Synthetic Oil

Oil of Choice

  • Castrol Syntec/Edge

    Votes: 233 8.4%
  • Royal Purple

    Votes: 325 11.7%
  • AMSOil

    Votes: 396 14.3%
  • Valvoline Synpower

    Votes: 160 5.8%
  • Mobil 1

    Votes: 992 35.9%
  • Other

    Votes: 660 23.9%

  • Total voters
    2,766

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HEMIMANN

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What about Summer weather? Over here our temperatures are like +50.C with humidity to match.

Ah, yes - I moan about living in a 5 percentile climate region of the world, but you surely are less than that. We complain when it gets to 40C here in the summer! But - we also get to -34C in winter. So we have both kinds of weather: dangerous heat AND dangerous cold! Life's better here.

Anyway, Red Line has the highest oxidation resistance of any motor oil because part of it's base oil stock is polyol ester (POE), which is jet engine oil. Significantly higher than API Group IV PAO "real" synthetic. So use Red Line when you can.

From a viscosity standpoint, in my education opinion, you are still fine with 5W-30 unless you tow heavy load in that ambient. Because 5W-30 is one of the most shear-stable and least evaporative of all the multiviscosity formulas.

If you're working your truck in high ambients, I would go to Red Line 5W-40. Red Line uses very robust viscosity index improvers, as evidenced by the NOACK remaining @ 6.0 and HTHS even higher @ 4.4. Just make sure you change ever 5,000 miles in those conditions. With a Royal Purple Oil Filter, too. Spun fiberglass isn't affected by heat and moisture.

 

Rod Knock

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Anyway, Red Line has the highest oxidation resistance of any motor oil because part of it's base oil stock is polyol ester (POE), which is jet engine oil.
There are over 300 polyol esters used in motor oil formulations specifically for internal combustion engines, and none of them is the type used to manufacture jet engine oil. Polyolester fluids have greater film strengths, greater fluidity, spread better, coat better, stick better, and resist high-temperature oxidation better than PAO's or mineral oils. Esters are part of full synthetic oil formulations because they increase additive compatibility, enhance seal swell, increase the VI, and resist high-temperature oxidation. It depends on the formulation and the motor oil that is being manufactured, and the performance targets that the manufacturer sets for said lubricant. RedLine has good marketing, and makes a decent product, however, their oils today are majority PAO, not majority Ester. Should the consumer be concerned with individual components that go into an oil formulation? Absolutely not! The final performance and value for money are all that matter.
 
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HEMIMANN

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I'm not sure why you think I think you're my enemy, you are way too sensitive to be on this forum if you start thinking like that. You're posting stuff I don't agree with, I post a response.

I've also publicly (in this thread) disagreed several times with other posters on whether idling is bad and causes hemi tick, my opinion is that idling does not cause tick, nor is there some flaw in the design with poor oiling (lifter oiling is pressurized, it doesn't need splash oil); I believe it's dirty oil, and/or bad lifter manufacturing on specific lifters. I've also disagreed with the amount of tick cases, I think it's below 1% and others are saying 10%. Point is, none of this is personal, it's just my opinion.

Getting back to the discussion: you said there is no reason to run 0w-30 in winter instead of 5w-30, and you based that on viscosity. I'm saying that is not enough (single metric) to come to a conclusion on what oil is best for (even light) winter usage... as in my experience, there is a difference in engine noise between the two, even above freezing.

I don't know why/when/what is causing the difference, nor do I care to be honest. The difference is there, that's all that matters.

I understood from studying Hemi oil flow diagrams that lifter oil is not pressurized - it is draindown from the heads. Only the MDS latch is pressurized with bore oil, and only when the MDS solenoid valve is opened. There is no lifter bore oil delivered otherwise. There is no other pressurized oil galley delivery oil to the lifters.

Since Hemi cams must be higher in the block to actuate the outboard siamese exhaust valves, there is less splash oil getting up to it, if that is even part of the issue or not. That part Uncle Tony got right, but is it part fo the oil supply for the lifters?

I used your experience with piston slap to go with 0W-30 this winter. Have not heard any slapping, even when in cold ambient at a store. Thanks for sharing this.

I'd suggest giving it up with the other guy.
 
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Rod Knock

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@FalconHemi Thanks for the info. I have used Motul 300V in the HEMI and honestly, the engine sounded a bit noisier than usual, but there was no ticking or anything. At the time, I was trying to get Redline and it wasn't available. So I was wondering what should I get. @Burla suggested Motul because the formula seemed similar to Redline. If Redline wasn't going to be available by the time I needed to change the oil again, then I was going to give Amsoil 5W30 a try.

As stated before, I would prefer to stick with Redline since it has been well documented.
I know that people in Australia love their 0W-40 oils.. I believe Penrite and Caltex are the favored brands over there. I don't know about Ram owners and would love to know what they use since they are quite hard on their vehicles over there with regular outings into the Bush.
Are you running the stock thermostat?
 

quickster2

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I run 0W40 PUP with and XP filter in my 6.4L. I ran 0W40 PUP in Viper with the SRT filter. I ran 0W40 Castrol Edge European and OEM Filter in the Porsche Cayenne S. The Porsche and truck have/had 5K OCI's with the Viper getting changed yearly (typically 1 to 2K miles). Should I go to Redline 5W40 living in Michigan? I have no Hemi tick and I'm at 180 & 1200 idle to run hours on the EVIC. I'm happy with PUP and the Engineer's I dealt with when I was working agreed with no other recommendations unless I was tracking the Viper heavily then 15W50 Mobil 1 would be advised. I have 1 more OCI until I run out of my stash of PUP. 62K on the truck FYI.
 

Burla

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@FalconHemi Thanks for the info. I have used Motul 300V in the HEMI and honestly, the engine sounded a bit noisier than usual, but there was no ticking or anything. At the time, I was trying to get Redline and it wasn't available. So I was wondering what should I get. @Burla suggested Motul because the formula seemed similar to Redline. If Redline wasn't going to be available by the time I needed to change the oil again, then I was going to give Amsoil 5W30 a try.

As stated before, I would prefer to stick with Redline since it has been well documented.
I know that people in Australia love their 0W-40 oils.. I believe Penrite and Caltex are the favored brands over there. I don't know about Ram owners and would love to know what they use since they are quite hard on their vehicles over there with regular outings into the Bush.
It was a theory about Motul, there is not really a substitution for redline 5w30. If you get a chance, buy as much as you can. At any given time I have 3 plus cases in my garage, and I even have more royal purple filters to match it. It is hemi honey, anything else has just not proven to be. you should know brother.
 

Rod Knock

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I run 0W40 PUP with and XP filter in my 6.4L. I ran 0W40 PUP in Viper with the SRT filter. I ran 0W40 Castrol Edge European and OEM Filter in the Porsche Cayenne S. The Porsche and truck have/had 5K OCI's with the Viper getting changed yearly (typically 1 to 2K miles). Should I go to Redline 5W40 living in Michigan? I have no Hemi tick and I'm at 180 & 1200 idle to run hours on the EVIC. I'm happy with PUP and the Engineer's I dealt with when I was working agreed with no other recommendations unless I was tracking the Viper heavily then 15W50 Mobil 1 would be advised. I have 1 more OCI until I run out of my stash of PUP. 62K on the truck FYI.
I like to try out new stuff, as long as it's safe. It sounds like you got well-built engines in those sweet rides. Unless you have a passion for lubes like I do, stick with what works for you.
 

knightjp

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It was a theory about Motul, there is not really a substitution for redline 5w30. If you get a chance, buy as much as you can. At any given time I have 3 plus cases in my garage, and I even have more royal purple filters to match it. It is hemi honey, anything else has just not proven to be. you should know brother.
@Burla Haha.. Thanks for the advise. We need that honey. I plan on being the guy that takes his HEMI engine to a million miles (if I can).
I understood that Motul was just a theory. I don't know about the long term effects of using Motul 300V since I only used it once.
It was more pricier than Redline and the engine was a bit noisier, but still quite smooth. I decided that next time I would try Amsoil 5W30 or 5W40 if there was no Redline.
 

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@Burla Haha.. Thanks for the advise. We need that honey. I plan on being the guy that takes his HEMI engine to a million miles (if I can).
I understood that Motul was just a theory. I don't know about the long term effects of using Motul 300V since I only used it once.
It was more pricier than Redline and the engine was a bit noisier, but still quite smooth. I decided that next time I would try Amsoil 5W30 or 5W40 if there was no Redline.
Sorry but im gonna be the guy with a million mile hemi! Lol in all seriousness redline should work really well for you!
 

Rod Knock

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I decided that next time I would try Amsoil 5W30 or 5W40 if there was no Redline.
The only AMSOIL lubes fit for your climate are the ones below. They all have an HTHS of 3.5 or above, provide good MOFT, carry European OEM approvals, and are loaded with high-quality additive packages.

AMSOIL 5W-30 LS: https://www.amsoil.com/p/sae-5w-30-ls-synthetic-european-motor-oil-ael/
AMSOIL 5W-40 MS: https://www.amsoil.com/p/sae-5w-40-ms-synthetic-european-motor-oil-afl/
AMSOIL 5W-40 FS: https://www.amsoil.com/p/sae-5w-40-fs-synthetic-european-motor-oil-efm/

I plan on being the guy that takes his HEMI engine to a million miles (if I can).
How often do you service your transmission?
Do you run the stock 203F thermostat?

I understood that Motul was just a theory.
It's not a good idea to test out other people's theories on your engine. Especially by putting racing oil in your engine.

I don't know about the long term effects of using Motul 300V since I only used it once.
Racing oil is formulated to provide maximum wear protection for the duration of a race, multiple track sessions, etc. There aren't prescribed OCIs for racing oils because racing teams usually tear down their engines, and based on measurements and observations of the engine internals, they decide how long to run a racing oil.

Racing oil contains very high amounts of anti-wear additives and low amounts of detergents and dispersants. This is so that anti-wear additives can benefit from the most surface area inside the engine and not get washed away by the detergents.

Among those high amounts of anti-wear additives is ZDDP, which is corrosive at high treat rates. So, depending on how long you had that racing oil in there, you might be okay.
 

ramffml

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Response from Dave @ Redline:

I am unsure whether the noise is piston slap or in the valve train, I have heard various explanations.

Customers have experienced a reduction using our oils, regarding the difference between our 0W30 and 5W30, the 0W30 would be a little lower viscosity at low start up temperatures, possibly getting up to the valve train quicker. The HTHS/film strength is about 10% higher with the 5W30. The 5W20 though would be a lower viscosity at lower temperatures.

Nothing really conclusive there unfortunately.
 

HEMIMANN

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Response from Dave @ Redline:



Nothing really conclusive there unfortunately.

No, but it basically confirms the Forum's assessment of viscosity selection.

SAE viscosity grades are wide enough to be misleading for application. One has to look at viscosity curves. It isn't obvious Red Line 5W-20 has lower viscosity below the "W" measured temp of 0 degrees F than Red Line 0W-30.

That said, if we're towing during winter, I'd want 0W-30 anyway, because the "W" and lower viscosity is ONLY for starting and warm up condition. While important, so is what you do with the vehicle once it's warm.
 

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Nothing really conclusive there unfortunately.
I'm still glad he responded. I have probably around thirty email exchanges with him, and while not always satisfying my neverending curiosity, it's more than I got from any other lubricant manufacturer.

After looking at @Hemi395's UOAs, where he used 0W-30 and 5W-30, I can draw the following conclusion based on the fact that RedLine is blended with a majority PAO base stock:
- 0W-30 sears under repeated heat cycles -> lighter PAO base stock + more VI
- 5W-30 thickens under repeated heat -> heavier PAO base stock + less VI - it is possible that the little VI that's in there still shears under heat, yet at the same time, the rest of the lube thickens.

It is possible that they purposefully designed formulated their oils this way.

Unfortunately, Dave's reply did not satisfy our curiosity. Interestingly enough, Dave didn't mention how these lubes are classified. RedLine themselves classifies 5W-20 and 0W-30 as ACEA A5/B5 and 5W-30 as ACEA A3/B4. Still, if it works for you and you're satisfied with the results, then keep doing what you're doing.
 

HEMIMANN

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Yaaaasss.
That's the original recipe with high calcium low magnesium.
Copper is tad high, so was mine. Iron wear is moderate and fine.

Note TBN is fine. Like I've said, it really only measures how much antioxidation additives remain.

The oil itself can go longer, but Hemis being so sensitive to contaminants and filters we been changing @ 5,000 miles. Even with Red Line.
Still relatively cheap insurance for an expensive engine.
 

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@Burla

Check out this 2 year interval uoa on a hemi! 5w20 redline
That is sweet man, where did you find that? Young engine and probably mirrors the best ever uoa on the board for a hemi, I envy that hemi, lol. 5w20 isnt a bad move for hemi's at all, as long as it aint ticking.
 

JHoward

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Yaaaasss.
That's the original recipe with high calcium low magnesium.
Copper is tad high, so was mine. Iron wear is moderate and fine.

Note TBN is fine. Like I've said, it really only measures how much antioxidation additives remain.

The oil itself can go longer, but Hemis being so sensitive to contaminants and filters we been changing @ 5,000 miles. Even with Red Line.
Still relatively cheap insurance for an expensive engine.


Yes, "Still relatively cheap insurance for an expensive engine".
 
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Travis8352

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That is sweet man, where did you find that? Young engine and probably mirrors the best ever uoa on the board for a hemi, I envy that hemi, lol. 5w20 isnt a bad move for hemi's at all, as long as it aint ticking.
Caught my eye on bitog. Tbn made me almost think it was your 2 year uoa but wear is nice here
 
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