How does AUTO 4WD work/what does it do?

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BWL

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I don't see why there can't be a full lock up of the clutch pack in 4 lock and 4 low. Maybe just enough slip to prevent drivetrain damage if you suddenly get good traction, but a firm enough lock that the tires are spinning immediately. Technology has come a long way and this seems like a fairly simple thing.
 

LouM

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It is a piece of crap transfer case, I have it in a 2015 EcoDiesel. I like my truck except for that t case, people are missing one important factor of it and it is a hazard. When in the so called lock modes it is disengaged in the case until it senses slip;

1) going uphill on a steep grade if you stop and place the truck in park and release the brake it completely disengages the t case and you are in 2 wd if it's slippery the damned truck will start sliding backwards, it may wait until you are stepping out or out of the truck. A person could be knocked down and run over.

2) going downhill on a slick surface in low lock first gear, it is not engaged, your engine hold back is only on the rear wheels not all 4, again loss of control is quite possible and a runaway vehicle.

3) if you are using a come along or portable winch to try and pull some one or something out, you will never get any drag or hold out of that expensive front axle, you will just skid the rear axle.

As others have mentioned you will not get any pull from the front axle until the rear slips, that makes it so much fun when you go across a side hill and try and ease over rocks or logs in a narrow gateway with trees or rocks just inches from your flanks and the rear end spinning is going to spin you right down into them.

Now for you people that say I should have bought a 3/4 ton, bull, these fancy half tons should be able to do at least what an old Dodge ram 50, an old Ford courier, Chevy Luv, or a Dodge Dakota could and would do day in and out.
They could have placed a dog clutch around that light duty hydraulic as part of the basket or for that matter multi disk wet clutchs could give true lockup. Even better are the systems using wet clutchs that are fully engaged and locked in until an electrical command releases them.
 

muddy12

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I don't see why there can't be a full lock up of the clutch pack in 4 lock and 4 low. Maybe just enough slip to prevent drivetrain damage if you suddenly get good traction, but a firm enough lock that the tires are spinning immediately. Technology has come a long way and this seems like a fairly simple thing.


Totally agree with you, it “should” be easy enough to lock the clutch pack. I just don’t understand why they chose not to.

Heck, even the ‘87 grand wagoneer I used to have, had a lockable viscous coupling in the t-case. Even with a permanently engaged front axle, it could be driven on pavement without binding(when the VC wasn’t locked).


There have been several good transfer cases in the past, that were able to give both awd driving characteristics, AND traditional (front and rear shafts locked) 4x4 operation. If they were able to accomplish this in the past, with totally mechanical systems, it SHOULD be no problem to accomplish the same with today’s 4x4 systems.


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VA10

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Time to sell my truck.....it is a fraud! :doublepuke:
 

Cardhu

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For me at least, I was expecting the system to work like the selec-trac in the grand Cherokee that I used to have. It was labeled as “full time” and “part time” rather than “auto” and “lock”.
The NP242 used for selec-trac had a lockable center dif that was open in full time mode(prevented binding on road). When either part time or LO were selected, the center dif was locked and it functioned just like a true part time case.

Ultimately it’s my fault for not researching the 44-44, but based on how it’s labeled/marketed, I was expecting functionality like the NP242.
This was my assumption also as i came from a NP231 and the NP242 was an option that still locked both drive shafts. while 242 wasn't as strong as a 231, I didn't see room for improvement and was my compromise as the previous system worked fine and still had a lock function.

Maybe i should have micro analyzed it before i bought it. All because i wanted leather and heated seats.

As for wheel binding / hop in another post, if it binds on that surface I wouldn't be in 4. And if it is binding, i'm quite prepared to deal with it just so i can make it up 6 inch lip without chirping tires or hitting it so it doesn't.
 

Rader

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I was extremely disappointed when I found out that even in low range the front driveshaft/differential is driven by a clutch pack. I went through the clutch driven front diff problem before with a 2004 Grand Cherokee Overland with NV247 T case. I live in a rural area and the clutch pack was toast at around 40,000 miles it wouldn't even spin Goodyear Eagles in snow. But even at that the 247 had one advantage over the T case in my Ram EcoDiesel. The advantage was even if the clutch pack was toast there was a sliding gear that locked the center differential progressive coupler when the T case was in low range so you still had LOCKED full 4WD even when the clutch pack was totally worn out.


When my 247 T case clutch pack quit in my GC I swapped in a 242 HD. The 242HD was a wide chain 242 that was factory installed in some 4.7 V/8 Grand Cherokees. It was my favorite of all the T cases I have ever had. I wish there was a T case like that would directly swap into my 1500. Barring that I would wish Ram would release a flash for the electronic controls for our trucks so a 44-45 could be swapped in and the T case would shift fully into 2WD.

Soon the Wranglers will have the 8 speed trans and from reports for T cases they will have 241, 241OR and a yet un-named T case with a full time mode. I would be happy with a 241 but would be even happier if the full time case was an upgraded 242 type of T case. The problem is they may not be comparable with Rams, the Jeep T cases may use different length transmission to T case adapters and have different length input shafts so a swap would be difficult. EDIT apparently the new Wrangler T case will be the CLUTCH driven MP3022 SELEC-TRAC like is in some Jeep Libertys.
 
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Machria

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I think I see why Ram made this choice...

Look how many people are posting here that the "auto" is just fine. A lot of you guys must not actually live in places that need 4wd. The fact that 4wd is just a toy and not a necessity for most of you is probably why Ram put it in.

Go do some reading about traction, weight distribution, and racing. A lot of that applies to driving vehicles on snow and ice, even at lower speeds. If you're doing something in 2wd and suddenly 4wd kicks in, you might have unexpected loss of traction. Or if you're expecting to be in 4wd but for some reason the truck is keeping you in 2wd, more problems again.

Binding doesn't just happen on dry pavement. It happens on snow and ice, too. The difference is that the tire can slip over the surface, rather than gripping the road, causing you to feel the binding. That still translates to a loss of traction on snow, so it's silly to have it randomly kick on/off when you are already on the move. A wheel that's grabbing the snow just fine might suddenly lose traction due to binding, and now the handling characteristics of the truck are totally different than 1 second ago.


VERY well said!

Personally, I have no problem with the way it is, works great for me. And I do like the ability to have the 4wd AUTO mode. I've had that feature in my Audi's and Range Rovers for years (the Audi via AWD all the time, and the RR had an 4wd Auto mode), and always loved it. By the way, Audi has had the lock (no pun intended!) on All wheel drive tranny/transfer cases for MANY years!!! They originally designed it for the Porsche racing team years ago, and it worked so well they decided to put it into their cars. This was 30 years BEFORE anyone else even thought about it.

BUT, having said I'm fine with the current RAM transfer case and 4wd system, I will add 2 more points:
1. It is a bit "dirty" that the switch in my truck says 4wd LOCK on it, when it in fact does not lock. Shame on RAM for that little detail.

2. My previous truck, a 2002 Ford F150 Screw had the transmission replaced 3 times!!! 2 of those were at my cost of $3,500 EACH TIME. The first time it went, I had 35,600 miles on the truck, and Ford the little RAT ********, did not give me a penny toward it even know it was only 500 miles over the 35k warranty. The second time was at 62k. By the 3rd time, which was at 110k, for some unknown reason Ford suddenly decided to cover it! That, and the fact I replaced the head on it twice, also for $3,500 each, is why I now own a RAM truck! ;)
 
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Machria

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Awesome video from 19 long ago, but good explanation on how a tranny works:

 
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Machria

Machria

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HOLY CRAP!!! I'm NOT opening up that 8 speed tranny!! LOL! Wow, lot's of scary looking parts in that thing! God bless the tranny engineers.

 

BWL

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HOLY CRAP!!! I'm NOT opening up that 8 speed tranny!! LOL! Wow, lot's of scary looking parts in that thing! God bless the tranny engineers.

It's an awesome transmission. A good example of improvements in modern technology. Maybe the 2019 will add a good transfer case to go with it.
 

ColdCase

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I dunno, there is two sides of every coin. That transmission is so temperature dependent, and complex, all those tight tolerances and small passages makes for a wide variety of nuisances in extreme heat or cold. In fact they don't work in the cold at all unless there is a big ass heater in them :) There have been all kinds of shift smoothness problems in the real world. Their 9 speed has been a disaster. They look great on paper, and when built by the best techs they may work well, but they just can't be produced to those tight tolerances in big numbers reliably.

Just saying, something simple and maintainable may be more useful than the absolute best in complexity... just look at the machinery of WWII. Some of the best stuff just did not work in the muck of everyday use. Especially in the truck world where time is money and the machines are put to work. One off or low volume sports cars toys are a different story.
 

barr0208

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the nine speed in the wifes 200c awd works great after the update on it and its getting 30+ mpg going stupid fast.
 
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Machria

Machria

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It's an awesome transmission. A good example of improvements in modern technology. Maybe the 2019 will add a good transfer case to go with it.

I don't know how the hell they figure all that stuff out! Just doing the math on one gear is complicated, there are 100's in there!
 
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Machria

Machria

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I dunno, there is two sides of every coin. That transmission is so temperature dependent, and complex, all those tight tolerances and small passages makes for a wide variety of nuisances in extreme heat or cold. In fact they don't work in the cold at all unless there is a big ass heater in them :) There have been all kinds of shift smoothness problems in the real world. Their 9 speed has been a disaster. They look great on paper, and when built by the best techs they may work well, but they just can't be produced to those tight tolerances in big numbers reliably.

Just saying, something simple and maintainable may be more useful than the absolute best in complexity... just look at the machinery of WWII. Some of the best stuff just did not work in the muck of everyday use. Especially in the truck world where time is money and the machines are put to work. One off or low volume sports cars toys are a different story.

"Can't be produced in big numbers"?? Really? There are MILLIONS of them driving all around the planet today, I'd say that is produced in BIG numbers!!

I understand what your saying tho, I do love the simple things. I've always been a quality product person, not necessarily the product with all the bells and whistles, the product that always works.
 

nick84

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I'll add my .02 to the list of disappointed Ram 4x4 owners as well. Like most people, the biggest thing that aggravates me is the misleading way it's labelled.

Being honest with myself, I'm on rutted single track once or twice a month tops, when I go out to my spot in the woods to shoot or hunt. I live in the city, work in the city, etc. While I would have preferred the reassurance of true 4wd, the auto is what I need 97% of the time. It's looking like a pretty slick winter so far in Ohio, and I've had no trouble in the past with the 4 auto. I do have to live with a health fear of the mud though.

The only time the 4wd has let me down was in my own yard, when the truck slid back down my hill in wet grass. Wouldn't have been a problem at all except it slid back into the trailer. Pissed me off pretty good, but even if 4 wheels had been turning the whole time, it still probably would have slid. Tires are still the thing that connects the truck to the surface, and for most people like me, that's probably still the critical failure point. Unless you're out bogging regularly, or rock crawling, the 44-44 is probably satisfactory. I still would have liked to have understood it when I bought it, and it peeves me that I can't have both AWD functionality and true 4wd, but I've come to accept it.
 

WilliamS

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Tires are still the thing that connects the truck to the surface, and for most people like me, that's probably still the critical failure point. Unless you're out bogging regularly, or rock crawling, the 44-44 is probably satisfactory.

Still the resounding quote that keeps popping up in this thread. The transfer case isnt perfect for a rock climbing truck but with the right tires, it does a great job. Its about knowing how it works vs how you want it to work.
 

BWL

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Other resounding opinion is 4 lock should lock or be called something else. My vote is for 4-kind of. Any better names?
 

CostaRam

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The transfer case isnt perfect for a rock climbing truck but with the right tires
The 44-44 transfer case is not perfect at all on medium and soft sand as i guess neither in mud!
Driving on soft sand is probably not very common in the US but where i live it is common and sometimes necessary!
I have to admit that it is my fault that i did not checked for the TC when i bought this truck,
but me too feel missleaded by the 4x4 lock and the RAM advertisings who let somebody believe that a 1500 RAM is THE OFFROAD TRUCK.
Chris
 

deanoldo

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Other resounding opinion is 4 lock should lock or be called something else. My vote is for 4-kind of. Any better names?

I'm thinking it should have '4Auto', '4Auto+', and '4Auto Low'. I probably don't need actual locking, but don't like the idea that something labeled as 4 Lock actually doesn't lock. It's my first Ram and I didn't think to research the 4 wheel drive system. I would have still bought it, but I wouldn't feel duped every time I look down at the 4 wheel drive buttons.
 

ColdCase

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"Can't be produced in big numbers"?? Really? There are MILLIONS of them driving all around the planet today, I'd say that is produced in BIG numbers!!

I understand what your saying tho, I do love the simple things. I've always been a quality product person, not necessarily the product with all the bells and whistles, the product that always works.

I don't think there's been near a million built, but half of those produced don't work well partly because they are so hard to be produced consistently. Of those half, many don't bother to complain because its not that bad, but there sure are a lot of shifting complains being reported. Then units built in US plants have way too many issues. Those used in colder climates get a lot of complaints.
 
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