Def

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chfranco

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Ram Year
2015 Ram 3500 Laramie 4x4 - Diesel
Engine
6.7 Liter Diesel
Hi All,

I have a new 3500 Diesel. When can i put in DEF? I bought the truck for towing but my daughter drives it to school. I'm worried she's going to miss the indicator. Truck has like 1300 miles but the gauge appears just above the red.... i'm concerned she will run out and not know what to do. It seems like they say to fill when the warning light comes on but that worries me. It's a 2015 Ram Laramie 3500 4x4 Mega...

thanks,
 

Power247

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6.4 HEMI
You can add def when ever you want. The key thing is to not run out.
 

jadocs

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Yes you can add anytime. If it's in the red, I would do it as soon as possible.
 

CDN Ram

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Ottawa Ontario
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2014 Laramie
Engine
6.7L CTD
You can add it at any time, but be aware the DEF is a lifed item which mean it does go bad, it all depends on the external temperature, in other words the hotter it is outside the quick DEF goes bad, I have filled mine only a galloon at a time to help me determine how fast I would go through DEF. I would sooner throw out a container of opened DEF than have to try and empty the DEF reservoir. I don't put alot of miles on every year as the vehical was only bought to tow. so a full DEF tank will expire prior to me going through it all. How to tell if DEF has gone bad??????? there are several sites that will tell you in time frame versus Temp but this will give you an idea. Bottom of page 1 is a table. Sorry about the site but hey the info doesn't chage.

https://www.fcsdchemicalsandlubricants.com/main/additionalinfo/DEF Shelf Life and Fluid Quality.pdf
 

jadocs

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What happens to the truck if DEF goes past expiration? I can't believe it would damage the system in any way. Does it matter if it's not as effective?
 

CDN Ram

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6.7L CTD
What happens to the truck if DEF goes past expiration? I can't believe it would damage the system in any way. Does it matter if it's not as effective?

I have looked around a bit and can't seem to find an answer as to what to do, other than dilute it 1:10 and use it on your lawn. But will it still work in the truck, will it hurt the system or the engine????? I don't know I will continue to look.
 

CDN Ram

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What happens to the truck if DEF goes past expiration? I can't believe it would damage the system in any way. Does it matter if it's not as effective?

I borrowed this information from another site it is not my info, but here is what I got from the op on the other site.

Clean Diesel vehicles use closed loop control to manage the Selective Catalytic Reduction (SCR) system that is part of the after treatment system. In principle, it is like cruise control in your vehicle: With cruise control, you set the desired speed, and the vehicle does all the work to maintain it: increase throttle setting, decrease throttle setting, etc. With clean diesel SCR, the control system is set to control the amount of oxides of Nitrogen: NOx in the exhaust.

The system injects (doses) a very accurate amount of DEF into the exhaust upstream of the SCR catalyst many times per second just like a fuel injector. The urea in the DEF is converted to ammonia by heat, and the ammonia then reacts with the catalyst to convert NOx to water, nitrogen, and CO2. The system also works with the EGR system to provide the best efficiency (lean burning) conditions in the engine to improve fuel economy. There is a NOx sensor after the SCR module that measures NOx in the exhaust. If the NOx levels are too high, the pulse widths or frequency of the DEF doser are increased, adding more urea to the exhaust stream. It is important to not inject too much DEF in the exhaust, or ammonia will be present in the exhaust, not good. All these actions take place hundreds of time per minute.

So what are the implications of diluted, very old, or otherwise non-conforming DEF??

Well, in most cases you will simply use more of it, just like your cruise control applies throttle to climb a grade. The required levels of NOx in the exhaust are maintained. In cases where the SCR system cannot meet mandated levels of NOx in the exhaust, you'll get a message, and be required to fix the issue within a specified length of time, usually something around 200 miles (varies widely by OEM, but all must comply with EPA2013 protocols).

Addressing the issue means adding DEF if you ran out, or having the system repaired, perhaps by flushing the DEF system or replacing a bad sensor or plugged filter. Most problems arise from users accidentally putting diesel in the DEF tank (please don't do this) or putting water in instead of DEF to save money.

Worst case: Using badly contaminated DEF or intentionally using the wrong fluid can destroy the SCR system on your vehicle. Full replacement may be required. Price varies, but can be over $5000. Way over.

Normal case of getting bad DEF at the pump or from a bad jug: Flush DEF tank, replace filter, replace sensor: from $250 to over $1000. Less if under warranty and it was a bad part or your vehicle just needs a "reflash" of the engine control computer to implement a fix in "firmware". The EPA requires 2013 Clean Diesel engine manufacturers to provide up to 70,000 mi or more warranties on the emission control systems like SCR. They are not required to cover negligence.
 

jadocs

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Very interesting, thanks for the info.
 

[email protected]

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2015 RAM 3500 Diesel/Aisin Crew Dually
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Diesel
So here's the question that I'm sure many of you have asked - "how many miles (average) can we get on a full tank of DEF?" I believe the capacity on my RAM 3500 DEF tank is about 3 gallons. (Not sure.)

I'm sure over time and distance I'll get a "feel" for how long a full tank of DEF will last, but was hoping to draw on some of your experiences.

Thanx .... Dan
 
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