6.4 HD Oil Question

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Zoe Saldana

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The 0W-40 is really a heavy 0W-30 that shears down the vii additive to a true 0W-30, or less

FCA only spec'd it because the 6.4 was in the cars 1st. There's nothing special about the 6.4 in a truck. It's not a race vehicle. Some guys take them racing, of course, but not the typical owners.
Racers change oil often. Typical truckers don't want to change oil every 500 miles to prevent shear down deposits in the engine.


The 6.4L in trucks is different then cars e.g. crank shaft and other HD parts.
 

boblonben

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I just traded my '07 Silverado 2500 with a Duramax in on my '17 Ram 2500 6.4 and have a question about using the extra oil that I have. It's Mobil Delvac 1300 Super 15W-40 with an API CK4 rating. Will it be OK to run this oil in the 6.4s? I know that you can use oil designed for diesels in gas engines provided that it meets or exceeds API SN ratings BUT the SRT 6.4s are VERY picky about what oil you use, but what about the 6.4s designed for truck use?


The following is directly from Mobil's web site:
"Accordingly, this oil also meets or exceeds the requirements of API CK-4, CJ-4, CI-4 PLUS, CI-4 and CH-4 service categories, as well as key OEM requirements. Mobil Delvac 1300 Super 15W-40 engine oil is universal, meaning it may also be used in gasoline engines requiring the API SN specification.
Mobil Delvac 1300 Super 15W-40 diesel engine oil is recommended by Exxon Mobil for use in:
High-performance gasoline engines requiring API SN specification."


So it seems to me that it is safe to use, but I would like to hear from somebody with more knowledge than me before I do anything.


I would really like to use this oil seeing as how I have almost 2 cases left over from my Silverado days.
NO, double NO. Your 6.4L is NOT designed for the diesel weight oil, itg is designed I believe for either 0W-40, or 5W040 and you need to use that oil weight. Otherwise over time ou will score the piston walls at best and at worst damage the valve train. Give the other crap away or something but do not use it.
 

boblonben

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The new ck-4 is more like gas engine oil then ever before, there is no issue with running that oil in your truck. It is likely better for that engine then srt oil itself as in it wont shear like 0w40 PUP will. The only "possible" downside is running it int he cold, due to it's thickness and lower cold performance rating there is some possibility of cold piston slap. If the truck lives in Virginia, likely wont be an issue. The moly level is not impressive at 42ppm, srt oil is near 250ppm, if you so chose you can add some lubegard biotech 15 ounce and bring that moly level to something fca wants you to run. Except for moly level, this oil is serviceable for the 6.4 as long as you want to run it.

Here is a voa



.
Outside temp really is not in the discussion, it is engine temp for like cold start vs warm start and running etc. 0 and 5W are important based on the engine design and tollerances. Whether or not ou live in VA or Yukon it don't make any difference, use the damn recommended oil and quit trying to second guess what the engineers designed the damn motor to. For Christ sake do not follow most of the egg heads who just live on Royal Purple, Redline, etc BS.
 

Mike Moseley

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I just traded my '07 Silverado 2500 with a Duramax in on my '17 Ram 2500 6.4 and have a question about using the extra oil that I have. It's Mobil Delvac 1300 Super 15W-40 with an API CK4 rating. Will it be OK to run this oil in the 6.4s? I know that you can use oil designed for diesels in gas engines provided that it meets or exceeds API SN ratings BUT the SRT 6.4s are VERY picky about what oil you use, but what about the 6.4s designed for truck use?


The following is directly from Mobil's web site:
"Accordingly, this oil also meets or exceeds the requirements of API CK-4, CJ-4, CI-4 PLUS, CI-4 and CH-4 service categories, as well as key OEM requirements. Mobil Delvac 1300 Super 15W-40 engine oil is universal, meaning it may also be used in gasoline engines requiring the API SN specification.
Mobil Delvac 1300 Super 15W-40 diesel engine oil is recommended by Exxon Mobil for use in:
High-performance gasoline engines requiring API SN specification."


So it seems to me that it is safe to use, but I would like to hear from somebody with more knowledge than me before I do anything.


I would really like to use this oil seeing as how I have almost 2 cases left over from my Silverado days.
 

Mike Moseley

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I have had 2 5.7 hemi in Ram pick up trucks and i have run 15w40 Rotella in everyone and have put 180,000 miles on them with no trouble ever. in fact the engines ran much quieter. forget that manual they manufactures only run thin water for oil for cafe reasons. do not listen to these people that are trying to scare you, and by the way my MDS works perfect
 

joesstripclub

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My only hesitations would be the cold weight and the fact that it's not synthetic. Most people seem to recommend not going back to conventional oil after you use synthetic. It would take you a while to use it, but you could always mix a couple quarts in with each oil change. There are a lot of turbo cars out there that run 5w-40 rotella so just because its diesel oil doesnt mean it wont work in a gas car.
 

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I have had 2 5.7 hemi in Ram pick up trucks and i have run 15w40 Rotella in everyone and have put 180,000 miles on them with no trouble ever. in fact the engines ran much quieter. forget that manual they manufactures only run thin water for oil for cafe reasons. do not listen to these people that are trying to scare you, and by the way my MDS works perfect
Legit strategy right here, there is two choices if you are unhappy with the book lubrication, use a thicker viscosity or use heavy additives and base oils. As long and the mds is working good and the engine temperature is not high, this is a solid choice. This entire "tolerances" argument ignores simple knowledge on viscosity, even cold 0w20 is thicker then warm 140 weight gear oil, so it is always the proper question to address the temperature. It is a fact what works in Tenn might not work in Alaska, no matter how hard manufacturers want to lump everyone into one bowl.
 

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I guess we should add that ambient temperature is important during engine startup, especially Hemi's as this engine has a marginally-lubricated valve lifter and camshaft lobes. Starving it of oil as little as possible is very important in preservice the lifter rollers and needle bearings.

Also important is high ambient temperature and heavy tow loads. These demand a heavier than 20 wt viscosity with heavy supplemental dry lubricant additives to handle the higher loads and thinning of the oil under these conditions.

The OEM is clearly influenced by U.S. EPA C.A.F.E. fuel economy standards, as they all are, hence recommending minimum viscosity oil under grocery-getting driving application - NOT under heavy loads and high temperatures. This is a well known OEM response to the C.A.F.E. standards across all manufacturers - it is not an "OEM knows everything" scenario. I worked for an engine OEM. They are NOT omnipotent.
 

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"adequately" no; properly yes.
With all respect sir, what hemimann is saying is from his understanding of the life span of 0w40, in fact proven with uoa's at ram forum, 0w40 PUP the intended oil for the 6.4, spends like less then 10-20% of it's lifespan in 40 weight on a 10k mile interval. So literally 80% of the time that 0w40 is actually a 5w30. Many were posted here lately, mind you this is a 4k mile interval, note the cSt viscosity in 3 uoa's, it is in 30 weight below 12.25. If FCA wanted the 6.4 in 40 weight, they would have recomended 15w40 like everyone else. Manu's are using 0w40 for a different purpose lately. Many other uoa's show 0w40 PUP in the 10's with more miles, you go long enough that 0w40 will be a 20 weight. Because the 0w40 PUP isnt dexos or other stay in grade specs, it is full of vii's that shear and are useless molecules not helping lubrication. Why someone would use a 30 weight instead of 0w40 in a 6.4 is to have less vii's. It doesnt matter in the middle of the interval whether you chose 0w40 or 0w30 or 5w30 or 10w30, in the middle of the interval the weight will be 30 weight, FACT. Another fact, all of those 30 weights will be lubricating better because they will have less vii's, so less useless molecules, fact 2 and why hemimann says what he says.

img_0165-jpg.151656
 

HEMIMANN

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With all respect sir, what hemimann is saying is from his understanding of the life span of 0w40, in fact proven with uoa's at ram forum, 0w40 PUP the intended oil for the 6.4, spends like less then 10-20% of it's lifespan in 40 weight on a 10k mile interval. So literally 80% of the time that 0w40 is actually a 5w30. Many were posted here lately, mind you this is a 4k mile interval, note the cSt viscosity in 3 uoa's, it is in 30 weight below 12.25. If FCA wanted the 6.4 in 40 weight, they would have recomended 15w40 like everyone else. Manu's are using 0w40 for a different purpose lately. Many other uoa's show 0w40 PUP in the 10's with more miles, you go long enough that 0w40 will be a 20 weight. Because the 0w40 PUP isnt dexos or other stay in grade specs, it is full of vii's that shear and are useless molecules not helping lubrication. Why someone would use a 30 weight instead of 0w40 in a 6.4 is to have less vii's. It doesnt matter in the middle of the interval whether you chose 0w40 or 0w30 or 5w30 or 10w30, in the middle of the interval the weight will be 30 weight, FACT. Another fact, all of those 30 weights will be lubricating better because they will have less vii's, so less useless molecules, fact 2 and why hemimann says what he says.

img_0165-jpg.jpg

I'm an engineer, not a speech writer!
 

Burla

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I'm an engineer, not a speech writer!
That's what i'm for :)

Here is another, a bunch of different 0w40's even the mighty redline, which might be worse then all of them. Even a 5w40 tossed in. Interesting you see the 5w40 only buys you about .5 visc in shear, still too much swing between winter rating and weight. When looking for 0w40's best pratise if find one with Porsche and Mercedes specs, just maybe they add enough pao to keep it in grade. Every oil in this uoa is now a 30 weight.

well BITOG dont want to share uoa's, here the thread note the uoa. Mind you thins is a Nissan, your hemi's are most likely gonna shred viscosity a lot more imo.

oil-jpg.84382
 

Zoe Saldana

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With all respect sir, what hemimann is saying is from his understanding of the life span of 0w40, in fact proven with uoa's at ram forum, 0w40 PUP the intended oil for the 6.4, spends like less then 10-20% of it's lifespan in 40 weight on a 10k mile interval. So literally 80% of the time that 0w40 is actually a 5w30. Many were posted here lately, mind you this is a 4k mile interval, note the cSt viscosity in 3 uoa's, it is in 30 weight below 12.25. If FCA wanted the 6.4 in 40 weight, they would have recomended 15w40 like everyone else. Manu's are using 0w40 for a different purpose lately. Many other uoa's show 0w40 PUP in the 10's with more miles, you go long enough that 0w40 will be a 20 weight. Because the 0w40 PUP isnt dexos or other stay in grade specs, it is full of vii's that shear and are useless molecules not helping lubrication. Why someone would use a 30 weight instead of 0w40 in a 6.4 is to have less vii's. It doesnt matter in the middle of the interval whether you chose 0w40 or 0w30 or 5w30 or 10w30, in the middle of the interval the weight will be 30 weight, FACT. Another fact, all of those 30 weights will be lubricating better because they will have less vii's, so less useless molecules, fact 2 and why hemimann says what he says.

img_0165-jpg.151656
> less then 10-20% of it's lifespan in 40 weight on a 10k mile interval.

There is part of your problem. You are running the oil too long - see below.

Also, if you tow a lot you should do it sooner than 8K.

NOTE: Under no circumstances should oil change intervals exceed 8,000 miles (13,000 km), twelve months or 350 hours of engine run time, whichever comes first. The 350 hours of engine run or idle time is generally only a concern for fleet customers
 

Burla

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I posted 9 uoa's all under 8k miles, everyone of them, look at cSt visc, second line on bottom section. The point is using 5w30 in 0w40's stead is scientifically sound, hemimann is correct. It also correct to run what the manu says, just know if you do run what the book says your engine will in fact have more carbon building molecules that will create more contamination in your truck then if you ran a stout 30 weight. If you think 0w40 stays 0w40 that is completely incorrect, it does not, as noted in 9 uoa's many different oils.
 

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> less then 10-20% of it's lifespan in 40 weight on a 10k mile interval.

There is part of your problem. You are running the oil too long - see below.

Also, if you tow a lot you should do it sooner than 8K.

NOTE: Under no circumstances should oil change intervals exceed 8,000 miles (13,000 km), twelve months or 350 hours of engine run time, whichever comes first. The 350 hours of engine run or idle time is generally only a concern for fleet customers

10% of 10,000 miles is 1,000 miles after which sheardown of light 40 wt with lots of vii additives to 30 wt has already occurred.

OCI doesn't matter, unless you're gonna change 0W-40 every 750 miles, is the point, here.
 

Zoe Saldana

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10% of 10,000 miles is 1,000 miles after which sheardown of light 40 wt with lots of vii additives to 30 wt has already occurred.

OCI doesn't matter, unless you're gonna change 0W-40 every 750 miles, is the point, here.
I posted 9 uoa's all under 8k miles, everyone of them, look at cSt visc, second line on bottom section. The point is using 5w30 in 0w40's stead is scientifically sound, hemimann is correct. It also correct to run what the manu says, just know if you do run what the book says your engine will in fact have more carbon building molecules that will create more contamination in your truck then if you ran a stout 30 weight. If you think 0w40 stays 0w40 that is completely incorrect, it does not, as noted in 9 uoa's many different oils.
I think you guys need to go back to oil school.

You change motor oil because the additive package degrades over miles and the oil builds up more contaminates.

Weight - Let make believe what you say about sheer is correct - 40 going to 30.
Then if you use 30 it goes to 20. All of which means - not good.

You might be familiar with terms such as “30-weight” or “10W-30” oil. Those numbers refer to the grade. The higher the number, the thicker the oil. The lower the number, the thinner.
 

Burla

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There ya go, your fallacy is thinking 30 weight goes to 20 weight, look at blackstone thread. It doesnt shear near as much because it has less vii's. My 3 uoa's on 30 weight all are thicker then the 9 uoa's I posted. Good day, glad I could enlighten you to hemimanns point. No real reason to continue, the facts are what they are. Something like PUP 0w40 is likely a twenty weight oil but full of vii's. 30 weight oil is gonna likely be thirty weight oil or close with a few vii's. First page in blackstone thread proves the point, look at the uoa's, 30 weight near viscosity 12 after 10k miles. So I'm sure now you at least understand, what you do with this info is on you. Peace
 

HEMIMANN

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I think you guys need to go back to oil school.

You change motor oil because the additive package degrades over miles and the oil builds up more contaminates.

Weight - Let make believe what you say about sheer is correct - 40 going to 30.
Then if you use 30 it goes to 20. All of which means - not good.

You might be familiar with terms such as “30-weight” or “10W-30” oil. Those numbers refer to the grade. The higher the number, the thicker the oil. The lower the number, the thinner.

I was in Mobil Oil school. Graduated, too.

You?
 

Zoe Saldana

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There ya go, your fallacy is thinking 30 weight goes to 20 weight, look at blackstone thread. It doesnt shear near as much because it has less vii's. My 3 uoa's on 30 weight all are thicker then the 9 uoa's I posted. Good day, glad I could enlighten you to hemimanns point. No real reason to continue, the facts are what they are. Something like PUP 0w40 is likely a twenty weight oil but full of vii's. 30 weight oil is gonna likely be thirty weight oil or close with a few vii's. First page in blackstone thread proves the point, look at the uoa's, 30 weight near viscosity 12 after 10k miles. So I'm sure now you at least understand, what you do with this info is on you. Peace

There ya go, your fallacy is thinking 40 weight goes to 30 weight ...
 

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