Pentastar vs Hemi, which should you choose?

Wahrsuul said:

And yet it seems that an I6 is in it's future....

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RLJ10X said:

Our Federal Government is telling us what engine we can and cannot buy;

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ramffml said:

I would love more details on your new setup. What's the length and weight of your trailer, and also what RPMs do you sit at when towing around 60 mph?

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star_deceiver said:

I’ve had this truck for 10 days, nothings been hooked up yet. Still need to track down lighter bars for the WDH.

The old trailer:
View attachment 492112
2009 Gulfstream Emerald Bay 31USSS. Weighed a hair over 8000lbs with 1200lbs tongue. Very big, very nice couples trailer, lots of space. It was also 37’ long hitch to bumper and fit practically nowhere but RV parks. Paid $13125, traded in for $17200.

The new one:

View attachment 492113

2015 Coachman 230RBS. Weighs 4800lbs wet, 700lbs tongue. 24’ hitch to bumper. slides on both sides. $25000 before trade in.

Also in the pics you can see the 10’ squaredrop/cargo I build during one of the lockdowns. 1200lbs with 165lbs tongue. Can fit a proper queen bed with space at the rear. Full rear cargo doors. Steel full boxed frame.

Tried the big trailer life, not for me.

Gas today is $1.54/L at the regular stations. Went to Edmonton yesterday, from Airdrie, round trip gas cost $120. Would have been $150+ with the 6.4. That adds up quickly.

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I'll take this over the 70's and 80's when they started mandating emissions equipment that crippled so many great vehicles.

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PoMansRam said:

The 1500's really do ride nice. Nice looking warlock.

I don't think I've ever seen a crew cab warlock in my area or any CC / pentastar 4th gen for that matter. They're all quad cabs.

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Huliodude said:

When I was in the market for a 4th Gen Ram 1500 Classic, I was pretty torn about whether to go with the Pentastar V6, or the Hemi.

It can be difficult to make the right decision with just a short test drive from the dealer. Now that I’ve owned both, I wanted to give a detailed account of the differences, and things to watch out for. Yes, the topic has been beat to death but I think there’s quite a bit of generalization and points not mentioned.

Bear in mind, this perspective comes from someone who could easily do without a truck, I don’t tow, don’t need to haul, but the idea of driving a pickup truck was in the back of my mind for many years. I had owned mostly sporty cars, some of my favourites being a fox body Mustang 5.0 LX trunk with a manual, a c4 Corvette, an e90 328i, e92 335i, and an f30 335i. The biggest reason I looked at RAMs was because of the ZF 8 speed. It was awesome in the f30. I’ve never felt an auto transmission work so well before.

The very first truck I ever owned ended up being a 2019 Ram 1500 Classic Crew Cab 4x4 with a 3.55 gear and 20” wheels. I put on 67,000km on it, or 41,631miles. I loved this truck! Fantastic on gas, quiet, smooth, cavernous space inside, great visibility on the road. Finally I could stop paying for premium gas, and run plain old regular.

It’s funny how once you own a truck, a million reasons come up for owning one. It just made life so much easier. Carrying house materials, dirt bikes, bicycles, Christmas trees, snow blowers, dishwashers, firewood, furniture, all sorts of stuff I could have never done with a car.

Ok, the good about the V6 RAM.

It’s fantastic on gas for how big and heavy this truck is.
The 3.55 gear ratio allows it to get out of its own way.
The Pentastar is very quiet and very smooth.
It’s easy to change the oil, and doesn’t require any special oil type.
This drivetrain is very car like. It shifts smooth, the engine is quiet, idles super smooth, very low NVH. I can’t say enough good things about this engine.
If you rev it out, it’s surprisingly powerful.
The transmission is quick to downshift giving your the revs you need to accelerate.

The bad about the V6 RAM.

It’s very low on torque for a truck this heavy, especially below 3000rpm. If you want power, you need to rev it and put your foot in it.
I test drove it with the 3.21 gear, and I honestly wouldn’t recommend it. The 3.55 should be the longest gear RAM offers, and leave the 3.21 option for the Hemi.
Even with the 3.55 gear, the motor cannot hold 8th gear on even the slightest of inclines on the highway. It downshifts a lot, simply because the motor lacks torque at lower RPM’s.
When you rev it beyond 3500rpm, it doesn’t sound great. It sounds like you’re pushing it hard, and it’s not particularly enjoyable.

I now own the exact same truck except it’s a 2021 classic, with a Hemi and 3.21gear and ZF 8speed. I’ve only put about 3,000km on it, but I’ve got a pretty good feel on most aspects of this setup.

The good about a Hemi powered RAM.

Wow, the difference in power is nothing short of shocking, even though I went down to a 3.21 gear. If you look at a HP/torque dyno chart of a stock 5.7 Hemi, you’ll see this motor makes far more torque at even 1200rpm than the Pentastar can make at any RPM!
The grunt this burly V8 provides makes it feel like a different truck, and you end up driving it different. For example, on ramps to the highway are now fun. Getting up to speed and well beyond are no issue. Is your lane ending? In a V6 you need to brake and go behind whoever is next to you. In the Hemi, you can be a hooligan, step on it and blow the doors off the guy next to you.
This motor does everything effortlessly, while the V6 works hard in this truck.
You can go about your day taking it easy, and the engine will never go over 2000rpm. And it takes a lot more than a small incline to get this motor to require a downshift. It rarely needs to downshift, and the transmission generally shifts much less often.
Even if you tow or haul nothing, you will definitely use the power this engine offers just in regular driving situations. The fact that it tows more is just a bonus.
It gets surprisingly good highway mileage.
It has very good engine braking.
This engine sounds great, is happy to rev if you want it to, and it never sounds strained. It’s a testament how good the old school pushrod V8 design is. It still competes with much more modern engines.

The bad about the Hemi powered RAM.

It’s definitely thirstier, by about 10% from what I can tell. It’s particularly worse in the city, and just idling it a red light seems to consume more fuel than the v6.
Because the engine is a lot heavier, you feel it in the truck. The truck is less nimble, especially noticeable on more spirited right hand turns.
I understand oil changes are not easy or as clean as the V6. Not looking forward to that.
MDS…. While it saves gas and that’s great, you definitely feel it when it’s active. It’s vibrates a fair amount and the V6 is much smoother when cruising for this reason. I don’t dislike it enough to disable it since I enjoy the fuel savings, but I’m surprised the price you pay in NVH.

Other differences I noticed.

The V6 exhaust has a drone when it’s below 0c outside.
The V8 dual exhaust is louder than the V6, but not annoyingly so. If you want the quietest truck overall, the V6 is your choice.
The V8 is slower to get into gear when you put it in D. It’s slower than I’d like.
The V6 doesn’t have much engine braking. You’d think the lighter truck would be easier on the brakes, but it’s definitely the opposite, the V8 is easier on the brakes.
When MDS deactivates on the Hemi, the torque converter briefly unlocks to smooth out the transition to 8 cylinders. This is noticeable, and another reason why I don’t like MDS too much. It makes for a busier drivetrain.
The V6 engine takes longer to warm up than the V8. However, the V6 has a transmission warmer as well as a cooler, and in cold Canadian climates, the trans warmer is welcome. The V8 only has a trans cooler, and takes about 4 times as long to warm up. The V6 trans can be at full operating temperature in 15mins, and the V8 can take upwards of an hour in cold climates. That can’t be good for fuel economy, and the Hemi can use all the help it can get.
The V6 cabin heater is just adequate, the V8 will melt the skin off your face. Crazy hot.
No idea if the V6 vs V8 air conditioning is any different, perhaps someone can chime in on that.
The V6 makes the truck feel more “car like”, the V8 feels more like you’re driving a truck, whatever that means to you.
The V8 front end dives more on braking, probably due to the extra weight up front.

My overall opinion

While I don’t need to tow or haul, I still prefer the Hemi. The extra fuel consumption is worth it. To put the 10% difference in fuel costs into perspective: I spent about $3k in gas last year with the V6, and with the Hemi I’ll spend $3300, all things being equal. The V6 burns 90% of the gas the Hemi does. But it only gives you 77% of the horsepower, and only 66% of the torque. This shows just how efficient the Hemi really is. Now I realize peak output is rarely used, but it’s the extra power everywhere across the RPM range that really changes the the driving experience.

In all fairness, if you own a V6 with a 3.55 gear, I do believe it’s also a fantastic choice, albeit less fun and capable in most ways than the V8.

If you have a V6 with the 3.21, well…. You’re a better man than I.

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Huliodude said:

When I was in the market for a 4th Gen Ram 1500 Classic, I was pretty torn about whether to go with the Pentastar V6, or the Hemi.

It can be difficult to make the right decision with just a short test drive from the dealer. Now that I’ve owned both, I wanted to give a detailed account of the differences, and things to watch out for. Yes, the topic has been beat to death but I think there’s quite a bit of generalization and points not mentioned.

Bear in mind, this perspective comes from someone who could easily do without a truck, I don’t tow, don’t need to haul, but the idea of driving a pickup truck was in the back of my mind for many years. I had owned mostly sporty cars, some of my favourites being a fox body Mustang 5.0 LX trunk with a manual, a c4 Corvette, an e90 328i, e92 335i, and an f30 335i. The biggest reason I looked at RAMs was because of the ZF 8 speed. It was awesome in the f30. I’ve never felt an auto transmission work so well before.

The very first truck I ever owned ended up being a 2019 Ram 1500 Classic Crew Cab 4x4 with a 3.55 gear and 20” wheels. I put on 67,000km on it, or 41,631miles. I loved this truck! Fantastic on gas, quiet, smooth, cavernous space inside, great visibility on the road. Finally I could stop paying for premium gas, and run plain old regular.

It’s funny how once you own a truck, a million reasons come up for owning one. It just made life so much easier. Carrying house materials, dirt bikes, bicycles, Christmas trees, snow blowers, dishwashers, firewood, furniture, all sorts of stuff I could have never done with a car.

Ok, the good about the V6 RAM.

It’s fantastic on gas for how big and heavy this truck is.
The 3.55 gear ratio allows it to get out of its own way.
The Pentastar is very quiet and very smooth.
It’s easy to change the oil, and doesn’t require any special oil type.
This drivetrain is very car like. It shifts smooth, the engine is quiet, idles super smooth, very low NVH. I can’t say enough good things about this engine.
If you rev it out, it’s surprisingly powerful.
The transmission is quick to downshift giving your the revs you need to accelerate.

The bad about the V6 RAM.

It’s very low on torque for a truck this heavy, especially below 3000rpm. If you want power, you need to rev it and put your foot in it.
I test drove it with the 3.21 gear, and I honestly wouldn’t recommend it. The 3.55 should be the longest gear RAM offers, and leave the 3.21 option for the Hemi.
Even with the 3.55 gear, the motor cannot hold 8th gear on even the slightest of inclines on the highway. It downshifts a lot, simply because the motor lacks torque at lower RPM’s.
When you rev it beyond 3500rpm, it doesn’t sound great. It sounds like you’re pushing it hard, and it’s not particularly enjoyable.

I now own the exact same truck except it’s a 2021 classic, with a Hemi and 3.21gear and ZF 8speed. I’ve only put about 3,000km on it, but I’ve got a pretty good feel on most aspects of this setup.

The good about a Hemi powered RAM.

Wow, the difference in power is nothing short of shocking, even though I went down to a 3.21 gear. If you look at a HP/torque dyno chart of a stock 5.7 Hemi, you’ll see this motor makes far more torque at even 1200rpm than the Pentastar can make at any RPM!
The grunt this burly V8 provides makes it feel like a different truck, and you end up driving it different. For example, on ramps to the highway are now fun. Getting up to speed and well beyond are no issue. Is your lane ending? In a V6 you need to brake and go behind whoever is next to you. In the Hemi, you can be a hooligan, step on it and blow the doors off the guy next to you.
This motor does everything effortlessly, while the V6 works hard in this truck.
You can go about your day taking it easy, and the engine will never go over 2000rpm. And it takes a lot more than a small incline to get this motor to require a downshift. It rarely needs to downshift, and the transmission generally shifts much less often.
Even if you tow or haul nothing, you will definitely use the power this engine offers just in regular driving situations. The fact that it tows more is just a bonus.
It gets surprisingly good highway mileage.
It has very good engine braking.
This engine sounds great, is happy to rev if you want it to, and it never sounds strained. It’s a testament how good the old school pushrod V8 design is. It still competes with much more modern engines.

The bad about the Hemi powered RAM.

It’s definitely thirstier, by about 10% from what I can tell. It’s particularly worse in the city, and just idling it a red light seems to consume more fuel than the v6.
Because the engine is a lot heavier, you feel it in the truck. The truck is less nimble, especially noticeable on more spirited right hand turns.
I understand oil changes are not easy or as clean as the V6. Not looking forward to that.
MDS…. While it saves gas and that’s great, you definitely feel it when it’s active. It’s vibrates a fair amount and the V6 is much smoother when cruising for this reason. I don’t dislike it enough to disable it since I enjoy the fuel savings, but I’m surprised the price you pay in NVH.

Other differences I noticed.

The V6 exhaust has a drone when it’s below 0c outside.
The V8 dual exhaust is louder than the V6, but not annoyingly so. If you want the quietest truck overall, the V6 is your choice.
The V8 is slower to get into gear when you put it in D. It’s slower than I’d like.
The V6 doesn’t have much engine braking. You’d think the lighter truck would be easier on the brakes, but it’s definitely the opposite, the V8 is easier on the brakes.
When MDS deactivates on the Hemi, the torque converter briefly unlocks to smooth out the transition to 8 cylinders. This is noticeable, and another reason why I don’t like MDS too much. It makes for a busier drivetrain.
The V6 engine takes longer to warm up than the V8. However, the V6 has a transmission warmer as well as a cooler, and in cold Canadian climates, the trans warmer is welcome. The V8 only has a trans cooler, and takes about 4 times as long to warm up. The V6 trans can be at full operating temperature in 15mins, and the V8 can take upwards of an hour in cold climates. That can’t be good for fuel economy, and the Hemi can use all the help it can get.
The V6 cabin heater is just adequate, the V8 will melt the skin off your face. Crazy hot.
No idea if the V6 vs V8 air conditioning is any different, perhaps someone can chime in on that.
The V6 makes the truck feel more “car like”, the V8 feels more like you’re driving a truck, whatever that means to you.
The V8 front end dives more on braking, probably due to the extra weight up front.

My overall opinion

While I don’t need to tow or haul, I still prefer the Hemi. The extra fuel consumption is worth it. To put the 10% difference in fuel costs into perspective: I spent about $3k in gas last year with the V6, and with the Hemi I’ll spend $3300, all things being equal. The V6 burns 90% of the gas the Hemi does. But it only gives you 77% of the horsepower, and only 66% of the torque. This shows just how efficient the Hemi really is. Now I realize peak output is rarely used, but it’s the extra power everywhere across the RPM range that really changes the the driving experience.

In all fairness, if you own a V6 with a 3.55 gear, I do believe it’s also a fantastic choice, albeit less fun and capable in most ways than the V8.

If you have a V6 with the 3.21, well…. You’re a better man than I.

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Tombstn said:

I for one wouldn't get the Pentstar 3.6L, they are junk. My wife has a 2018 Durango with the Pentstar 3.6L, that they said they fixed in the 2100 -2013 years for blown head gaskets. The vehicle has 100,000 miles on it and now needs a new head gasket because of the same flaw that was present in previous years. I also own a 2021 Ram 1500 and am wondering if I should go back to Chevy. The have their problems but not like this.

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Wanted33 said:

Having decided that the Ram 1500 Crew Cab would be our next truck I was fine with the 3.6L as the one in my Wrangler has been great. Smooth running with slick shifting 8 speed. When I had the conversation about the 3.6L with the wife all she said was "you do remember the F-150 with the 6 cylinder that you never liked". Then I began thinking of the 6 in the F-150, and as we all know the Pentastar make all of it's torgue way up in the rpms. The 3.6 in the Wrangler downshifts if it just smells a hill ahead. With 500-600 lb in added weight the Ram has, I decided I would go with the 5.7L so there would be no second thoughts about my engine decision.

The Pentastar in my Wrangler has been a joy to drive, but if I have second thoughts about anything on the new Ram I will never be happy with the thing. And the thing cost to dang much to not be happy with it.........

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Wanted33 said:

Having decided that the Ram 1500 Crew Cab would be our next truck I was fine with the 3.6L as the one in my Wrangler has been great. Smooth running with slick shifting 8 speed. When I had the conversation about the 3.6L with the wife all she said was "you do remember the F-150 with the 6 cylinder that you never liked". Then I began thinking of the 6 in the F-150, and as we all know the Pentastar make all of it's torgue way up in the rpms. The 3.6 in the Wrangler downshifts if it just smells a hill ahead. With 500-600 lb in added weight the Ram has, I decided I would go with the 5.7L so there would be no second thoughts about my engine decision.

The Pentastar in my Wrangler has been a joy to drive, but if I have second thoughts about anything on the new Ram I will never be happy with the thing. And the thing cost to dang much to not be happy with it.........

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turkeybird56 said:

Just a lil expensive, but, yer wallet, and backside, watever makes it happy. I personally would never do a V6 in a truck except for Diesel, and I got rid of my ED before things got weird. 5.7L // 6.4L all gonna drink that liquid gold. They R not made for 40 mpg, Prius be the choice there, lmao.

ADDED: And I oh so luv the power availability, tho I do try to keep foot out of the "carburetor" and run cruise, especially on IH 35 where everybody running 80-90 mph. All my thoughts IMHO ONLY !!!!!

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