On battery hookup truck cranks no key in?

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lance1586

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Title about sums it up. Ive had this project truck since Feb 21 but only drove it arond the block and on/ off the trailer. I finally got around to doing some things on it and installed a summit carb and finished up with a lokar style cable. got a new battery for it and went to hook it up and start it yesterday. Upon attaching the negative terminal it started to crank. Truck is a manual and was in reverse on a chock. No key in ignition off. I crawled under there this am and nothing it touching anything on the starter. I havent messed with anything electrical or on the ignition switch. I am totally cluelsss as to where to start. Put the key in and in neutral and it still wants to arc and start key off? This is the truck I don't have any history on the truck bought it from a kid in central NE kids Dad handles the sale. It does have three good ground two to the body on to the frame that have been added.
 

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lance1586

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Just need some guidance and direction. I’m not a kid truck was new when I graduated hs. I work on my own stuff but this is a first and don’t know where to start.
 

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OK, I'm a wee bit more awake now. :cool:

Get yourself a Hanes manual or equivalent. Locate the 12 volt (start) line that comes from the ignition switch at the starter solenoid. Or, just locate the starter solenoid and disconnect the wire on terminal S.

It should be located close to the starter or you can always trace the large starter wire back to the solenoid if required.


Dodge starter solenoid.jpg



In the picture above, the smaller terminal is the switched 12 volts from the ignition key switch, terminal S for Solenoid. The two larger terminals are connected between the battery and the starter on large wire to accommodate the starter motor current. The above starter solenoid is rated at 300A.

So, with the switched 12 volt start line disconnected from the starter solenoid (terminal S), reconnect the battery. If it cranks, your starter solenoid has expired. Easy peezey. :cool:

The link above is just for demonstration purposes. You can change the vehicle parameters as required to locate the correct starter solenoid for your truck.

.
 
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lance1586

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Thank you sir that’s what I was looking for much appreciated! Kinda freaked me out when it did that Lol! Glad it was chocked;)
 
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lance1586

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Think I’ll tap on the solenoid too bc goal right now is to just get it started.
 

RamDiver

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Think I’ll tap on the solenoid too bc goal right now is to just get it started.

You're most welcome.

And holy crap, you were lucky to have the wheels chocked. :oops:

I'm guessing the release spring has disintegrated but you never know, it may just be jammed.

My '87 Toyota had a messed up starter solenoid that intermittently would click once or just do nothing. I kept a small hammer in the truck and a slight tap fixed that every time until I finally replaced the internal contacts on the solenoid assembly.

.
 
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lance1586

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Yep and it was parked in my driveway which slopes down it it would’ve popped it would have not been pretty. Luckily it doesn’t have much gas in it and the carb wasn’t primed.
 

RamDiver

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Yep and it was parked in my driveway which slopes down it it would’ve popped it would have not been pretty. Luckily it doesn’t have much gas in it and the carb wasn’t primed.

I was more concerned with the immediate threat of you getting mowed down by your runaway truck.

Then, next would be the innocent neighbors with you running behind the truck, if you weren't already incapacitated.

I'd say you must store a few horseshoes where the sun doesn't shine. :D

So any updates yet Mr. Lucky?

.
 
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lance1586

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Nah, been cold and rainy I work swings drive a Crown Vic as a daily that needs a fuel pump. . I’ll get back when I find something out hopefully tomorrow if the weather cooperates. I get more princess like about what I’m willing to work out in the older I get:)
 
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lance1586

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And I was obviously at the front end of the horse if it had taken off I wouldn’t have gotten trampled neighbors SUVs may have taken a light hit though;)
 

crash68

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until you get this cranking issue resolved, put the transmission in neutral.
 

RamDiver

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Nah, been cold and rainy I work swings drive a Crown Vic as a daily that needs a fuel pump. . I’ll get back when I find something out hopefully tomorrow if the weather cooperates. I get more princess like about what I’m willing to work out in the older I get:)

I understand. The forecast here for today is a mix of rain and freezing rain for the next 11-12 hours, I'm hoping to avoid most of it, if I can.

Rain didn't slow me down much when I was younger either, now, I tend to avoid it, mostly. :cool:

I went through a Crown Vic phase too. Other than the hideous gas mileage, it sure was a comfy ride.

I called mine 'the dive couch' because driving to dive sites was like being parked on a couch.

Good luck with your weather and swing shifts. I'll look forward to hearing your positive results whenever you get back to your truck project. Cheers. :cool:

.
 
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Joseph Godvin

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points stuck together in start relay ??? pull relay in power box ?? before hooking up battery !! just a suggestion from an old school mechanic .
 
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lance1586

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K for my Vic running issue done.

So; today finally had a little time and put in a new Magnum starter on advice of a friend was a hell of a lot easier to get back in bc truck has long tube headers on it. BUT, same stinking thing hook up negative and starter goes to engage. This is the wiring situation I inherited;) but I have done nothing with it obviously and truck started and ran 14 months ago when I brought it home.
 

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lance1586

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Obviously one of the wires to the starter is grounding out its just weird that it’s doing that bc the truck hasn’t been driven since I got it? And again, no tinkering with the wiring. At least it’s just two wires to trace and they don’t run far. Still weird to me.
 

RamDiver

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Obviously one of the wires to the starter is grounding out its just weird that it’s doing that bc the truck hasn’t been driven since I got it? And again, no tinkering with the wiring. At least it’s just two wires to trace and they don’t run far. Still weird to me.

What happened to the investigation of the starter solenoid?

It's the starter solenoid that sends power to the starter motor.

Standard troubleshooting is to start at the beginning and work your way to the end. Unplugging the ignition switch (disconnecting the S terminal) is first, and next is the starter solenoid that are notorious for failing.

Usually, the contacts get pitted or damaged from high current arcing, or contacts get coated with carbon deposits. Then you end up with an intermittent click and no cranking.

Another failure mode is the return spring fails and leaves the contacts closed, which sounds like the problem you described.

Well, look at it this way, your starter should now outlive the truck.

Time to shop for a new starter solenoid.

.
 

RamDiver

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Gonna try the Starter relay next hoping and a prayin;)

You can test the solenoid if you like.

Personally, I wouldn't waste my time but this is your truck and your call.

Remove both positive and negative leads from the battery. Keep the positive lead isolated from the chassis.

On the Solenoid relay, measure the resistance across the two large wire binding posts. My guess says you will see a dead short or close to a dead short (low resistance) across those terminals. Basically, the solenoid has failed closed and is permanently bridging the 12-volt signal to the starter motor.

Without energizing the S terminal first, the resistance across the two large terminals should infinite (open circuit).

This is a basic starter schematic. The small 12-volt lead from the ignition switch feeds the S terminal on the solenoid.

Starter circuit.jpg

.
 

Jim BB

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K for my Vic running issue done.

So; today finally had a little time and put in a new Magnum starter on advice of a friend was a hell of a lot easier to get back in bc truck has long tube headers on it. BUT, same stinking thing hook up negative and starter goes to engage. This is the wiring situation I inherited;) but I have done nothing with it obviously and truck started and ran 14 months ago when I brought it home.
WOW you have a wiring mess there ! I would get a Haynes Manual for the wiring harness ! to correct the wiring issues you have ! going by the pic you sent but hey that is me
 
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