Why is the cummins soo slow

[jstacey8]

He wasn't indicating your number one, he was showing off his IQ.



Really? Your nineteen, your still trying to figure out why you have hair on your junk.

29 years ago, RAM made available the first Cummins diesel engine. Since then, diesel technology as well as power train technology continues to evolve, yearly. In your short driving history, how could you possibly have experienced the thousands of evolutionary changes made in individual engines and their characteristics from torque management to transmission behaviors, etc.? The question is rhetorical because the obvious answer is you couldn't.

Also seems pointless that you bring this seeing how unless one person was to drive one with every single change that has happened then they don't know either? So unless you have driven every single one it seems that you don't know either. How is it they say The blind leading the blind?

 

[SouthTexan]

Can you please tell me when I said my truck would even pull 14k? Because I never once did it hauled a car trailer and a regular cab long bed 1997 Ford F-150 and it was by no means fast what so ever.

I never said you said it. I said it in response to you saying that the Cummins is slower unloaded. What, you don't mind saying that the Cummins is slow unloaded, but get a little testy when someone says your truck is slow in certain situations? You can dish it, but you can't take it? Do you need a "safe zone" like the rest of the kids these days?

As far as not believing me why would I lie? Who do I have to impress on here? No one. Hell when I went to test drive the cummins I was hopeing like hell it would impress me so I could have a reason to buy one. As far as not knowing how to drive a diesel we (my family bisness I work for) have 3 duramax's for work trucks not to mention where I live we are surrounded my logging company's who all have money to blow and have some pretty damn nice duramax's and they all have sons my age that I grew up with and spent the majority of my child hood so I have always driven there trucks to get chains or fuel or what ever they needed.

Cool story bro!

Now for the new cummins that I raced my best friends brother who is also my friend works/ownes a local grain store and just got in his new orange 4 door or what ever they are called long bed big horn cummins in the Omaha orange (I can include a picture if you fells don't belive me) and I had told him about my exsperinces with the cummins I drove and I said maybe it just feels slow due to the very gradual power delivery that I am not use to with a hemi (down shift and go) so he said there is only one way to find out I guess so we lined them up and sure enough I beat him by quite a large bit granted his truck only has roughly 350 miles on it.

Another cool story! Was this the "quad cab HD" you were referring to earlier?

As far as pulling 14k I'm pretty my tranny would burn up about 5 miles of pulling the weight and a cummins could most likely pull 14k for 100k+ and never once have a issue because that is what it is designed to do....

Ding ding ding! Now you is starting to get why the torque management on the Cummins is so intrusive. Because the truck is designed to pull thousands of pounds for many, many miles. With the long power train warranties of these trucks the manufacturers would have to design them or implement programming to ensure they don't pay out during these warranty periods. So you have what I call "nannies" like torque management designed in the truck to ensure it does not go "BANG!" during the warranty period.

Is the torque management on the Cummins more intrusive than Ford's or GM's? Yes, and many reviewers like PickupTricks.com even commented on it. However, if you take it off or lessen its effects like I can on my tuner then the truck will be much quicker off the line, but you run the risk of your transmission failing sooner along with other negaitives. I have taken it off for a short period of time on my tuner module. While it did make it much quicker of the line the extra low rpm fueling caused the EGR to kick in more blowing even more soot into the DPF which caused the DPF to clog up quicker which cased me to regen a lot more which caused my fuel mileage to plummet. I also started to feel the trucks back tires slip and catch even when taking off normally, and saw chunks of tires missing on my brand new Nitto's Trails (only on the rear) that only had 5k miles on them. Since I purchased the tuner for better mileage it kind of defeated the purpose of loosing fuel mileage and requiring me to buy tires sooner. Also, since I don't drag race my truck and use it for it's intended purpose, I didn't see the need cause extra wear and tear on the truck just to say I can get off the line better than the next guy.

 

[jstacey8]

Gues what i was saying is I expected the most powerful diesel on the market that can haul 14k with ease would simply have more get up and go and set you back in your seat when it was unloaded

 

[Underarock13]

I still can't believe this is a thread...

 

[Rzrman328]

This escalated quickly.

 

[RoadDog66]

I think you meant...

 

[w6pea]

I saw a sign on the back of a new truck earlier today.....The truck was really a pavement queen, Ford F350 Super Duty Power Joke (I like that) .

This truck was sitting high enough off the ground I could almost walk under it. The bumper sticker said: The Difference between Men & Boys.....The price of their toys.

The kid that was driving the Pavement Queen looked about 16 or 17 yrs. old

 

[drittal]

Fact of the matter is the cummins is a towing engine. The truck weighs around 8,000 lbs empty, has engine management to control 800 lb*ft, but come in at 370hp. Acceleration suffers with 1/4 mile times of more than a second behind a 1500 hemi. (Mid-Low 15 vs mid-high 16).

Even compared to other TD the cummins intrusive torque management, 3.42 gears and lower HP leaves them last of the pack in acceleration.

 

[68PowerWagon]

Fact of the matter is the cummins is a towing engine. The truck weighs around 8,000 lbs empty, has engine management to control 800 lb*ft, but come in at 370hp. Acceleration suffers with 1/4 mile times of more than a second behind a 1500 hemi. (Mid-Low 15 vs mid-high 16).

Even compared to other TD the cummins intrusive torque management, 3.42 gears and lower HP leaves them last of the pack in acceleration.

Kind of like comparing a stock car with a John Deer 4430 tractor

 

[SouthTexan]

Kind of like comparing a stock car with a John Deer 4430 tractor

Or a body builder to an olympic runner. Yeah the runner will post a better 40 yard dash than the buddy builder without any extra weight, but strap an extra 300 lbs to the back of both and that runner will be slowed down dramatically while it would barely effect the body builder.

Also, the Cummins is not the most powerful diesel of the three. It is the most reliable due to all the CP4 pump and injector issues Ford and GM are having, but it is not the most powerful in terms of horsepower. You just got to pick what is more important to you. Long term reliability or wanting to be able to accelerate faster than the next guy at wide open throttle. Some may look for different things out of their vehicles.

 

[tjfdesmo]

Like the old saying says, "There's horses for courses". Any Indy Car makes a ****-poor rock crawler, and a rock-buggy won't be winning any road races. You can buy a truck with a straight six work motor(like 99.9% of Class 8 trucks)or you can buy a truck with a play motor that makes big number and winds to the moon, so you can do burnouts and impress your flat-hat friends. Gale Banks once dissed the Cummins as "basically a tractor motor". I regarded that as a compliment. With basically twice the longevity of the ***** diesels, the choice is pretty clear to me.

 

[Hemi450hp]

I'm going to come out and disagree with both sides of this argument.

Is a stock Hemi faster in the 1/4 mile than a stock Cummins? Yes.

Will the Cummins run circles around a hemi with a trailer hooked up behind it? Yes.

Will a modified Hemi outperform a modified Cummins? Not a chance.

A simple small turbo swap with bigger injectors and a tuner will put even a lifted Cummins truck in the 12's very easily. Upgrade the CP3, and go with a bigger turbo/compound turbos, and you can easily have a 10-11 second 1/4 mile truck that is still more than capable of towing 10,000lbs on a less aggressive street tune.

You will never see those kind of power levels or 1/4 mile times from a 5.7 Hemi while still keeping it reliable enough to drive daily, much less tow anything with it.

So in the end, everyone is wrong. The Cummins trucks may be slower stock, but they are at the same time, some of the fastest trucks in the world once you start to modify them.

 

[68PowerWagon]

I'm going to come out and disagree with both sides of this argument.

Is a stock Hemi faster in the 1/4 mile than a stock Cummins? Yes.

Will the Cummins run circles around a hemi with a trailer hooked up behind it? Yes.

Will a modified Hemi outperform a modified Cummins? Not a chance.

A simple small turbo swap with bigger injectors and a tuner will put even a lifted Cummins truck in the 12's very easily. Upgrade the CP3, and go with a bigger turbo/compound turbos, and you can easily have a 10-11 second 1/4 mile truck that is still more than capable of towing 10,000lbs on a less aggressive street tune.

You will never see those kind of power levels or 1/4 mile times from a 5.7 Hemi while still keeping it reliable enough to drive daily, much less tow anything with it.

So in the end, everyone is wrong. The Cummins trucks may be slower stock, but they are at the same time, some of the fastest trucks in the world once you start to modify them.

But at what cost? The Cummins is what? around $7-8,000 more out of the gate. Then several more thousand in mods to make it a "race truck" I just don't think that is what that engine is designed for & definitely not what a truck is designed for.

 

[Hemi450hp]

My 07 5.9CTD with just a programmer ran 13.9 in the 1/4 mile on 37's. That tuner cost me all of $500. To get a 4wd Hemi truck on 37's to run a 13.9 in the 1/4 mile will take gears, tq converter, tuner, and longtubes...That ranges anywhere from $3500-$6000 in parts depending on the year and brand parts you go with.

I then spent $5300 on a 64mm turbo, 90hp nozzles, and a built transmission with upgraded tq converter, and it ran 12.8 @ 108MPH in that same 4dr 4wd 5.9 on the big 37" mud tires. Truck still got 17mpg on the highway and was able to ton just about anything I wanted if I switched tunes (which could be done in 1 second on the fly).

I love the hemi motor, and I own a business that does nothing but specialize in the Hemi. But when it comes to all out performance, mileage, durability, and tq, a Cummins equipped truck is very hard to beat. It can race, tow, commute, and get good mileage while doing it. You just cant get all of those features at the same time from a Hemi truck.

 

[hemiguy93]

I traded my 14 2500 6.4 for a 15 2500 CTD, it seemed slow to me at first, but it does get a little better once you got it broke in, I've only got 9000 miles on mine, but it has gotten more responsive since when I first drove it. And just recently added an air intake, and put a programmer on. That did a world of wonders alone. Like they said before, night and day difference when tuned. I have not yet deleted the stupid ass DPF bc my truck came with unlimited lifetime power train warranty, and deleting it would void it. But the instant it becomes voided for whatever BS reason that may arise, ***** coming off and goodness going on.

 

[mtofell]

I'm just a middle aged guy that drives a truck for my commuter and uses it to tow. My days of rolling around in the garage are largely gone in favor of things like kids. I just can't fathom buying a 60K truck and voiding the warranty to make it run like it should. I don't have any direct experience but this thread is interesting. It's unfortunately making me think a Ram diesel may not be my best option if/when I outgrow my 6.4 Hemi.

 

[strmtrooper]

I'm just a middle aged guy that drives a truck for my commuter and uses it to tow. My days of rolling around in the garage are largely gone in favor of things like kids. I just can't fathom buying a 60K truck and voiding the warranty to make it run like it should. I don't have any direct experience but this thread is interesting. It's unfortunately making me think a Ram diesel may not be my best option if/when I outgrow my 6.4 Hemi.

Its hard for me to imagine going to an older vehicle when thinking about the next truck I buy but I have always wanted a 2wd crew cab 5.9 cummins. Also no dpf and emissions to deal with. I also find myself wanting to go back to my 6.0 all the time, emissions equipment is no fun to deal with these days.

 

[regularcab2500]

Since this thread has become a joke anyway...I'm gonna throw out that rams marketing plan is clearly separating itself from the cummins brand and in 2014 and 15, they specifically advertised that you should be able to everything with a gas motor as a diesel (mostly to promote the 6.4 but still). Now anyone who has towed with gas and diesel knows you would need to gear down like a mother f to equal a diesel. With all that being said I hope ram dumps cummins and picks up a CAT motor like rumors have been saying for like 13 years lol...I might have to bench the 6.4 then lol. I have never towed with a cummins but pulling 8k in my single cab 6.4 was barely different than driving empty with the exception of grades (downhill was fine). A gentleman around the corner from me owns a Hellcat challenger and a 5.3 chevy. I've gone over for a couple beers and to drool on his car a couple times but one occasion included a drive in my truck. When a hellcat owner tells you your truck is "******* fast" it must mean something (hopefully not that the hellcat is over rated haha).

I agree the 6.7 is a tractor motor so we're comparing vodka to apple cider at this point. But I enjoy all the butt hurt..it's truly entertaining.

And with that let the bickering commence!

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[SouthTexan]

I'm just a middle aged guy that drives a truck for my commuter and uses it to tow. My days of rolling around in the garage are largely gone in favor of things like kids. I just can't fathom buying a 60K truck and voiding the warranty to make it run like it should.

There is no rolling around in a garage. You plug in the tuner or module, just like you would with a Hemi Fever tune, and you get another 80 hp and 200 lb-ft . Although not all all Cummins trucks are 60k. I know guys who bought brand new 2015 Cummins trucks for 45k. They were more stripped down models since having a Cummins option was more important to them than other options.

 

[tjfdesmo]

Since this thread has become a joke anyway...I'm gonna throw out that rams marketing plan is clearly separating itself from the cummins brand and in 2014 and 15, they specifically advertised that you should be able to everything with a gas motor as a diesel (mostly to promote the 6.4 but still). Now anyone who has towed with gas and diesel knows you would need to gear down like a mother f to equal a diesel. With all that being said I hope ram dumps cummins and picks up a CAT motor like rumors have been saying for like 13 years lol...I might have to bench the 6.4 then lol. I have never towed with a cummins but pulling 8k in my single cab 6.4 was barely different than driving empty with the exception of grades (downhill was fine). A gentleman around the corner from me owns a Hellcat challenger and a 5.3 chevy. I've gone over for a couple beers and to drool on his car a couple times but one occasion included a drive in my truck. When a hellcat owner tells you your truck is "******* fast" it must mean something (hopefully not that the hellcat is over rated haha).

I agree the 6.7 is a tractor motor so we're comparing vodka to apple cider at this point. But I enjoy all the butt hurt..it's truly entertaining.

And with that let the bickering commence!

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#1 CAT exited the over-the-road engine business several years ago
#2 While their big motors, 3406 for example, were excellent-at least until they got off in the weeds with their disastrous Navijunk inspired ACERT emissions strategy-their smaller stuff was never much to brag about. The 3208 was scrap and the 3116/3126 was not very highly regarded. Anything small/light enough to go into a pickup would be a Perkapiller(Perkins)anyway. Bottom line:Cummins>CAT any day.
#3 If FCA moves away from Cummins, it will be to one of their own engines like they have done with Case and New Holland.