5.2V5.9 or 318 vs 360

Disclaimer: Links on this page pointing to Amazon, eBay and other sites may include affiliate code. If you click them and make a purchase, we may earn a small commission.

Hotroder383

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 7, 2012
Posts
235
Reaction score
5
Location
Washington Mo
Ram Year
1996
Engine
318 or 5.2 which ever you want
So next summer I plan on pulling the engine out and either rebuilding or replacing with a rebuilt 360. Currently I have the 5.2 (318), with modded kegger, MSD 5, MSD coil, elect fan conversion, and 3.55 gears. I have pulled a couple of cars with her already and just didn't have the torque I wanted. I know gears would give me the most bang for the buck BUT she has over 200K on her and I plan on keeping it for more than a few years yet.

Which brings me to my question, should I build the 318 with this Crane Cams 2020, and a Hughes/Edle F1 intake, along with an SCT with my rebuild. I want torque plain and simple. This is a tow rig, not every day, not even once a month but when I put a car behind it I want to be able to pull it. So brings me back to... 318 or find a 360? I have been lookin and I can find 360 blocks for about $300, complete motors for $500. I have always said "Why build a 305 when for the same money you can build a 350" But I have seen more than a few posts on here sayin they would rather have the 318 over the 360.

So I ask you guys, what do you think? Rebuild is gonna happen, will be 318 or 360, no 440 sorry or going to cummins. What are your guys and gals thoughts??
 

Okiespaniel

Senior Member
Joined
Dec 18, 2011
Posts
1,645
Reaction score
897
Location
Work, Shop, Computer
Ram Year
2000
Engine
magnum, 5.9
First of all if you are building a torque motor for towing with rather "lazy" gears, you need to define what "low end torque" is to you.

For me thats anything above curb idle (tranny in gear) to max cruising rpm with OD on.
So that is somewhere between 800 and 2200 rpm.

So if I were to build this motor, I would something with a large bore and long stroke and any mod that doesn't significantly improve torque in the rpm range I specified would not be installed. The last part of that statement is especially true if I have to stay with a 318.
So mods like an air gap or cam that didn't significantly improve torque until 2500 or 3000 rpm would not be used UNLESS I had a big cube motor to provide more vacum on the intake stroke. Motors like 440s tend to "mild down" some higher rpm mods.

That's the problem with torque motors, they really don't look or sound impressive. If you thought Cummins diesel you're on my wavelength.

The alternative is to add a torque modifier like gears. The smaller the engine, the bigger the cam and the higher rpm range the intake works in, the more gear you need. So if you wanted the fancy intake and the cam with a slight lope to it, you need a mod that gets you into thier effective torque range quicker.
So I would probably run a minimum of 4:10 gears with a 33 inch tire, and would probably go with 4:56 gears, trading some top end for better tow power in the 45 to 70 mph range.

But...having built...or rather wasted my money on building hi output engines for vehicles with low output powertrains I wouldn't repeat that mistake.

If the budget is tight, rebuild the 318 as is, add some 1:7 rockers with the stock cam, mildly port the heads, get a 50 mm TB (wasn't mentioned in your post) and spend the rest of your money on gears. I don't know if stroker kits are avalible for a 318 but a 390 kit was avalible.
 
Last edited:

the codes

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 8, 2012
Posts
4,210
Reaction score
160
Location
Houston, Tx
Ram Year
1998
Engine
Magnum 5.2
I say rebuild the tranny with a ramzilla kit, and get taller gears...I feel like alot of tq is lost from the drivetrain.

or pull a 360 and stroke it to a 408. and if you'd rather not do that, I'd keep your modded kegged, I have the FI air gap and it makes it's power higher in the rpm's, lose low end when switching. If your dead set on keeping it a 360 or 318 I would put a set of iron ram heads on cuz iv heard stock heads suck, keep
kegger, 1.7 rockers like said above, SCT tuner for sure, and get a custom towing tune from Sean. I think that should satisfy you. maybe a cam, to compliment everything but if you get a cam get headers so it can breath.


Tapatalk Addict
 
OP
OP
Hotroder383

Hotroder383

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 7, 2012
Posts
235
Reaction score
5
Location
Washington Mo
Ram Year
1996
Engine
318 or 5.2 which ever you want
Same for me Okies, cam is better than stock with lift lobe seperation and duration to build power and TQ in the RPM range of idle to 4400, which is where I want my tq to be. Only reason for F1 is it seams to be the ONLY intake for these trucks with FI.
As far as sounding impressive I don't care about that at all, to be honest if I wanted that I'd build another play toy. Keep in mind I do have a 2wd so large tires are not gonna happen LOL.
New TB I had forgot about, but a very good add on thank you. Gears I may redo and go with a set of 3.73 maybe 3.90. But that's about as steep as I want to go.
The main question is, is a 318 worth rebuilding for a decent engine or should I just pony up the extra $500 and rebuild a 360. Stroker kits are great but a bit too pricey for me right now. I am only lookin to put about $1500 total in to the rebuild. With $500 of that being new rings, bearings gaskets and pistons. Probebly $300 for machine work, $200 for cam and lifters. If I go 360 then theres my other $500 if I stay 318 I get my SCT sooner LOL
 

the codes

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 8, 2012
Posts
4,210
Reaction score
160
Location
Houston, Tx
Ram Year
1998
Engine
Magnum 5.2
well sounds like you have a pretty good idea of what you wanna do. I highly recommend getting a SCT Tuner and getting some tunes from Sean. tell him you want one for towing specifically and
he will make sure you get a tune that is tq heavy instead if a balance of
hp and tq :) just my .02


Tapatalk Addict
 

the codes

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 8, 2012
Posts
4,210
Reaction score
160
Location
Houston, Tx
Ram Year
1998
Engine
Magnum 5.2
oh and did I give you the info on that tb I got? way cheaper than a Fastman, and it was great quality! one of the biggest improvements on my engines power iv ever done. and if you get a cam you can prob go 54 mm instead of 52/50!


Tapatalk Addict
 

Okiespaniel

Senior Member
Joined
Dec 18, 2011
Posts
1,645
Reaction score
897
Location
Work, Shop, Computer
Ram Year
2000
Engine
magnum, 5.9
What kind of "tow weight" are you trying to pull?
I know you mentioned car trailer so about 7k vehicle and trailer? How often?

I've had a bunch of 318s in my time, all old school LA motors but they were hard workers and outlasted the vehicle they were in on occasion. I used them to tow on occasion but nothing like the weight of a car. The 360 makes a bit more torque but is a gas hog. I would base the need on the amount of towing and the terrain traveled.

And as mentioned above powertrain loss is considerable, so those are areas I would address more than the engine build itself.
I would definetly look at 3:92s and a HD tranny over engine mods. You can get a cam and new roller rockers for 2 bills? hmmmmm. Def cheaper than a set of 1:7s!

The reason I mentioned rumpy cams and such is that a lot of young guys seem to forget that Horsepower and torque are two different animals. The trend is to add air gaps, huge TBs, big cams and the like, and then wonder why the truck doesn't want to go until its over the legal limit. If you really want a torque motor the only thing you can have too little of is cubic inches.
 
Last edited:
OP
OP
Hotroder383

Hotroder383

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 7, 2012
Posts
235
Reaction score
5
Location
Washington Mo
Ram Year
1996
Engine
318 or 5.2 which ever you want
Yes, about 7k with trailer. How often, well about once every 2 to 3 months I get a call to fix a car broke down that needs to be hauled to my garage so car weight changes all the time from a Suzuki Aerio to a chevy malibu.
I have heard about the 360 being a gas hog and that's why I ask about them. Is the extra torque you get from them really worth the gas all the time? I am honestly leaning towards the 318 but did not want to spend time and money only to regret it later.
 

Viper21700

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 7, 2012
Posts
136
Reaction score
3
Location
Woodbridge VA
Ram Year
1998
Engine
98 CTD 12 Valve- Half the valves, twice the fun
Everything Okie said is right on the money. The 318 can be made into one hell of an effiencient pulling machine, with the right work. Gears are a must, as it runs almost like the inline sixes, and falls flat on its face at high RPM stock (if you are wondering what Im talking about, take a ride in a jeep wrangler with 31's, the 4.0, and 3.55 gearing....)
Gears will keep you happy. Forget the puppypower, go for higher torque, which equates to more power for the pull, and higher torque= less strain to hold set speeds. High horsepower is great if you are running the strip.
Heads will help, get that compression ratio up a bit from stock, the more boom for your fuel/air mixture (Stoimetrics) the more power.
 

Okiespaniel

Senior Member
Joined
Dec 18, 2011
Posts
1,645
Reaction score
897
Location
Work, Shop, Computer
Ram Year
2000
Engine
magnum, 5.9
Yes, about 7k with trailer. How often, well about once every 2 to 3 months I get a call to fix a car broke down that needs to be hauled to my garage so car weight changes all the time from a Suzuki Aerio to a chevy malibu.
I have heard about the 360 being a gas hog and that's why I ask about them. Is the extra torque you get from them really worth the gas all the time? I am honestly leaning towards the 318 but did not want to spend time and money only to regret it later.

Well, as long as you're not hauling something equal to or larger than the tow vehicle I would run the 318 with some gears. If it tows now, imagine a fresh engine with some deeper gears and a few mild mods.

You're kinda on the cusp between the two engines. If you were doing it monthly or once a week and charging for the service, I'd move up. Actually I'd find the money for a diesel. But that's me...and I've tried towing with a 360. The last big haul cost me 1800 bucks for a tranny. The extra torque gets chewed up quick when the weight gets piled on.
 
Last edited:
OP
OP
Hotroder383

Hotroder383

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 7, 2012
Posts
235
Reaction score
5
Location
Washington Mo
Ram Year
1996
Engine
318 or 5.2 which ever you want
Thanks guys. After all my words it boiled down to the one question of rebuild 318 or was the 360 worth the money. From what i have been reading in this post and others the 318 should do me for what I am gonna pull and how often I am gonna pull.
I do charge for my service but it is an off the books in my own garage thing. but one day when I open my own shop for real (i.e. tell the IRS what I am doin LOL) I will prob look for a 3rd or 4th gen cummins.
When I go to do the build I'll post it up but like I said that is next summer. =)
 
Top