Kicking around the idea of replacing mechanical fan with electric one.

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corneileous

corneileous

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A clutch fan driven by the water pump will always spin, the clutch part just alters how much power is used to spin the blade. It's possible when the clutch is disengaged to stop the fan from spinning but will start once you let go.
For the AC purposes it better to have a constant airflow over the condenser vs a start/stop of an electric.
True but as I’ve already said, the electric condenser fan takes care of that because anytime the AC is on, it’s going to turn that fan on so in essence, there really shouldn’t be that issue.
 
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corneileous

corneileous

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Just change the thermostats, and adjust the values.
I would love to but being that I’ve got a lifetime warranty, that would involve buying a programmer and the essential equipment to bypass the security module and then dropping in a thermostat that’s a lot colder than what the engine was designed with. Sure, taking off all but the top and bottom rows of the AGS louvers and removing the engine fan would go against my warranty but at least if I have to truck take the truck in for anything, I can easily put those louvers back in and put that mechanical fan back on and make it look like it was never removed.
 

Docwagon1776

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Really? Hmm. I’ve always heard it was about a 25hp gain with noticeable mileage increases.

No. Maybe some massive fan with the clutch locked up and the motor screaming forcing the fan to 9500 RPM or something, but you are not going to see 25hp from removing a clutch fan for these trucks at RPMs you'll be using. Even if you add stickers.

You won't see much, if any, fuel economy gains. It still takes energy to spin the fan when it needs to spin, but now it'll be drag from the alternator making more electricity to get that energy for the fan to spin.

What you will do is satisfy your urge to tinker and make it more difficult to use your warranty should you need to. I would suggest finding another outlet for your tinkering needs, but you do you.
 
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corneileous

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No. Maybe some massive fan with the clutch locked up and the motor screaming forcing the fan to 9500 RPM or something, but you are not going to see 25hp from removing a clutch fan for these trucks at RPMs you'll be using. Even if you add stickers.

You won't see much, if any, fuel economy gains. It still takes energy to spin the fan when it needs to spin, but now it'll be drag from the alternator making more electricity to get that energy for the fan to spin.

What you will do is satisfy your urge to tinker and make it more difficult to use your warranty should you need to. I would suggest finding another outlet for your tinkering needs, but you do you.
OK, well everything you said does make sense, I understand that I probably won’t be seeing high numbers in extra fuel mileage or won’t feel anything at the pedal as far as extra power but isn’t that just a little bit much of a stretch to say I won’t see or feel anything because of the extra draw on the alternator to run the condenser fan- that’s already on there that if I might add, pretty much runs all the time anyway because of my AC? If the mechanical fan will no longer be there, the OE condenser fan isn’t gonna be running anymore than it already is because of the AC.

And you’re right about the warranty but that’s why at this point, why I’ve pretty much decided that if I do anything, I won’t be completely deleting the AGS, only part of it just to allow constant airflow all the time and just simply removing the mechanical clutch fan just to see how well the condenser fan can keep everything cool without it and like I said before, if it doesn’t work or if I have to take my truck in for anything, putting the mechanical fan back on and adding the louvers back and won’t be hard to do. I’m no longer considering a colder thermostat or an aftermarket electric cooling fan or even the V6 fan. The V-6 fan is still in kind of in the back of my head only because primarily I could get rid of that huge fan shroud if I switched over to that but at this point, I may not even go that route.
 

pacofortacos

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Really? Hmm. I’ve always heard it was about a 25hp gain with noticeable mileage increases.



Like I said, I’ve heard conflicting stories on it and as a matter of fact, I have tried this before and it was on a 2004 Dakota with the 4.7 V8. Worked ok, even in the summer for the most part but pulling a single axle flatbed trailer with just two quads on it made it get a little warm, tho. Felt like It did free up quite a bit of power and actually helped on fuel mileage… But also though, that was on a smaller pickup with a much smaller engine and as far as how big that condenser fan was compared to the one that’s on my half ton and, how much air it flowed compared to the one that’s on my full size, I don’t know, but I guess maybe it could be worth a try. The only thing that would concern me is the fact that my current Hemi runs a lot hotter than that Dakota did and how that condenser fan won’t turn on until it hits 220°.

I guess who knows, if removing the mechanical fan actually allows my truck to warm up a little faster being that the clutch fan will no longer be there to continuously pull cold air through the radiator, I could go ahead and partially delete my AGS again to help with airflow between that time because at least one thing about it, being that my truck has the auto climate control, the AC is on pretty much all the time if you have the temperature set low enough so hopefully the fan would be on a lot more often because of that which would mean the only time I could have a problem with overheating would be in the winter time when you’re not running your truck as cold on the inside.


It probably is working just how it should be but because of how it works, even though it may not be using a whole lot of energy to turn it, it’s still turning and that’s a pretty big fan that’s still gonna pull a lot of air even if it’s not taking a whole lot of energy to make it turn. If this clutch fan works the way it did in my semi where it completely stops when not needed, then I wouldn’t need to take it off at all but like I said, being that it still turns whether it’s actually engaged or not, that’s why I would still want to delete it.

So what are you saying, the older trucks with a clutch fan and an electric condenser fan doesn’t pull as much electricity as the fans on the newer trucks that don’t have a clutch fan?

I’ve watched several videos online and read several discussions where the Mopar V6 fan will bolt right up to where the stock condenser fan attaches and it will plug right in to the same connector as the condenser fan does…

The only thing I would be curious about between using the stock condenser fan versus the cooling fan for the V6 engines would be which one of those is going to pull the most air and work the best at cooling that V8 properly? We are talking a smaller V6 versus a larger V8 but… The condenser fan on the Hemi trucks is not the engine’s primary source of cooling like it is on the V6 trucks, if that even matters. Another good question to ask would be how does the Mopar V6 fan; being that you say it works pretty much the same way as the new electric fan does on the newer trucks, how do they compare when it comes to airflow?
The newer truck fans use less electricity overall - unless they are really spinning . They can vary the amount of air flow needed. Ours are on or off - full tilt or not at all.

The V6 fan most refer too is the old 3.7 V6, not the newer Pentastar V6 3.6.
The old V6 fan has a good shroud and is an inch or so larger than our stock fan
 

pacofortacos

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When I did the partial, I removed all but the top and bottom rows so that the actuator could still work without deleting it.

Do you have the auto climate control and if you did, did you use it religiously like I do? As I mentioned in my previous post, I don’t think I’d ever have to worry about my condenser fan waiting to turn on at 220° because even in the winter, my A/C is pretty much on all the time so my condenser fan should be too for the most part.

In light of this discussion, I’m really considering trying the clutch fan removal and removing all but my top and bottom rows of the AGS.

That’s good to hear. I was hoping it would be sufficient enough to do the job by itself.
I do have the dual auto climate and since I use the truck on trips, I generally have the AC on all of the time also. However in the winter the conderser fan might not be on all of the time - it depends on the pressure in the AC system.

It's free to try with just pulling the clutch fan - which can be done without removing anything but the fan itself, though it is tough to fish out past the belt and shroud :) It will come out though
 

dgarber12771

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Interesting discussion. Having come from a 2015 Challenger R/T to my current 2021 Warlock, I love the clutch fan. When I went to the 180 stat in the Challenger, I had to change the temp values for the electric fan with my tuner. Then I got a check engine light, so my tuner guy had to send me a tune to eliminate that (PCM didn't like the cooler temps). It was a giant PITA and even with the modified fan settings, the temps still varied more than I liked.

With the clutch fan, my temps never range much beyond 197-205, whether stopped, driving summer or winter. If I wanted to run a cooler stat, I could just swap it and not have to mess with anything else to see results.

And I agree with Doc - ain't no way you'd see 25hp from a clutch fan delete. You might see an honest 5hp, but IMO I'd give that 5hp every time for the consistent cooling the clutch fan gives.

If you like to tinker as another poster mentioned, go for it. But I don't think you'd get any real/tangible benefits from it.
 
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I don’t know guys, this has been a good conversation but maybe I am just better off to leave it alone. If there was anything really that I would like to do, it would still be removing the clutch fan and either partially deleting or completely deleting the AGS but instead of relying on the condenser fan to do the cooling, I’d feel much safer with that V6 fan only because being that it has the shroud on it and being that it was actually designed to be used as a primary cooling fan, I’d rather use that instead but the only problem with that is, that’s a fan that’s not made for my truck… And after watching a video where a guy did swap in a V6 van, it really didn’t look all that hard and he actually got good results. I don’t think he really talked a whole lot about any freed up power running a stock tune but he did say that he picked up at least another 1 to 2 miles per gallon that even though the fan that he used was just one of those that it’s either on or off, he said he got real really good consistent cooling and even with the stock 205° thermostat, even in stop and go traffic where it was like 95° outside, his truck stayed right at about 200°. Of course, that’s not really saying a whole lot because being that the fan is plugged into the same spot where the condenser fan was plugged in, when it’s that hot outside and you’re running the AC, that fan’s not go to wait to turn on when the engine hits 220 because it’s gonna always going to be on anyways as long as the AC is on. The real test would be to see how it is when it’s cold in the winter time when you’re really not using your AC as much but then again, if the AGS is gone, you’re gonna have a lot more consistent airflow anyways at highway speeds coming through your radiator as there was before so, I don’t know… Lol. Like I said, maybe I’ll just be better off to leave it alone.
 

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So, why and what exactly are you tuning for the thermostat? In your case, the fan on and off temps I can see, being that you went with the Mopar V6 fan since it’s plugged into factory wiring but what exactly is the need for tuning the thermostat? You are talking about the mechanical thermostat where the coolant comes out of the engine and into the top of the radiator, correct? Or are you talking about the temp sensor the computer reads to know when to open/close the shutters or turn the condenser fan on/off?

But yeah, being that mine is a 2018 with that security module I’d have to bypass and even if I went with a Diablo Sport or Edge Pulsar tuner that piggybacks the ECM, I don’t know if I want to mess with a tuner because it it under warranty but then again, this might all be questionable anyways ditching the mech fan, the condenser fan and going down to a much cooler thermostat for the engine…..lol.
Yes, I meant the mechanical fan. As I understand it there are system settings for when to trigger the fan so the benefit of the tuning is matching when the fans are triggered to the new thermostat temps. I've seen claiming both to work fine, but also the non-tune folks run the air when the temps rise to trigger the fans. I believe the shutters also will still stay closed until the stock ECU temp is reached (but I think you're planning on dealing with those too).
 
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Yes, I meant the mechanical fan. As I understand it there are system settings for when to trigger the fan so the benefit of the tuning is matching when the fans are triggered to the new thermostat temps. I've seen claiming both to work fine, but also the non-tune folks run the air when the temps rise to trigger the fans. I believe the shutters also will still stay closed until the stock ECU temp is reached (but I think you're planning on dealing with those too).
I might still delete it some day being that I did get a little cooler running temps but as I said earlier, if I do, it would only be if I got rid of the mechanical clutch fan as well because I’m pretty sure the reason why my truck took a lot longer to warm up when all I did was just partially delete the AGS was because even though the mechanical clutch fan supposedly didn’t have a whole lot of energy turning it, it was still in fact turning which was allowing it to pull a lot more cold air from the outside through the radiator because the AGS wasn’t there to block it off. I may be wrong but it kind of seems to me that being that the mechanical clutch fan still turns all the time, it’s almost kind of like you do have to have the active grill shutters so the truck can actually warm up faster due to the clutch fan always trying to move air through the radiator.
 

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I did the full v6 fan conversion and 180 t-stat change... the hardest part was taking the grill off and roating the washer fluid pump to get enough slack in the wiring harness. I ordered the fan from rockauto. I believe it was for the 2011 v6 durango so it had the same plug as my truck fan. I havnt bothered to tune the truck at all. I usually run around with the A/C on in the summer. That alone kicks the electric fan on. I also removed the extra louvers from the ags (free mod). Havnt had a CELs, over heats or any problems so far. My biggest fear is the fan failing.
 

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I did the full v6 fan conversion and 180 t-stat change... the hardest part was taking the grill off and roating the washer fluid pump to get enough slack in the wiring harness. I ordered the fan from rockauto. I believe it was for the 2011 v6 durango so it had the same plug as my truck fan. I havnt bothered to tune the truck at all. I usually run around with the A/C on in the summer. That alone kicks the electric fan on. I also removed the extra louvers from the ags (free mod). Havnt had a CELs, over heats or any problems so far. My biggest fear is the fan failing.
I agree with the fan failing fear, my clutch fan stays in the bed of my truck just in case. Lol
 
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I did the full v6 fan conversion and 180 t-stat change... the hardest part was taking the grill off and roating the washer fluid pump to get enough slack in the wiring harness. I ordered the fan from rockauto. I believe it was for the 2011 v6 durango so it had the same plug as my truck fan. I havnt bothered to tune the truck at all. I usually run around with the A/C on in the summer. That alone kicks the electric fan on. I also removed the extra louvers from the ags (free mod). Havnt had a CELs, over heats or any problems so far. My biggest fear is the fan failing.
So how come you used a fan out of a Durango instead of the one for our trucks that comes with the V6? They the same fan, or what?
 

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Interesting topic.

If I were you I would leave things as is that being said because you have a lifetime warranty.

Suppose something happens with the electric fan and causes an issue where your truck will need to be serviced?

I'm not a mechanic and wouldn't know what issues could arise, but having something else in place that doesn't really benefit anything for the better might ought to be left alone. jm2¢

IMO, What if the electric fan failed and caused your engine to overheat? Reinstall the clutch fan that came on it originally and have it towed to the dealer for warranty repair?

I'm quite certain that that the service techs would investigate all possible issues but would be scratching their heads on a perfectly good clutch fan?

It's your truck and do as you want and enjoy it.

JHoward
 

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So how come you used a fan out of a Durango instead of the one for our trucks that comes with the V6? They the same fan, or what?
Look at the power connector on rock auto and look at the one on your truck. Mine is a 2014 so it might have a different connector than yours. Make sure they match up for plug and play.
 
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Interesting topic.

If I were you I would leave things as is that being said because you have a lifetime warranty.

Suppose something happens with the electric fan and causes an issue where your truck will need to be serviced?

I'm not a mechanic and wouldn't know what issues could arise, but having something else in place that doesn't really benefit anything for the better might ought to be left alone. jm2¢

IMO, What if the electric fan failed and caused your engine to overheat? Reinstall the clutch fan that came on it originally and have it towed to the dealer for warranty repair?

I'm quite certain that that the service techs would investigate all possible issues but would be scratching their heads on a perfectly good clutch fan?

It's your truck and do as you want and enjoy it.

JHoward
I suppose if I had to guess, an electric fan would probably be a lot more likely to fail than a mechanical clutch fan would and yes, I know, even though the newer trucks don’t even have a mechanical fan anymore but, mine does so yeah, they could possibly hold that against me but then again, I guess it all boils down to how much leverage the Magnuson moss act would have even on a warranty like that that wasn’t necessarily a manufacturer warranty and if the rule would still apply that they would still have to prove that by me removing the mechanical clutch fan and replacing it with an aftermarket electric fan or even a same brand fan from the same truck but with a different engine.

But I understand completely what you’re saying when you said if perhaps the truck had to get hauled in behind a tow truck to the shop for an overheating problem but mysteriously there’s nothing wrong with the mechanical clutch fan and there’s some other electric fan whether it’s aftermarket or some other Mopar fan found in the place of the original condenser fan but, I dunno. I’ve heard of people spinning on brand new Mopar oil filter on the engine after it blew up just so that when it went to the shop, they couldn’t place the blame on an aftermarket oil filter.

But then again, a good lawyer has gotten people their claims when the manufacturer said they weren’t going to honor it but all in all, I may not even do anything because even though some people have said they’ve been OK with just relying on the stock condenser fan without the mechanical clutch fan, I would still feel better with the electric fan that comes in the V6 trucks only because it’s larger and it has a fan shroud to pull more air through the complete radiator instead of just the center of it but then again if something was to happen, that fan would give them something to be a lot more suspicious about because it’s not the original fan so like I said, I’ll probably just end up leaving it alone because what I wanna do requires too much extra stuff.
 

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Cylinder bores don't stabilize until about 190, and that is the thermostat I would run, with the fan on temp around 195. I did this and am VERY happy with my freezing cold ac and lower temps while towing.
 

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