Synthetic Oil

Call me crazy, but of something that was 5 dollars could kill my tick, I would use that over a 14 dollar oil that can also kill my tick. Bad luck for me as I watched a knocking hemi go quiet with the 14 dollar stuff, if I was new to this I might be inclined to try a strategy that also made since and if it didnt work fall back on the nuclear option. Since it was 5w20 that killed my tick, it is a fact it wasnt the viscosity that killed my tick as the oils that it was ticking was similar viscosity, so for my tick it is additives or 4/5 base oils or both. This is not the case with all hemi tick, you don't know til you try., Some ticks will be killed with viscosity, we don't know how many of them, but some will.

Burla said:

Call me crazy, but of something that was 5 dollars could kill my tick, I would use that over a 14 dollar oil that can also kill my tick. Bad luck for me as I watched a knocking hemi go quiet with the 14 dollar stuff, if I was new to this I might be inclined to try a strategy that also made since and if it didnt work fall back on the nuclear option. Since it was 5w20 that killed my tick, it is a fact it wasnt the viscosity that killed my tick as the oils that it was ticking was similar viscosity, so for my tick it is additives or 4/5 base oils or both. This is not the case with all hemi tick, you don't know til you try., Some ticks will be killed with viscosity, we don't know how many of them, but some will.

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Well, ok, but for those of us who since retired, or stopped driving much due to the pandemic, our oil changes are limited to just once or twice a year anyway, so it's not that much of an extra expense to go to Red Line anyway - for us. For guys still putting on miles, sure.

And besides - the metal clinging affinity of the polyol ester base stocks in Red Line has a big benefit to marginally-lubricated machine elements, too. It not only tends to hold the oil itself in place, but keeps the soluble moly and zinc in place for start ups and idling.

Anyway, we now know Burla is a joke.

Burla said:

Call me crazy, but of something that was 5 dollars could kill my tick, I would use that over a 14 dollar oil that can also kill my tick. Bad luck for me as I watched a knocking hemi go quiet with the 14 dollar stuff, if I was new to this I might be inclined to try a strategy that also made since and if it didnt work fall back on the nuclear option. Since it was 5w20 that killed my tick, it is a fact it wasnt the viscosity that killed my tick as the oils that it was ticking was similar viscosity, so for my tick it is additives or 4/5 base oils or both. This is not the case with all hemi tick, you don't know til you try., Some ticks will be killed with viscosity, we don't know how many of them, but some will.

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I’ll be your Guinea pig: going from pup 5w20 (will do UOA) to m1 0w40 tonight since I have a trip tomorrow and will use redline next oc and will post all uoa’s.

Black1500Ram said:

I’ll be your Guinea pig: going from pup 5w20 (will do UOA) to m1 0w40 tonight since I have a trip tomorrow and will use redline next oc and will post all uoa’s.

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awesome, looking forward to it... If you will do a uoa on m1, I'd suggest a real interval. Maybe dont need tbn unless it kills your tick and you are sticking with it.

1st uoa on redline is a tossaway, long story. The value is in getting tbn not wear numbers on the first one.

HEMIMANN said:

Well, ok, but for those of us who since retired, or stopped driving much due to the pandemic, our oil changes are limited to just once or twice a year anyway, so it's not that much of an extra expense to go to Red Line anyway - for us. For guys still putting on miles, sure.

And besides - the metal clinging affinity of the polyol ester base stocks in Red Line has a big benefit to marginally-lubricated machine elements, too. It not only tends to hold the oil itself in place, but keeps the soluble moly and zinc in place for start ups and idling.

Anyway, we now know Burla is a joke.

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I subscribe to most of this post

like 92/93% of it spot on.

KKBB said:

The 20-820 fits just fine on my 2019 6.4. I got mine through royal purple direct. It was a while ago...6 months or so, but I ordered 6 of them and they were a few bucks cheaper a piece by ordering 6 and they were shipped fast.

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I must have a mutant truck. Oh, well - I'm happy with my 20-500 filters.

Well, I'm calling Amsoil SS 0w40 good at this point. 3246 miles on it and still silent. I can't say I'd recommend this to anyone that already has a ticking hemi, but it definitely gets my stamp of approval for keeping it quiet.

Hemi395 said:

Well, I'm calling Amsoil SS 0w40 good at this point. 3246 miles on it and still silent. I can't say I'd recommend this to anyone that already has a ticking hemi, but it definitely gets my stamp of approval for keeping it quiet.
View attachment 496752

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Did you add Lubegard to it?

HEMIMANN said:

Did you add Lubegard to it?

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Nope, just plain SS 0w40

Hemi395 said:

Nope, just plain SS 0w40

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Wow. Think it is viscosity-related, too?

HEMIMANN said:

Wow. Think it is viscosity-related, too?

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That was my original thought, but I ran RL 0w20 over the winter with good results. So yeah idk.

The only thing I can think of is Amsoil upped the Ester content of their SS oils to comply with SP specs. Other than that I have no idea why this worked. I fully expected to be dumping it before 500 miles like when I tried SS 5w30. Even had 2 gallons of RL 5w30 on my work bench ready to go right after I poured in the SS 0w40 lol

Hemi395 said:

That was my original thought, but I ran RL 0w20 over the winter with good results. So yeah idk.

The only thing I can think of is Amsoil upped the Ester content of their SS oils to comply with SP specs. Other than that I have no idea why this worked. I fully expected to be dumping it before 500 miles like when I tried SS 5w30. Even had 2 gallons of RL 5w30 on my work bench ready to go right after I poured in the SS 0w40 lol

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But viscosity might be different enough in wide ambients. Yes I know engine oil is supposed to settle in at coolant temp, but it is only where the oil temp sender is located. I'd think bulk oil temp would be lower in winter, with corresponding higher viscosity.

@Hemi395 AMSOIL is not trying to comply with API SP, though they use the same Lubrizol Dexos G1D2 additive package in the entire SS lineup. So ester content has nothing to do with it.

In fact, AMSOIL has access to both Esters and ANs, and they use both. Esters and ANs are used to keep the engine clean and as seal swellers, that's it. They have poor cold flow properties, so every blender tries to use as little as possible if both, especially in 0W-X oils.

Two things keep the HEMI from making weird noises:
1) A clean engine. There is an ester based engine cleaner from HPL that will rinse out an engine over a 5K OCI.
2) Apprpriate HTFS that will keep loose tolerances in check. AMSOIL SS 5W-30 has considerable lower HTFS and lower Ester/AN content than 0W-40.

I'd expect that you should get the same results on Mobil 1 FS 0W-40.

Surprisingly, our 2017 Hyundai Santa Fe loves Red Line 5W-30.

Even Red Line is made mostly from PAO, with just enough Esters to keep the seals from drying and to keep the engine clean and deposit free. Red Line doesn't use ANs as far as I know. They are so heavily invested in Esters that they have no reason to go for ANs, even though they should.

Hemi395 said:

That was my original thought, but I ran RL 0w20 over the winter with good results. So yeah idk.

The only thing I can think of is Amsoil upped the Ester content of their SS oils to comply with SP specs. Other than that I have no idea why this worked. I fully expected to be dumping it before 500 miles like when I tried SS 5w30. Even had 2 gallons of RL 5w30 on my work bench ready to go right after I poured in the SS 0w40 lol

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Amsoil made that choice a while back to go completely knees deep in api's pond. That 0w40 amsoil ss is way thicker then the super class 0w40's, but maybe one of those will be needed to keep piston slap away. Hopefully not, but it might. I think that 0w40 is the thickest thing you tried? So good news in some cases going thick is the win for hemi tick. That is two full points above already thick redline 5w30, so good to know for options. If not for our issue having hemi tick and cold piston slap, me thinks there is at least a chance you will need a summer and a winter oil.

amsoil took that huge step with the reformulation, now it might be simple changes to meet new specs, without the grand todah like the did when they announced they married the api.

Yup. More smoking gun pointing to inadequate lubrication of lifters.
Which is why I've split off between winter and summer viscosities.

Still unsure what to do for winter when Red Line switches to SP on 0W-30. Maybe buy a couple cases now and not worry about it?

Yeah, major disappointment right, or is it? We know the formula will change, but we don't know if the tick killing ability will change because it will still be ester/pao. I have to hear some guys saying the ticks came back before putting into our knowledge base as fact.

Too bad if that 0w30 doesnt work because we know some rams get the piston slap on 5w30, yes this will be a new time of research to find the answers. Super Class 0w40's might be the answer here, likely with lubegard.

Elite Race Fab is running another sale on Red Line Motor Oil. Both 0W-30 & 5W-30 are $11.71 per quart in gallon jugs and $11.93 per quart in quarts.


Price on other sites has gone up from $12.95 per quart to $14.something per quart. I scored 4 gallons of 0W-30 because it's still the original API SN recipe (hasn't been revised to SP yet). I've got enough 5W-30 for a couple of changes already.

Then maybe the world will end within several years. Or I will.

HEMIMANN said:

Elite Race Fab is running another sale on Red Line Motor Oil. Both 0W-30 & 5W-30 are $11.71 per quart in gallon jugs and $11.93 per quart in quarts.

Red Line 5W30 Motor Oil Gallon 15305

Produced in only one top-of-the-line grade, these products offer the highest quality available on the market today and in the widest variety of viscosity Full-synthetic ester formula for passenger cars, light trucks, performance vehicles and marine applications Designed to provide the highest...

eliteracefab.com

Price on other sites has gone up from $12.95 per quart to $14.something per quart. I scored 4 gallons of 0W-30 because it's still the original API SN recipe (hasn't been revised to SP yet). I've got enough 5W-30 for a couple of changes already.

Then maybe the world will end within several years. Or I will.

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Your all set now!

Question, do you think fca avoided true fixes to the hemi cam issue on purpose?

Correct me if I'm wrong and I may be, but the only thing they did to address hemi tick was 7 years in they made some needle bearings larger? An act by itself proves they were worried about it. Even though needle bearings are only the issue in a small number of hemi can fails, and it would be my belief those bearings didnt fail because of the size of the needle, but they actually failed because of back pressure from the lifter bodies movement in the bore.

They didnt even consider putting in a high volume oil pump this entire time? They didnt increase the oil galleys in hemi's from 2009 to current? They havent done anything to the lifters/cam relationship except for increase needle bearing size? 2009 to now 2022 and in 5 gen section it appears these issues are still prevalent even in rams 13 years later.

What else did fca didnt do? They didnt change the oil viscosity recommendation like they did for the eco diesel with internal problems, even though that could have possibly saved some cams? You are fca now stell... for a day, how do you fix this or maybe through some strategies at it? No throwing an oil strategy at it doesnt count, that is our deal, something even potentially better?

No sending a "Guinness" to find the root cause neither

They will "fix" it by rolling out the Hurricane, and putting the Hemi out to pasture.