Uncle Tony SPEAKS on cam and lifter failure in 5.7 hemi

pacofortacos · Aug 4, 2020

So far the worst years are 2011-2013 and they drop off above that, some 14's and 15's but less so it seems.

pacofortacos · Aug 4, 2020

Redline has more of the ingredients that other oils are missing.

IMO long oil changes are part of the problem also. If you follow the oil change monitor (at least on the newer trucks) it's close to 10,000 miles which for many people is once a year.

Sherman Bird · Aug 10, 2020

RLJ10X said:
My question is: What can the Engine Rebuilders do to the block to make it flow more oil to critical areas?

^To me, that would be the definitive solution; not that better oils aren't another avenue for the time being.

How long will it take FCA to modify the block to provide the cure?

I totally agree.... the use of a different oil and/or additives may "cure" the problem, but only as a palliative measure.
As a mechanic who had worked on some exotic stuff from Europe, I've seen and worked on engines equipped with small diameter oil feed tubes to address oil starvation issues.... THAT is a fix. A guy with time on his hands and some fabrication skills could easily devise such a retrofit for the Hemi... THUS, a FIX! Not a band-aide!

corneileous · Aug 10, 2020

pacofortacos said:
Redline has more of the ingredients that other oils are missing.

IMO long oil changes are part of the problem also. If you follow the oil change monitor (at least on the newer trucks) it's close to 10,000 miles which for many people is once a year.

And that’s what doesn’t make sense to me. I don’t know if it’s because the oil is different or what between now and 10 years ago but it’s awful funny how my old 2008 Hemi, that is as far as I know the same design as my 18 Hemi, but my old truck said no more than 6 months or 6,000 miles on an oil change. Now my new one however; like you said, is twice as long of an interval or another 4,000 miles beyond that . How?

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Sherman Bird · Aug 10, 2020

corneileous said:
And that’s what doesn’t make sense to me. I don’t know if it’s because the oil is different or what between now and 10 years ago but it’s awful funny how my old 2008 Hemi, that is as far as I know the same design as my 18 Hemi, but my old truck said no more than 6 months or 6,000 miles on an oil change. Now my new one however; like you said, is twice as long of an interval or another 4,000 miles beyond that . How?

Perhaps different manufacturing process and/or materials.... but more likely the pressure from the lazy assed public to make maintenance a lesser thing. Remember that "overall cost to own" is broken down in the algorhythm for that total cost.... In other words, it has nothing to do with actual needs... but politics of Madison Avenue and accountants trying to sway public perception.

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corneileous · Aug 10, 2020

Sherman Bird said:
Perhaps different manufacturing process and/or materials.... but more likely the pressure from the lazy assed public to make maintenance a lesser thing. Remember that "overall cost to own" is broken down in the algorhythm for that total cost.... In other words, it has nothing to do with actual needs... but politics of Madison Avenue and accountants trying to sway public perception.

Wow.. so it’s almost like they are silently making the motors a lot more susceptible to failure all in the name of trying to cut maintenance costs..... figures. Well, I ain’t fallin’ for it. I run good oil, good filter and change it so much more often. Too bad other people believe into the manufacturer’s ********. I love it when people make the excuse that since they [the manufacturer] designed it that way that it’s ok and that they know what they’re talking about when they say it’s ok to run one year, up to ten thousand miles on semi-synthetic oil with a rather low-grade filter. Lol.

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Sherman Bird · Aug 10, 2020

corneileous said:
Wow.. so it’s almost like they are silently making the motors a lot more susceptible to failure all in the name of trying to cut maintenance costs..... figures. Well, I ain’t fallin’ for it. I run good oil, good filter and change it so much more often. Too bad other people believe into the manufacturer’s ********. I love it when people make the excuse that since they [the manufacturer] designed it that way that it’s ok and that they know what they’re talking about when they say it’s ok to run one year, up to ten thousand miles on semi-synthetic oil with a rather low-grade filter. Lol.

Hold your horses there, Buckaroo! Ever increasing demands of the EPA and the NHTSA, along with fierce competition have really made the reality today different than yesteryear in the perspective of the manufacturer. The new CAFE (Corporate Average Fuel Economy) requirements of the Federal Government have really made an impact on the number one thing Americans love so much..... their big, powerful gas hogging "Cadillac-ized" pick up trucks and huge SUV's. That 6000+ pound beast you drive gets over twice the gas mileage of it's predecessors. This has required some sacrifices. Safety requirements have added thousands of dollars to new vehicles in large part, because many morons driving can't turn off the fuggin telephone or leave texting til they're not driving. Our illustrious Government has made the auto manufacturers protect us from ourselves.

The way in which your truck can achieve 20+ MPG is due in large part to engine and engine management design advancement. This makes building a durable 2020 MY truck in a dependable way is a huge challenge against trucks built as recently as 2010... And the challenge is compounded when you bring in older models.

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corneileous · Aug 10, 2020

Sherman Bird said:
Hold your horses there, Buckaroo! Ever increasing demands of the EPA and the NHTSA, along with fierce competition have really made the reality today different than yesteryear in the perspective of the manufacturer. The new CAFE (Corporate Average Fuel Economy) requirements of the Federal Government have really made an impact on the number one thing Americans love so much..... their big, powerful gas hogging "Cadillac-ized" pick up trucks and huge SUV's. That 6000+ pound beast you drive gets over twice the gas mileage of it's predecessors. This has required some sacrifices. Safety requirements have added thousands of dollars to new vehicles in large part, because many morons driving can't turn off the fuggin telephone or leave texting til they're not driving. Our illustrious Government has made the auto manufacturers protect us from ourselves.

The way in which your truck can achieve 20+ MPG is due in large part to engine and engine management design advancement. This makes building a durable 2020 MY truck in a dependable way is a huge challenge against trucks built as recently as 2010... And the challenge is compounded when you bring in older models.

That may be the case but I still stand on what I said. I’m not just gonna bow down and use the same crap they pump in there from the factory, along with their sub-par filter and not change the oil until 10,000 miles rolls over or whenever that redundant oil life meter tells me to. The only thing that thing’s good for is that it actually shows me how many miles has elapsed since my last oil change. I no longer have to put a sticker in the corner of my windshield as a reference point to when it’s time to change it again.

But I dunno, it may be due to how I drive along with the sweet-sounding growl of that Carven exhaust and the lower gear ratios in my truck but this new one really doesn’t get all that much more than my old Hemi.

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Sherman Bird · Aug 10, 2020

corneileous said:
That may be the case but I still stand on what I said. I’m not just gonna bow down and use the same crap they pump in there from the factory, along with their sub-par filter and not change the oil until 10,000 miles rolls over or whenever that redundant oil life meter tells me to. The only thing that thing’s good for is that it actually shows me how many miles has elapsed since my last oil change. I no longer have to put a sticker in the corner of my windshield as a reference point to when it’s time to change it again.

I agree...... old oil in the crankcase can only suspend so much dirt, sludge, and combustion by products like sulfuric acid.
10,000 mile is, in my opinion, too long in regards to contamination suspension. I generally run a WIX or OE on domestic cars/trucks... Nippendenso on Asian cars/trucks/ Mahle on Euro cars/trucks.....

But I dunno, it may be due to how I drive along with the sweet-sounding growl of that Carven exhaust and the lower gear ratios in my truck but this new one really doesn’t get all that much more than my old Hemi.

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pacofortacos · Aug 10, 2020

Yep all about JD Power cost of ownership - which is only measured for the first few years.

dell1991 · Aug 22, 2020

So the solution to help is to switch to redline 5w30 is it safe to run that in the winter too?

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corneileous · Aug 22, 2020

dell1991 said:
So the solution to help is to switch to redline 5w30 is it safe to run that in the winter too?

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I don’t see why not. Lotta people do.

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Ram Wagon · Sep 3, 2020

So I am just curious about the other hemi engines such as the 6.2. I understand but i could be wrong that the 6.4 and 6.2 are the same block design and i do not hear anyone with the 6.2 ever experiencing the cam/lifter failures. and is it just the 16 and older engines seeing the failures? Just asking because I have heard a lot of "info" out there that seems to be all over the place.

Tim Garceau · Sep 3, 2020

It’s not nearly as common on the 6.2/6.4 as those weren’t produced during the penny pinching lifters FCA sourced between 2010-2015.

Don’t stretch your oil change interval or let it idle for extended periods. Not too many people are spending the big money on SRT 392 or Hellcat 6.2L and putzing around but you do see them have the same failure occasionally.

corneileous · Sep 3, 2020

It sounds to me that a lot of it is probably due to the fact that those other engines use a 40 weight oil and not a 20 weight. I’m not necessarily saying I believe it’s because of the 20 weight oil, but I do believe that the majority of these people that are having those problems with the 5.7 are those people that only use what the dealership puts in there which is probably not a top quality full synthetic oil and they’re leaving it in there too long before they change it. That, and I don’t think that Mopar oil filter is all that good either, at filtering out all the contaminants.

So far, the only time my 2 1/2 year-old 5.7 has ever ticked on me is kind of like what it says in the owners manual to where if you start your truck up and then shut it off, and then a little bit a time goes by before you start it up the second time that when you start it up that second time, it’ll tick for a few seconds for a couple seconds and then quit but as far as the actual Hemi tick, I haven’t really experienced that and I still run 20 weight oil. But I’ve always ran a top quality Pennzoil ultra platinum full synthetic oil with a much much better oil filter.

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Sherman Bird · Sep 3, 2020

corneileous said:
It sounds to me that a lot of it is probably due to the fact that those other engines use a 40 weight oil and not a 20 weight. I’m not necessarily saying I believe it’s because of the 20 weight oil, but I do believe that the majority of these people that are having those problems with the 5.7 are those people that only use what the dealership puts in there which is probably not a top quality full synthetic oil and they’re leaving it in there too long before they change it. That, and I don’t think that Mopar oil filter is all that good either, at filtering out all the contaminants.
OK

So far, the only time my 2 1/2 year-old 5.7 has ever ticked on me is kind of like what it says in the owners manual to where if you start your truck up and then shut it off, and then a little bit a time goes by before you start it up the second time that when you start it up that second time, it’ll tick for a few seconds for a couple seconds and then quit but as far as the actual Hemi tick, I haven’t really experienced that and I still run 20 weight oil. But I’ve always ran a top quality Pennzoil ultra platinum full synthetic oil with a much much better oil filter.

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corneileous · Sep 3, 2020

Sherman Bird said:
I wonder about so many in this and other forums...... there is a seeming culture of collective wisdom borne of locker room gossip, urban beliefs, rumors, what grampa put in his Farmall, yada yada yada. Everyone has an opinion and bases it on results of one or more of these factors combined with very little true knowledge. Oil is not a magic "Pookie". Fixing a design flaw with potions is never more than a tattered band-aid.

I do not know if the fellow who says the trouble is related to camshaft location relative to lifter bores is correct, but I'd guess he's full of ****. In the truly large picture, RAM doesn't have a problem in the model of engine in proportion to those that go the life of the vehicle with no problems. I have Ram owners on both side of my house. They both own Rams with Hemis. Neithe doctors the oil or uses some Zulu concoction, they go to the quick change oil places. They are repeat owners of RAMs with Hemis, and have never had these problems. I submit that if we are in a tribe of owners who have a high incidence of this problem, if we step back and observe the total population of RAM trucks, we are but a miniscule percentage. So, If I owned a newer RAM with a HEMI, I'd put what FCA recommends and not worry. I do add BG MOA 115 oil additive for a different purpose which is for overall longevity in terms of hundreds of thousands of miles, not an attempt to alleviate defect specific reasons.

I don’t know man, your neighbors are just two people. There’s a lot of people who were and are having this problem with their engine and it’s been proven on here and on other web forms that heavier oil with better and more anti wear additives cures that hemi tick so, that’s why for the most part I have a hard time listening to what “FCA” says what’s best to run in these engines and for how long you should will run it in there. But there’s also the fact that how come on those older engines, they said it was OK to run a 30 weight oil if a 20 weight was not readily accessible, and now all the sudden they don’t even say that, they say that 20 weight must be used every time? That’s a little fishy to me, and a whole bunch other people too. So again, if you want to trust the Almighty’s at FCA then that’s your choice. I have lifetime warranty on my truck so even if the top quality full synthetic 20 weight oil that I use ever ends up still making me victim of the cam and lifter problems, at least I’m covered by my warranty and always will be for as long as I own the truck.

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ramffml · Sep 3, 2020

Sherman Bird said:
I wonder about so many in this and other forums...... there is a seeming culture of collective wisdom borne of locker room gossip, urban beliefs, rumors, what grampa put in his Farmall, yada yada yada. Everyone has an opinion and bases it on results of one or more of these factors combined with very little true knowledge. Oil is not a magic "Pookie". Fixing a design flaw with potions is never more than a tattered band-aid.

I do not know if the fellow who says the trouble is related to camshaft location relative to lifter bores is correct, but I'd guess he's full of ****. In the truly large picture, RAM doesn't have a problem in the model of engine in proportion to those that go the life of the vehicle with no problems. I have Ram owners on both side of my house. They both own Rams with Hemis. Neithe doctors the oil or uses some Zulu concoction, they go to the quick change oil places. They are repeat owners of RAMs with Hemis, and have never had these problems. I submit that if we are in a tribe of owners who have a high incidence of this problem, if we step back and observe the total population of RAM trucks, we are but a miniscule percentage. So, If I owned a newer RAM with a HEMI, I'd put what FCA recommends and not worry. I do add BG MOA 115 oil additive for a different purpose which is for overall longevity in terms of hundreds of thousands of miles, not an attempt to alleviate defect specific reasons.

Well, Sherman, there are a number of us who have ticking reduced/eliminated with Redline. If you're engine is ticking without, and not ticking with Redline, you have two choices: 1) wave your arms around wildly shouting "pookie" "zulu" and "bandaid" while continuing to use mopar oil, or, 2) use Redline and have a quieter engine. Your choice.

I also find it extremely ironic that you changed the oil you used to increase the longevity. So by your own admission, the mopar oil/filter is insufficient for longevity reasons. Shouldn't be that big of a leap for you to admit that the default oil might have other shortcomings.

bm02tj · Sep 3, 2020

A lot of the spec's are for fuel mileage and maintenance cost as that is what EPA and bean counters look at

corneileous · Sep 3, 2020

bm02tj said:
A lot of the spec's are for fuel mileage and maintenance cost as that is what EPA and bean counters look at

And not to mention the fact that since so many people don’t keep their vehicles longer than five years old, manufacturers really ain’t looking at long-term effects from using a not-so-great oil filter or not-so-great engine oil that I do believe is yes, a rather thin oil for a V-8 engine.

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Uncle Tony SPEAKS on cam and lifter failure in 5.7 hemi

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