Synthetic Oil

[06 Dodge]

The oil change indicator/computer has no way of knowing what motor oil you have in the crankcase. All it does is measure miles and idle time. For all Chrysler vehicles we had in the past or currently own, it's been 1% / 100 miles. For example, at 1000 miles on new oil, the OLM was at 90%. If idle time was higher, it might have been at 89%~88% at the same mileage. It didn't matter if the engine was running on Castrol EDGE EP 5W-20, Mobil 1 EP 5W-20 / FS 0W-40, PUP 5W-20, or Red Line 5W-30.

PUP uses 100% GTL for base oil, and PP uses a mix of GTL and Group III. Group III base oils have the best additive response out of all base oils, when compared to PAO, ANs, and even POE. Esters can and are used with Group III base oils. However, Shell does not use Esters in PUP or PP products.

Shell has improved their GTL manufacturing process a lot, to the point where 0W-20 and 5W-20 use very little to no VII, neither do they need a lot of PPDs to meet their winter rating. For an API licensed oil, it's decent, just about as good as everything else that's competing against. Comparing PUP with Mobil 1 or Castrol is pointless. They will all perform the same, within the margin of error. Amusingly enough, even AMSOIL Signature Series performs similarly to the upper-tier API licensed oils like PUP. That's because AMSOIL designed it that way. The only "premium" thing about AMSOIL Signature Series motor oil is that it might last a bit longer in service. However, the TBN numbers that I've seen in UOAs at 10K, 15K miles for AMSOIL SS didn't look any better or worse than Mobil 1 or PUP. Conclusively it's a motor oil like any other. Suppose you want something that performs better than these oils as far as high-temperature protection and drain interval length is concerned. In that case, you have to move away from API licensed oils and look the boutique and racing/industrial lube manufacturers.

As to PUP 0W-40: this is an oil that covers a long viscosity stretch. Shell is stubborn about keeping this one all GTL, and the result is something that shears easily, has a high NOACK value, and doesn't flow very well at below zero temperatures. They might have improved GTL, but it's still not good enough to use only by itself in an oil such as this. When it comes to off-the-shelf 0W-40 lubes, nothing beats Mobil 1 FS 0W-40. Performance and value for money are amazing for this one. To get to such a performance level, Mobil 1 uses PAO, GTL, POE, and an esterized additive package. Then again, they came out with it in 1994, and had plenty of time since then to refine it, to the point where it's become inexpensive for them to blend.



My username history is publically visible. I thought this one was funnier, I liked it better. Since I no longer own a HEMI, it wouldn't be right to keep using the "Hemi" name in my username:

View attachment 493763

If M1 is so good then why did we get better mpg when using PUP 0w20 compared to Mobil 1 or Mobile 1 0w20 advanced fuel economy oil?

 

[Rod Knock]

If M1 is so good then why did we get better mpg when using PUP 0w20 compared to Mobil 1 or Mobile 1 0w20 advanced fuel economy oil?

Well, Mobil 1 AFE 0W-20 is basically PUP, as it uses Shell GTL for its base oil. Yes, it uses only GTL, and some ANs for better additive response, which makes it better than PUP for wear control. I just filled up at Sheetz and my wonderful 18 MPG went down to 15 MPG. Does that mean the Red Line I'm using is crap-lube, or does it mean that Sheetz, also know to sometimes sell gasoline with water in it, sold me garbage-gasoline? Hmm, I'm on the fence about this one. What do you think?

 

[HEMIMANN]

PUP seems to have the best uoa's around historically. They must be doing something right. I have used it in the wife's car most of it's life, way better then everything else I tried.

GTL, man! Just add MoDTC & stir...

 

[Travis8352]

If M1 is so good then why did we get better mpg when using PUP 0w20 compared to Mobil 1 or Mobile 1 0w20 advanced fuel economy oil?

To many variables other than just oil. Plus hes talking about m1 0w40 not m1 afe 0w20

 

[Rod Knock]

To many variables other than just oil. Plus hes talking about m1 0w40 not m1 afe 0w20

It's not the oil, as most modern oil within the same viacosity range have the same friction reduction characteristics. The difference comes down to wear control and how long they last before the additive package starts burning off, starting with the organic friction reducers.

 

[06 Dodge]

Well, Mobil 1 AFE 0W-20 is basically PUP, as it uses Shell GTL for its base oil. Yes, it uses only GTL, and some ANs for better additive response, which makes it better than PUP for wear control. I just filled up at Sheetz and my wonderful 18 MPG went down to 15 MPG. Does that mean the Red Line I'm using is crap-lube, or does it mean that Sheetz, also know to sometimes sell gasoline with water in it, sold me garbage-gasoline? Hmm, I'm on the fence about this one. What do you think?

FYI the better mpg I saw with PUP was over a complete oil change interval 7K not just one or two tanks of gas, until I bought her Mopar vehicles that required 5w20 oil, all of her cars ran on Rotella T6 5w40...

 

[Rod Knock]

FYI the better mpg I saw with PUP was over a complete oil change interval 7K not just one or two tanks of gas, until I bought her Mopar vehicles that required 5w20 oil, all of her cars ran on Rotella T6 5w40...

Keep using it then. If i formation on forums was 100% then they would be boring. Truth be told there are three relevant additive companies in the entire world, and the most advanced of them is co-owned by ExxonMobil and Shell and it's called Infineum. PUP and PP now uses the same Dexos 1 G3 additive package as Mobil 1 uses in EP, Vanilla, and AFE. Red Line uses Lubrizol ad their additive and oil formulation supplier. Afton Chemicals is used by lower tier manufacturers. There is a fourth one called Oronite which is owned by Chevron, and used exclusivelly for their own peoducts. AMSOIL is also a Lubrizol customet. Conclusively, motor oils are mostly narketing as no blender is willing to take chances anymore on formulations. They buy them from the additive supplier, with a list of base oils that they work with. Fuel economy is figured in those cookie-cutter formulations. There are very few unique oils left on the market like Mobil 1 FS 0W-40. Rotella T6 is a unique product with a unique additive package. My dad did over a million miles with T6 in his truck. He could have done the same with Delvac Extreme. All of these oil are carefuly engineered by the additive manufacturers. The labels you see, the advertising, it's just that, marketing. The bottom line is that yoh should use whatever makes yoh feel better. I feel good about using Red Line, but I could as well have used PUP 0W-20 or Mobil 1 EP 0W-20. Picking your motor oil of choice is a bit of an emotional choice.

 

[06 Dodge]

Keep using it then. If i formation on forums was 100% then they would be boring. Truth be told there are three relevant additive companies in the entire world, and the most advanced of them is co-owned by ExxonMobil and Shell and it's called Infineum. PUP and PP now uses the same Dexos 1 G3 additive package as Mobil 1 uses in EP, Vanilla, and AFE. Red Line uses Lubrizol ad their additive and oil formulation supplier. Afton Chemicals is used by lower tier manufacturers. There is a fourth one called Oronite which is owned by Chevron, and used exclusivelly for their own peoducts. AMSOIL is also a Lubrizol customet. Conclusively, motor oils are mostly narketing as no blender is willing to take chances anymore on formulations. They buy them from the additive supplier, with a list of base oils that they work with. Fuel economy is figured in those cookie-cutter formulations. There are very few unique oils left on the market like Mobil 1 FS 0W-40. Rotella T6 is a unique product with a unique additive package. My dad did over a million miles with T6 in his truck. He could have done the same with Delvac Extreme. All of these oil are carefuly engineered by the additive manufacturers. The labels you see, the advertising, it's just that, marketing. The bottom line is that yoh should use whatever makes yoh feel better. I feel good about using Red Line, but I could as well have used PUP 0W-20 or Mobil 1 EP 0W-20. Picking your motor oil of choice is a bit of an emotional choice.

I'm glad I no longer need to worry about what oil to use in her car, she wanted a car that had a lot better fuel mileage an her new car gets 36-40 mpg, her 2018 Journey only saw a best of 22 mpg and all the oil changes are free for a few years on her new car

 

[Travis8352]

I'm glad I no longer need to worry about what oil to use in her car, she wanted a car that had a lot better fuel mileage an her new car gets 36-40 mpg, her 2018 Journey only saw a best of 22 mpg and all the oil changes are free for a few years on her new car

Life was simpler when i didnt worry lol. Oh well it became a hobby

 

[ramffml]

Life was simpler when i didnt worry lol. Oh well it became a hobby

It was. I learned more about oil than I ever want to know and even what I do know is basic and limited. I just stuck in m1 0w-40 as I found it on sale locally and can't seem to find Redline. Will see how it goes, I got about 10 days on it so far and in terms of sound/my ears, it appears to be just as good as RL.

I did add a full can of LG as well to bump up the moly; but then my silly self forgot to account for that extra fluid I poured in first and so overfilled with M1 and ended up draining some stuff out the plug in the bottom again. I hadn't turned over the engine yet before draining (which I should have done), so I fear I lost a lot of LG. Oh well. Blackstone will have fun with this run when I send it to them and better luck next time.

I just hope M1 cleans as well as RL? That's the other draw of RL for me, it appears to keep stuff pretty clean internally or so I've read.

 

[Wild one]

Keep using it then. If i formation on forums was 100% then they would be boring. Truth be told there are three relevant additive companies in the entire world, and the most advanced of them is co-owned by ExxonMobil and Shell and it's called Infineum. PUP and PP now uses the same Dexos 1 G3 additive package as Mobil 1 uses in EP, Vanilla, and AFE. Red Line uses Lubrizol ad their additive and oil formulation supplier. Afton Chemicals is used by lower tier manufacturers. There is a fourth one called Oronite which is owned by Chevron, and used exclusivelly for their own peoducts. AMSOIL is also a Lubrizol customet. Conclusively, motor oils are mostly narketing as no blender is willing to take chances anymore on formulations. They buy them from the additive supplier, with a list of base oils that they work with. Fuel economy is figured in those cookie-cutter formulations. There are very few unique oils left on the market like Mobil 1 FS 0W-40. Rotella T6 is a unique product with a unique additive package. My dad did over a million miles with T6 in his truck. He could have done the same with Delvac Extreme. All of these oil are carefuly engineered by the additive manufacturers. The labels you see, the advertising, it's just that, marketing. The bottom line is that yoh should use whatever makes yoh feel better. I feel good about using Red Line, but I could as well have used PUP 0W-20 or Mobil 1 EP 0W-20. Picking your motor oil of choice is a bit of an emotional choice.

Over a 1,000,000 miles,not saying you're full of it,but that works out to roughly 110 miles every day,X-mas included for 25 years straight with 1 vehicle.If you're referring to a semi truck / tractor trailer unit,you should specify that in your comments,otherwise it's a little hard to believe in my opinion

 

[Rod Knock]

Over a 1,000,000 miles,not saying you're full of it,but that works out to roughly 110 miles every day,X-mas included for 25 years straight with 1 vehicle.If you're referring to a semi truck / tractor trailer unit,you should specify that in your comments,otherwise it's a little hard to believe in my opinion

I thought you knew he was a truck driver. He had the truck for over a decade.

 

[Hemi395]

All is quiet still

 

[Burla]

All is quiet still View attachment 493795

amsoil 0w40 for the hemi tick win... how many miles?? awe I see 2k miles, not ennough to know for sure yet.

 

[Hemi395]

amsoil 0w40 for the hemi tick win... how many miles?? awe I see 2k miles, not ennough to know for sure yet.

I had totally planned on dumping it at 500 miles so just the fact that I made it to 2100+ is very encouraging. If it keeps up ill run it right until fall...

 

[Travis8352]

I had totally planned on dumping it at 500 miles so just the fact that I made it to 2100+ is very encouraging. If it keeps up ill run it right until fall...

Glad its working for you!

 

[Travis8352]

@Hemi395 nexr try castrol edge 10w60! Saw some at my aap lol. Kidding ofcourse

 

[Wild one]

I thought you knew he was a truck driver. He had the truck for over a decade.

Nope,can't say as i've read many of your posts. How does an over the road diesal semi compare to a light duty gas powered 1/2 ton truck ,when it comes to oil

 

[Rod Knock]

Nope,can't say as i've read many of your posts. How does an over the road diesal semi compare to a light duty gas powered 1/2 ton truck ,when it comes to oil

It was right after I joined a couple of years ago that we spoke.

The engine in a semi holds ten to fourteen gallons of motor oil. It's a different ballgame. I used the T6/Delvac example to further illustrate that the big fully vertically-integrated oil companies are all capable of making decent oil. None of them make oil to damage engines. What they do, though, is blend lubricants to a certain price point. That's very true when it comes to PCMO. The HDEO products are a bit different as they have to perform in much more difficult conditions.

lol @tidefan1967 how's the Ford treating you?

I just stuck in m1 0w-40 as I found it on sale locally and can't seem to find Redline.

You will be fine. Back when I was using M1 FS 0W-40 with Lubegard Bio-Tech I used to put 7.5 quarts of oil and half a quart of Lubegard. Then change the ratio to 7 1/4 oil and 3/4 quart of Lubegard. It will run fine, and the additive response is great with that particular Mobil 1 oil.

 

[tidefan1967]

It was right after I joined a couple of years ago that we spoke.

The engine in a semi holds ten to fourteen gallons of motor oil. It's a different ballgame. I used the T6/Delvac example to further illustrate that the big fully vertically-integrated oil companies are all capable of making decent oil. None of them make oil to damage engines. What they do, though, is blend lubricants to a certain price point. That's very true when it comes to PCMO. The HDEO products are a bit different as they have to perform in much more difficult conditions.

lol @tidefan1967 how's the Ford treating you?



You will be fine. Back when I was using M1 FS 0W-40 with Lubegard Bio-Tech I used to put 7.5 quarts of oil and half a quart of Lubegard. Then change the ratio to 7 1/4 oil and 3/4 quart of Lubegard. It will run fine, and the additive response is great with that particular Mobil 1 oil.

Dang bro, another name change? How many is that?