To fix or not to fix!

stephenB · Sep 6, 2016

I've got a Dodge Ram 1500 conversion van by Legend that I've owned almost from new. With the passing of the years a few things have given out, but by and large the van has basically run pretty well and trouble free overall until last week. I was towing a trailer, coming back from the local tip, when smoke came pouring out of the engine compartment and the car died. Had it towed to our mechanic, who told us that the hose and fitting taking coolant to the engine had given way. He said if that was all we'd be okay, but it turns out the head gasket is done too - the quote to fix it up was $1800. Given the van's age I don't think it's worth, much as I have a fair bit of sentimental attachment to the vehicle - I only wish I was mechanically adept, because my understanding is that just about all of the expense is labor. You can't have everything though - I can just about rehab a house from top to bottom and inside and out, but where engine's are concerned I may know the theory, but in practical terms I don't know much at all.

Is the $1800 figure about right do you think, and what should I ask for it if we're going to junk it?

dapepper9 · Sep 6, 2016

I'm mostly curious if the headgasket is really bad. I don't trust mechanics though so. That 1800 quote is to pull the heads, replace the gaskets, bolt it back together. However, these heads are almost guaranteed to be cracked between the valve seats and the mechanic will now than likely tell you they're cracked and need replaced for about another 1500 probably. Granted these things run for years with those cracks with no noticeable difference but mechanics don't like to reuse them (i wouldn't on my own vehicle either but that's me).

I think you need a 2nd opinion or a better explanation. The vehicle would more than likely be overheating and you'd have coolant and oil mixing.

gofishn · Sep 6, 2016

stephenB said:
I've got a Dodge Ram 1500 conversion van by Legend that I've owned almost from new. With the passing of the years a few things have given out, but by and large the van has basically run pretty well and trouble free overall until last week. I was towing a trailer, coming back from the local tip, when smoke came pouring out of the engine compartment and the car died. Had it towed to our mechanic, who told us that the hose and fitting taking coolant to the engine had given way. He said if that was all we'd be okay, but it turns out the head gasket is done too - the quote to fix it up was $1800. Given the van's age I don't think it's worth, much as I have a fair bit of sentimental attachment to the vehicle - I only wish I was mechanically adept, because my understanding is that just about all of the expense is labor. You can't have everything though - I can just about rehab a house from top to bottom and inside and out, but where engine's are concerned I may know the theory, but in practical terms I don't know much at all.

Is the $1800 figure about right do you think, and what should I ask for it if we're going to junk it?

Sounds like a Year long project for your local high school shop class.
Talk to the teacher adn see if he is willing to take it on, for his kids to learn.

Thundervee · Sep 6, 2016

dapepper9 said:
I'm mostly curious if the headgasket is really bad. I don't trust mechanics though so. That 1800 quote is to pull the heads, replace the gaskets, bolt it back together. However, these heads are almost guaranteed to be cracked between the valve seats and the mechanic will now than likely tell you they're cracked and need replaced for about another 1500 probably. Granted these things run for years with those cracks with no noticeable difference but mechanics don't like to reuse them (i wouldn't on my own vehicle either but that's me).

I think you need a 2nd opinion or a better explanation. The vehicle would more than likely be overheating and you'd have coolant and oil mixing.

I agree, 99% chance the heads will be cracked between the valve seats on #7 and or #8 , if it was me I'd fix it.

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dudeman2009 · Sep 6, 2016

I only trust mechanics I know, as much as it sucks, there are some guys who will lie about how sever or possible something is, as an excuse to dive into it.

I'd go with Dapepper, get a second opinion, possibly see if they are willing to run a leakdown test for cheap, that will show any glaring issues. Or you could get an oil analysis done, most places charge between 30-50$ for each test, many places also do coolant testing. The tests will read just about everything about your oil and health of the engine.

They can detect bearing material, gasket flakes, metal shavings, how used the oil is, if its been kept up to date on the oil changes, if there is contamination from say coolant from a head gasket issue, how much compression byproduct is in your oil, etc. Its really cheap compared to what it tells you.

txcobowhunter · Sep 6, 2016

First of all, I'm not a mechanic so take it for what it's worth. I doubt you will be able to find a reliable vehicle that you know everything about for $1800.

sbarron · Sep 6, 2016

$1800 for engine work in a van is pretty reasonable. I would do as others have suggested and make sure you get diagnosed correctly though before throwing good money after bad. These heads are a known issue, but there are tests to run prior to removing the engine that will help with an accurate diagnosis.

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stephenB · Sep 8, 2016

Thanks to one and all for the helpful and informative responses. I guess I should add that there's a few other issues that have crept in over recent years that I've simply just learned to live with, given that the van ran fine engine wise and I wasn't too fussed, given the van's age. The automatic gear box has a little trick where it sometimes won't go into top gear as you're picking up speed, so I sometimes have to shove it down to second and back up again to make it work. The van has had an odd rattle for some time when I accelerate, and I was told this has something to do with the catalytic converter. The driver side window opener has ceased to function, which, together with the fact the AC is having issues, makes for some interesting driving in Central Florida's ****** heat during summer! So you can see, I'm also factoring in some other issues when it comes to assessing whether it's all worth it, much as I love the vehicle. I just use it exclusively for work these days, such as when I'm rehabbing a house and need to move my tools or materials around - day to day I use another vehicle.

You're right about mechanics - it just seems to get harder and harder to find an honest one. We've stuck with the current guy since he bought out the previous owner of the garage who we liked, but while he seemed pretty decent to begin with (anything that took only a few minutes to fix, like resetting on board systems when they triggered warning lights, he'd never charge for) of late we've noticed a tendency to try and BS us because I'm pretty open about my lack of knowledge on cars. The same van had issues with the turn signals at one point, and when I asked him what the issue was he told me there was some kind of electronic controller that would cost about $500 to $600 to repair - I did some homework on here and discovered that the issue was a simple flasher that cost far less to buy and install myself - problem solved. After he told us about the burned out engine the other day he offered to get rid of the van for us for scrap and "save us the trouble of having it towed home" by giving us $100 for it. I declined and drove it home. Don't think we'll be going back.

dodge dude94 · Sep 8, 2016

txcobowhunter said:
First of all, I'm not a mechanic so take it for what it's worth. I doubt you will be able to find a reliable vehicle that you know everything about for $1800.

^^Hit the nail right on the head.

If you can swing it, fix it. I always say one time repair is cheaper than a car payment AND you have a relationship with this van, IE, you know ALL it's history.

dudeman2009 · Sep 8, 2016

stephenB said:
Thanks to one and all for the helpful and informative responses. I guess I should add that there's a few other issues that have crept in over recent years that I've simply just learned to live with, given that the van ran fine engine wise and I wasn't too fussed, given the van's age. The automatic gear box has a little trick where it sometimes won't go into top gear as you're picking up speed, so I sometimes have to shove it down to second and back up again to make it work. The van has had an odd rattle for some time when I accelerate, and I was told this has something to do with the catalytic converter. The driver side window opener has ceased to function, which, together with the fact the AC is having issues, makes for some interesting driving in Central Florida's ****** heat during summer! So you can see, I'm also factoring in some other issues when it comes to assessing whether it's all worth it, much as I love the vehicle. I just use it exclusively for work these days, such as when I'm rehabbing a house and need to move my tools or materials around - day to day I use another vehicle.

You're right about mechanics - it just seems to get harder and harder to find an honest one. We've stuck with the current guy since he bought out the previous owner of the garage who we liked, but while he seemed pretty decent to begin with (anything that took only a few minutes to fix, like resetting on board systems when they triggered warning lights, he'd never charge for) of late we've noticed a tendency to try and BS us because I'm pretty open about my lack of knowledge on cars. The same van had issues with the turn signals at one point, and when I asked him what the issue was he told me there was some kind of electronic controller that would cost about $500 to $600 to repair - I did some homework on here and discovered that the issue was a simple flasher that cost far less to buy and install myself - problem solved. After he told us about the burned out engine the other day he offered to get rid of the van for us for scrap and "save us the trouble of having it towed home" by giving us $100 for it. I declined and drove it home. Don't think we'll be going back.

Some things like the window CAN be an easy fix, A/C not so much if you don't have some basic tools, like manifold pressure gauges (cant to anything A/C without them really, but they cost less than $100). The transmission probably just needs a fluid and filter change with a band adjustment, it seems like its only having problems sometimes, you might have caught it early. The rattling could be as simple as a loose heat shield, or it could be a bad cat. Does florida do emissions testing? As for the head, its not a complicated job, if you have the tools. Most likely you will be replacing both heads, some junkyards will pull heads off old cars and test them, but don't trust it. A machine shot will be able to repair most all the cracks in it, but if there are too many, it would just be cheaper to buy a new one. Few machine shops will treat poorly, most of those guys are honest people.

Either way you swing it, good luck.

To fix or not to fix!

stephenB

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dapepper9

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gofishn

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Thundervee

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dudeman2009

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txcobowhunter

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sbarron

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stephenB

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dodge dude94

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dudeman2009

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