Lift Basics for 2nd gen 4x4 Rams

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va_ram_1500

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I have a 1998 dodge ram 1500 base model. I'm wanting to run 35/12.50r15 bfg k/o. I was looking at a rough country 5 inch. Would this work and Any suggestions as to more modifications such as brake lines or driveshafts. Thanks
 

ramburger

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I have a 1998 dodge ram 1500 base model. I'm wanting to run 35/12.50r15 bfg k/o. I was looking at a rough country 5 inch. Would this work and Any suggestions as to more modifications such as brake lines or driveshafts. Thanks

yea it would work just get the kit it comes with everything u need
 

va_ram_1500

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And will I need off set rims. If so how much
 

ggora

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This thread has great information.

I recently lifted my 01 1500 for my daughter (go figure). Since she stays on the road 99% of the time I just went with the Rough Country 5" lift. Calling them direct got a great price.

I replaced the Steering box with a red head, after the lift too much play, and the trac bar with a moog.

Steering is still looser than I would like, I am looking at replacing the rest of the links as there is some play. My concern is the drag link from the rt wheel to pitman, to get the steering wheel straight I had to loosen the center link tie until there is about 1-1/2 of the links in each end. Is this normal? Safe? Is there a longer center link?

Thanks for the help.
 

Charles.rogers1

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So I'm brand new to the 2nd gen life, ended up buying a lifted 98, with the rough country 5 inch kit.. Which I know isnt the best kit in the world, and im trying to figure out everything I would need to make this 100% complete. I have everything the kit comes with + the pitman arm, still stock track bar which I know is probably throwing my axle way off, as I just spend the money buying the truck I hadnt planned on paying for all this extra stuff but hey, im into it now! so is the trackbar all I really need to grab? best to go full adjustable or could I get be fine with a drop bracket for the stock??

Thanks!
Charles
 

ggora

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So I'm brand new to the 2nd gen life, ended up buying a lifted 98, with the rough country 5 inch kit.. Which I know isnt the best kit in the world, and im trying to figure out everything I would need to make this 100% complete. I have everything the kit comes with + the pitman arm, still stock track bar which I know is probably throwing my axle way off, as I just spend the money buying the truck I hadnt planned on paying for all this extra stuff but hey, im into it now! so is the trackbar all I really need to grab? best to go full adjustable or could I get be fine with a drop bracket for the stock??

Thanks!
Charles

If you are going off road I would suggest a full adjustable and get rid of the drop bracket. I ended up welding the bracket to the frame. Should have went fully adjustable. Also I switched to the 99 HD steering setup which made the biggest difference in steering and control. The other was adding a steering stabilizer, felt much stiffer.
 

Charles.rogers1

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If you are going off road I would suggest a full adjustable and get rid of the drop bracket. I ended up welding the bracket to the frame. Should have went fully adjustable. Also I switched to the 99 HD steering setup which made the biggest difference in steering and control. The other was adding a steering stabilizer, felt much stiffer.

HD steering setup is just switching to the 2500 components?
 

Charles.rogers1

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Couple options. Using the HD kit as they did here: http://www.ramforum.com/f58/heavy_duty_steering-15477/ verify your parts.

Or Mopar has a kit you can buy now to get rid of the Y setup. https://www.rme4x4.com/showthread.php?78067-Bullet-proof-Dodge-steering-upgrade

Ah okay! deff think the HD replacements might be what will come as looking at the truck last night I think I'm gonna end up pretty much replacing the whole front end setup anyways lmao.... Pretty sure the add for this truck said new front end too :flipthebird:

Is the HD stuff actually all a straight bolt in or will there end up being some surprise small mods?
 

ggora

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Ah okay! deff think the HD replacements might be what will come as looking at the truck last night I think I'm gonna end up pretty much replacing the whole front end setup anyways lmao.... Pretty sure the add for this truck said new front end too :flipthebird:

Is the HD stuff actually all a straight bolt in or will there end up being some surprise small mods?

For my 01 it was direct replacement. I just had to weld a different bracket up for my steering stabilzer setup.
 

Bubbabp13

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I have a 1998 dodge ram 1500 base model. I'm wanting to run 35/12.50r15 bfg k/o. I was looking at a rough country 5 inch. Would this work and Any suggestions as to more modifications such as brake lines or driveshafts. Thanks



I have a 99 and it works out great. I'm running 35x12.5x15


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Roadhouse71

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I may be new here but have been messing with 2 gens since 1994 when I bought one new. Everything in the original post is truth. After many trial and errors I now have the almost perfect truck.
 

Miles Doyle

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I hope the mod(s) will forgive me but this is my 950th post. I 've posted this info on and off over the years, but never all of it in one spot.
Maybe this will help some of you younger 2nd gen owners out with some basic info on how to properly lift a 2nd gen 4x4. You can't really cheat on the basic rules of axle travel and 4 link triangulation.

BTW this info also applies to later HD rams with front coil and rear leaf springs.

I read a lot of posts where Ram owners try to fit the largest tire under the least amount of lift. That pretty much works on a street truck but I consider a functional suspension one that works with the tire/wheel combo in any situation. If you have to creep over speed bumps or curbs to get into parking lots without rubbing that's pretty much a failure.

One of the most basic questions asked on Ram forums is how much lift do I need for x sized tires? While fitment is based on a couple other factors such as wheel backspacing and centering, I'll cover the lift basics here.

We'll start with the front suspension. The two ways of adding lift to a Ram is either coil springs or spacers. Rather than debate the logic of one over the other, I'll focus on what happens when you use either.
As a rule of thumb, for every 2 inches you add in lift to your Ram you will move the front axle back about 3/4 of an inch and uncenter under the frame about the same amount. So a 3 inch spacer/spring would move the axle about an inch. A 5 inch (another common size) spring would move your axle back and over about 2 inches, etc. Obviously this causes caster and dog legging issues along with severe triangulation of the factory track bar, control arms and ball joints. It degrades the ride because the of the control arm angles, and places unrealistic loads on shocks, ball joints and the afore mentioned track bar. The front sway bars ability to control body roll is also compromised to the angle of the links which causes them to deflect under load rather than load the bar and vehicle, destroying handling. I'm going to explain in a moment why a properly lifted vehicle retains this piece.

This why quality manufacturers go to great lengths to design suspension systems and not just lifts. A decent suspension system not only lifts the vehicle, but retains a decent ride, handling within reason (NOT removing sway bars) and allow for factory settings of caster and toe in. Cheaper easier to install systems tend to use factory mounting points as much as possible and may require some drilling to bolt things up. Think Rough Country or similar. Higher quality kits will make sure the control arms are as parallel to the frame as possible for a great ride and handling and usually require cutting and welding. Think BDS, Fabtech, or DOR. If the adage is that you get what you pay for it certainly holds true here.

So a proper suspension would include longer control arms to restore caster and ride, some kind of track bar system or bracketry to restore the triangulation of the and center the axle, and if needed, a drop pitman arm to restore steering geometry and reduce bump steer. Lastly, a proper suspension will have links or drop brackets to restore sway bar geometry. Having a lifted vehicle with a higher center of gravity needs all the help it can get, and with a proper non tank like ride will need roll control.

I'm going to reach out on the track bar for a moment. Its seems no other piece on a 2nd gen 4x4 suspension draws more ire or has inspired more design mods then this piece. So lifting a truck and buying another Oem replacement is a waste. There are still about a dozen or so companies that make anything from re thought OEM parts to 3rd gen conversions to designs beefy enough to whack a rhino. Even mods to the OEM bar which can adjust for wear on the stock ball joint. Seriously, your budget should include replacing the track bar with something better.


Someone is thinking...ok what about leveling kits...? Well they do work but you still will move the front axle and with certain wheel/tire combos, you will notice the off center axle from the front of the truck. There's nothing worse then adding a leveling kit to better clear 33 inch tires (a common mod) and then having them rub on the right side inner fender. FAIL!

Since we've covered the basics of front axles, lets talk about the back. There are about 3 common ways to lift the rear suspension on a 2nd gen Ram. They are.. add a leaves/new springs, stacking or longer blocks, and shackle lifts.
To me stacking or replacing blocks is the least preffered method, aibiet the easiest. The danger and carnage of a stacked block setup popping out is still fresh on my mind, decades after seeing it happen. Stacking blocks or taller blocks also induce spring wrap up quicker on slippery or uneven terrain, causing potential drive train damage. Block lifts tend to cause springs to "back arch" over time, requiring replacement. So why do the job twice? Anything over the factory block is too much. Add a leafs or AALs, or new springs are the better/best solutions. BTW, I recommend long style AALs over the shorter ones because they cause the same issues as blocks.

Which ever method you use, you will start to change the geometry of the rear axle as well, moving it forward towards the cab. This becomes noticeable starting with 7 inches of lift and is more pronounced when a shackle lift is utilized. You can compensate by getting new springs with the center bolt off center or a "zero length spring" a short piece of steel that mounts to the existing pack but moves the axle backwards.

I hope this answers some basic questions about how your suspension/steering is affected by installing lift components. I certainly don't consider myself an expert on the subject but after 11 years of owning an modding the same truck and helping a few others with suspension installs, I do consider myself knowledgeable with what not only works, but the perils of failure.

Btw I spend much of my time reading information on other sites as well. This not only includes forums but vendor sites that still build 2nd gen components.
If you are planning something more than a 3 or 5 inch short arm lift I would suggest expanded reading. There are many other sources of information which can offer knowledge of suspension parts, but only a few cater to 2nd gen trucks. Per forum rules I'm not allowed to post them here.

Also a 5 inch lift is the invisible line where anything over that may start requiring more mods.
Thanks for reading!

Edit: I'm adding this information for owners of Off Road Rams and hope you will find this helpful.

What makes an off road ram? Contrary to urban legend...these trucks did NOT come with lift spacers or Cummins diesel springs from the factory. Off road rams came with "special high rate springs" front and rear that lifted the ram. Removed from off roads, the springs have the same length and arch as standard ram springs, but the extra stiffness (higher rate) increases height over a stock Ram.

So, you want to put a 5 inch lift on your off road. The 5 inch lift made by Rough Country says it won't work. Yes it will...BUT...it will only lift your ram about 2 inches over it's stock heigth. It will be 5 inches over a non off road. So if you want to lift your off road 5 inches over its STOCK heigth, you'd need a 7 inch lift. Make sense? Keep reading this until it does.

Conversely, if you want your off road to be 5 inches higher than a non off road ram...add a set of 3 inch spacers, longer control arms and track bar bracket from a 5 inch lift. You may need an add a leaf for the rear but AALS still lift off road rear packs. Your "off road" will now sit 5 inches higher than a non off road. BTW, this is the same setup I run on my non off road.
 

Miles Doyle

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New here. Glad I found you. You sound like you have all the info I need. I have a 2001 2500 with the 4" or what ever off road block lift package. Really wanting to go with the bds long arm 5" lift. Replacing the rear blocks with lifted leaf. What is this you say about track bar. Is the relocation not idea. And now about a little help on which way to go in that area. I want to do this lift to bring a little life back to my truck. Man any advice you can give I'll listen. I'll be doing this lift myself seeing how I used to work at a place installing lifts. Never actually lifted anything of my own tho. I know the set up I'm looking at won't add 5". Maybe 1 or 2 inches of actual lift from where I am now. Don't want to go up just want to improve what is there. Thanks and sorry this reads all over the place.
 

dapepper9

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New here. Glad I found you. You sound like you have all the info I need. I have a 2001 2500 with the 4" or what ever off road block lift package. Really wanting to go with the bds long arm 5" lift. Replacing the rear blocks with lifted leaf. What is this you say about track bar. Is the relocation not idea. And now about a little help on which way to go in that area. I want to do this lift to bring a little life back to my truck. Man any advice you can give I'll listen. I'll be doing this lift myself seeing how I used to work at a place installing lifts. Never actually lifted anything of my own tho. I know the set up I'm looking at won't add 5". Maybe 1 or 2 inches of actual lift from where I am now. Don't want to go up just want to improve what is there. Thanks and sorry this reads all over the place.
He posted this in 2012.... has been on here like once in the last year.

But to address your truck specifically, 2500s didnt have any kind of offroad package. If the rear blocks have a little spike thing pointing towards the diff, those are factory and every 4x4 got those. Some 2500s tend to sit a tad higher sometimes due to the heavy duty towing intended spring packs that some got.

A 5" lift will give you a 5" lift. The BDS is a pretty good kit too. My only gripe is that for what you pay for it, it should be all spring and no blocks. Luckily, Skyjacker sells their spring packs individually for a reasonable price. Can get those through summit. If you have an 8.0/I6, you can likely get $50-100 back pretty easily too by selling your stock front springs. Some guys want to level their 1500s and are scared of spacers and those will lift a 1500 2".

As for the track bar: you have 2 options.
1. Relocation kit- not bad for lower lifts but generally retains a pretty weak bar and just spaces it down. If you want a proper relocation kit you need to look towards the 3rd gen conversion brackets/kits and run one of those adjustable bars. I myself like this route because it eliminates the ball joint end of the track bar and just runs bolts and bushings. No joint to grease or wear out. Worst case, swap out a bushing in 10 years
2. Full adjustable bar. Most come with heim joint ends to be pretty reliable longevity wise. Some aren't as strong as others and will bring flex into your steering
 

Miles Doyle

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He posted this in 2012.... has been on here like once in the last year.

But to address your truck specifically, 2500s didnt have any kind of offroad package. If the rear blocks have a little spike thing pointing towards the diff, those are factory and every 4x4 got those. Some 2500s tend to sit a tad higher sometimes due to the heavy duty towing intended spring packs that some got.

A 5" lift will give you a 5" lift. The BDS is a pretty good kit too. My only gripe is that for what you pay for it, it should be all spring and no blocks. Luckily, Skyjacker sells their spring packs individually for a reasonable price. Can get those through summit. If you have an 8.0/I6, you can likely get $50-100 back pretty easily too by selling your stock front springs. Some guys want to level their 1500s and are scared of spacers and those will lift a 1500 2".

As for the track bar: you have 2 options.
1. Relocation kit- not bad for lower lifts but generally retains a pretty weak bar and just spaces it down. If you want a proper relocation kit you need to look towards the 3rd gen conversion brackets/kits and run one of those adjustable bars. I myself like this route because it eliminates the ball joint end of the track bar and just runs bolts and bushings. No joint to grease or wear out. Worst case, swap out a bushing in 10 years
2. Full adjustable bar. Most come with heim joint ends to be pretty reliable longevity wise. Some aren't as strong as others and will bring flex into your steering
 

Miles Doyle

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Okay but can't I romove the 4" block and go with bds leaf spring. My understanding is it is a factory 4" lift. Wanting to ditch it and go to a five in. Guy bds told me it is a tru 4.5 lift spring. I guess they make the rest up some other way
 
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Okiespaniel

Okiespaniel

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I see this kinda ended in November Needless to say I'm a bit late! Perhaps I can slide through and shed some light on this. This kit will lift your RAM 4.5 inches OVER IT'S STOCK HEIGHT.

This is the 2nd time this week I've seen some one claim their Ram has a "factory" x inch lift. Who comes up with this stuff? GUYS and GALS..You have what the factory put on it. It's the same as nearly every other 2500 Ram has. The after market adds the advertised amount of lift over what the factory installed... if you use new springs. AAL's are sketchy on a high mileage truck.

I was surprised to read the instructions and they didn't mention the rear suspension installation. But I'm fairly certain the rear packs use the factory block. A call to tech should've confirmed that. Otherwise, as Mr Peppers stated you'd have get like a 7 inch leaf spring, plus a zero offset block to recenter your axle.

If you've installed the long arm kit kit you should be very happy with it. BDS makes good stuff and they seem to back their no BS warranty. They've been around since these trucks were "new" and have survived because their stuff works.
 
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