscopic and aborbs water from atmospheric water vapor.
When this POE absorbs water the oil becomes acidic. This acid is a different type of acid that is created from combustion products
and is neutralized by the calcium additive, bottle of TUMS anti acid tablets.

The POE acid would corrode the CU sleeve bearings.

The GF-5 spec has a sequence V111 test for measuring the corrosion rate on copper based bearings.
A small .7L single cylinder engine is run for 40 hours at 3150 rpm with143C oil temperature.
The bearing can not loose over 26 mg of CU weight to pass the test.

The uncertified GF-5 RL motor oil maybe not pass the sequence V111, ASTM D6709 corrosion test.

RL could be using some type of additive to reduce the hydroscopic affects of the POE base.
If not, the engine would have to be run to bring the oil over boiling temperature on a regular basis to help evaporate off the water.

The POE oil used in gas turbines do not have copper sleeve bearings.
The POE oil used in refrigeration compressors do not have copper bearings.

Would rather go with a POA oil for automotive application for about the same price, since $ Amsoil SS ~$ RL
Understand the polar properties of POE helps seal up the leaky lifters and is a trade off between copper bearing corrosion and a pounded up camshaft.

Sending off a 4k OCI sample of 5w20 PP today to Blackrock.
 

Burla

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Well I went out and took the filter apart, not very dirty. Then I figured it out. The difference was the fkin Cerma. Lol, there is zero doubt that is where the silicon came from, as that is what is says in the msds. I knew it was a mistake soon as I ordered it. Even smart guys can be suckers :) I will bet anyone ten bucks that will be down to similar numbers as first one next UOA. I've read many many Redline UOA's and there was nothing like this.
 
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Burla

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Maybe the CU wear (151 ppm) on the two year 5k OCI < CU wear (188 ppm) on the one year 5 k OCI ,
because as the engine wears from usage, the bearing wear rate decreases.

The high CU concentration could be a result of using a Polyolester(POE) type base oil.
Understand this type of oil is highly hydroscopic and aborbs water from atmospheric water vapor.
When this POE absorbs water the oil becomes acidic. This acid is a different type of acid that is created from combustion products
and is neutralized by the calcium additive, bottle of TUMS anti acid tablets.

The POE acid would corrode the CU sleeve bearings.

The GF-5 spec has a sequence V111 test for measuring the corrosion rate on copper based bearings.
A small .7L single cylinder engine is run for 40 hours at 3150 rpm with143C oil temperature.
The bearing can not loose over 26 mg of CU weight to pass the test.

The uncertified GF-5 RL motor oil maybe not pass the sequence V111, ASTM D6709 corrosion test.

RL could be using some type of additive to reduce the hydroscopic affects of the POE base.
If not, the engine would have to be run to bring the oil over boiling temperature on a regular basis to help evaporate off the water.

The POE oil used in gas turbines do not have copper sleeve bearings.
The POE oil used in refrigeration compressors do not have copper bearings.

Would rather go with a POA oil for automotive application for about the same price, since $ Amsoil SS ~$ RL
Understand the polar properties of POE helps seal up the leaky lifters and is a trade off between copper bearing corrosion and a pounded up camshaft.

Sending off a 4k OCI sample of 5w20 PP today to Blackrock.

Great points on paper, we think alike my friend. The fallacy to your argument is assuming you know the Redline time tested formula that has been formulated to minimize the negative effects of esters, I would now admit the base is not a majority esters. Then you have to ask what percentage of esters would you get all of the benefits without the risk, and that is their formulation my friend. Look at other UOA's. Also look at tech specs and testing, Redline does test off the charts in many areas, thus proving there is something different and desirable in that oil. And that oil was in my truck for two years, with zero water problem. So looking forward to your response, this is the type of conversation that leads to real answers. Challenge everything.


PAO has negative possibilities as well, just a thought Syn may disagree. But Amsoil has no regulations regarding how much PAO they have to put in their formula to call it synthetic, but the euro oils maybe do, they certainly used to have these regulations. Gives Amsoil an upper hand to mix their oils to minimize PAO negative effects. Here is one conversation at Bobs, PAO versus Ester.

Laymen breakdown of PAO versus Ester from LubesNGreases mag. Oct. 2010 Pg.44-45

Ability to withstand heat/oxidation. PAO:Good Ester:Good-Excellent

Hydrolytic stability. ie.water absorbs into the oil. PAO:Excellent Ester:poor

Additive solubility. PAO:poor Ester Excellent

Seal Swell. PAO: Poor Ester: Excellent

Vis. PAO: Excellent Ester:Excellent

Film Strength, PAO: Good Ester: Good

This is why Burla chose Esters over PAO, neither if perfect, but between the two I would opt for Ester. Look at the "poor" rating on esters and it is Hydrolytic stability (water), but look at my 2 year oci, no issue there. Water content 0.0 both UOA's.
 
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SyN

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No Burla: I agree with you 120%! I totally feel a 5.7L owner can do no better then Red Line Oil! Is it 100% a necessity? I don't believe so! That is totally up to the discretion of the owner... Especially with millions of 5.7L owners not using it-->And Not Having Any Issues...

If my Ram was the only auto I had to do maintenance on! I would use it in a heart beat! Since I have 2 kids in college and 4 auto too tend to... I have to find a Viscosity and Brand that I can use in all 4.... Does not make a dam lick of sense to have 3 different Viscositys and Brands sitting in the cabinet.. I am a stickler for space/time/cost efficiency!!!!

I am still researching and reading and asking thousands of questions trying to chose 1 brand and 3 viscositys of oil that I can use in my Ram/2 Ford Edges/F150.... & not spend $300!

I am almost settled on Castrol! I have just found out that the 0W-20 & 5W-20 contain a large amount of Esters... So I am looking into the 0W-20 for the 2 Edges!

My Ram & Sons F150 I am for sure going in the direction of 0W-40... My Ram I am on the fence with either blending it with Black Edge 0W-20 or the Notorious 0W-30...

Like I said above-->I would use Red Line 5W-30 in a heart beat...If my Ram was my only concern... I just can't justify using this Very Expensive oil... When there are so Many 5.7L out there running without it and have Zero Issues...Plus I just can't justify the cost of 7Qts-->When I put my kids first....

Nothing local even stocks these Viscositys!! So Amazon and Prime are my friend...

I could very easily stay with Pennzoil and use 5W-30 in both edges & Ram...But Pennzoil has Zero interest in beefing up their weak 0W-40 Version... Their Euro 0W-40 is Awesome but $70 for 6 qts!!! I will pass...

Only wish the Local WM would stock the PUP 0W-40! It would be worth buying just for the extra Moly/Zinc!

But with all that Crap Spewed out my A$$-->It is awesome hearing those Positive Results that are posted after switching to Red Line!
****************************************************************************************
Instead of making a new post I am editing this one... After a few hours on conversation with Gena on BITOG + a Few others & time to ponder on many of the issues with oil and this 5.7L...

I'm going to stick with PP 5W-30 and Add 3qts of PUP SRT 0W-40 every oil change.. Subscribed to PP 5W-30 on Amazon which makes a 5Qt jug $19.25... Gena assured me there would be Never an Issue with this combo... Mixing any of the PP or PUP viscositys will NOT cause any issues in the future within the motor...

We did discuss the Weakness of PUP 0W-40 and how far behind it is to its main competition-->M1/Castrol/Amsoil... She assured me the Pennzoil Team is working on this... With the SRT gaining more and more popularity as well as the Hellcat {They don't want to drop the ball on this oil}...0W-40 is gaining popularity like crazy...

I would like a bit more Phos & Zinc since these 2 work with the Moly as Anti-Wear additives... Would prefer at least 850 ppm of Phos & 1k ppm of Zinc but this is work in progress... Maybe Pennzoil will reformulate the SRT 0W-40 with more in the future... The 248 ppm of Moly will help... The 5W-30 I will be adding has 784 ppm of Phos & 875 ppm of Zinc so this is above average...
 
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Burla

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Paying for 2 kids college is moderately more important then running the best oil possible, I do admit that :)

Our close friends put their 3 kids through college, and were never able to buy a home because of this, despite them making real decent money. But in the end, home ownership isn't all it is cracked up to be, in comparison to assuring your children's future. Ok back to oil.
 

SyN

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Nut: Here is my honest opinion-->If an owner has plans on keeping his 5.7L for Many Years {Past the time of pay off}... And Can afford the Cost of Red Line!

I think it is a very wise investment! All the Positive Results are tough to ignore...

It is a Remarkably Robust Oil-->Worth the extra Cost! Especially for those owners that Tow medium heavy loads like myself during the summer months...{5Klb TT}-->Thus the reasoning for me wanting to incorporate 0W-40 into my OCI...

I think it deserves a bit of advertisement... LoL
 
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Nutshell

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Nut: Here is my honest opinion-->If an owner has plans on keeping his 5.7L for Many Years {Past the time of pay off}... And Can afford the Cost of Red Line!

I think it is a very wise investment! All the Positive Results are tough to ignore...

It is a Remarkably Robust Oil-->Worth the extra Cost!

I think it deserves a bit of advertisement... LoL!

I agree. I don't use it for reasons I don't wish to share as they would be challenged with opinions and "experience".

To each their own. I know this oils has quieted many Hemi's around here.
 

hemihustlin

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I agree. I don't use it for reasons I don't wish to share as they would be challenged with opinions and "experience".

To each their own. I know this oils has quieted many Hemi's around here.

You cant tease and not tell. If you have something pertinent to share then go for it nobodys gonna chew you out for your oil choice this is why we are here.
 

Burla

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Nutshell, I have been the biggest proponent of sharing all info good or bad and having a discussion without attacks. Prime example was a couple posts ago where Raven also said he didn't prefer Esters over PAO, and my response. IMO, all done with respect. So feel free to share what you would have against any oil and hash it out. If it is valuable info good or bad, it belongs here.
 

SyN

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I for one would really like to see a thread! Maybe this one... But a thread asking only a few very simple questions... Due to I am just curious what every member with a 4th generation is running in the way of Oil Brand/Viscosity/Filter/OCI/Miles on Engine...

5 Simple Questions
1. Oil Brand
2. Oil Viscosity
3. Oil Filter
4. Oil Change Interval ->OCI
5. Miles on Motor

But here is my stipulation!!!! This is the only information posted within each Post! I know this would be almost impossible due to the Typical A$$ Hats trying to judge members by posting questions Like-->
1. Why are you using that junk oil and filter...
2. Your OCI is to long...
3. That oil does not contain certain additives Your 5.7L is going to He!!....
Geez I could go on forever!

Just 5 simple questions where NO Member is Judged by their choices! If the Mods would help out and delete these judgmental posts as they are created would help...

Just One Post per member! I am always curious what others use! I feel if these judgmental posts were eliminated more members would actually visit and participate in these oil threads...

Yes I know it is an impossible request!
 
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R.L.K.

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Nut: Here is my honest opinion-->If an owner has plans on keeping his 5.7L for Many Years {Past the time of pay off}... And Can afford the Cost of Red Line!

I think it is a very wise investment! All the Positive Results are tough to ignore...

It is a Remarkably Robust Oil-->Worth the extra Cost! Especially for those owners that Tow medium heavy loads like myself during the summer months...{5Klb TT}-->Thus the reasoning for me wanting to incorporate 0W-40 into my OCI...

I think it deserves a bit of advertisement... LoL
Well , I do plan on keeping my truck for a very long time .
My last daily driver 275k / 17 yrs .

I have done my share of advertising here . The RL 5W -30 has served me & my 5.7L Hemi well .

Guilty as charged .

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R.L.K.

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I blame RLK, that's my story and I'm sticking to it. :hidesbehindsofa:
Me ? LOL ...

I'll take the blame buddy !

I don't always use the best oil on the market today in my Hemi .... But when I do its REDLINE !

I don't mind the extra expense , for me it's peace of mind .

I do lay partial blame on certin individuals here . And in this order :

1rst & 2nd place are tied @ this point (Syn & Burla ) Burla has an edge mainly because he's a huge RL fan , but Syn has a tremendous amount of great points and lately a lot of good things to say about RL.
3rd would be raven , very technical, and I do enjoy the reads , and his post .

Thanks guys I appreciate all the knowledge I've picked from Your brains and all the links provided by all 3 of you ! I have read countless hours on the links you all have provided and many many links those links have led me to .
I know more about not only oils but how and what's required to make a Hemi work , especially the top end .
Thanks again guys !

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R.L.K.

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@Syn i'll start this off
My oil brand , Viscosity, filter ,my oci & miles on my motor .

Redline
5W -30
Royal Purple 10-48
Approximately 8,000 miles
Now 30,870

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Burla

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We don't need to be rating oil guys bud, this thread is a catch all of good info and great oil guys and many brands. Lets keep that going with all due respect friend. As more UOA's and more experiences keep coming in, we are finding great stuff for our Hemi's. I keep an open mind as well, I have learned plenty and am very pleased at where this thread is going.
 

smiley

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Redline is too rich for my blood. I am going to keep doing 8-10k runs with PP and PUP and I'll see how I fair. I have switched to using the Royal Purple filters every time until I can no longer get them or something. I will also keep running 0W-20 sometimes 5W-20 and report back in 10 years. So far been very happy with the Hemi. Hoping to keep until at least 20 years but probably beyond as backup rig even when I upgrade.
 
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