Lifter failure preventions?

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MarcoFuc

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Hello everyone, I am currently having my truck fixed of a lifter issue, along with a messed up camshaft from it. Any tips of preventing this from happening again? I’ve heard idle as less as possible, change oil frequently 4000 miles intervals. Now oil I use is a mopar filter and pennzoil full synthetic 5w20 high mileage. My truck has 150k atm. If y’all recommend anything that could help prevent it from happening again I’m all ears
 

Jeepwalker

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They're replacing all the lifters (and cam), right?

At this point I wouldn't worry. Your tk made it to 150k. Some guy's pickups make it to 200k (some don't make it to 100k). If the new cam/lifters make it another 150k, you'll have other issues to deal with by then, and I doubt you'll still own it. Just keep doing what you're doing. There've been guys who've used boutique oils, etc ..and cam/lifters still went out. But if it makes you feel better, go for it, certainly can't hurt.

When I make short trips, I often lock it out of MDS ...but some believe that may do more harm than good ...IDK

Can I ask what they estimated the cost to be (for the cam/lifter replace)?
 

Jeepwalker

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Has your truck already had the exhaust manifolds fixed? If not, you might work it out where you grab yours from the dealer (while they're off), and have them checked for warpage ...and if so, have them machined (flat) at a local machine shop. If you did it while they were already off it would kill two birds at the same time and save you that expense. Once the old manifolds are machined flat they don't seem to ever cause problems (because they're heat-relieved by age already).
 

PaleFlyer

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Mopar filter is probably the generic paper filters that suck, and which Pennzoil? The "full synthetic" Pennzoil, versus the Ultra Plat are basically 2 totally different oils.
I noticed a big difference going from "Full Syn" at the oil change places to even just Pennzoil Platinum 5-20. Ultra 5-30 gets the same fuel economy as "generic" Full Syn 5-20 for me, while the 5-20 Platinum actually got me an extra 50-60 miles on a tank. And the Platinum/Ultra Plat does seem to run a little smoother. I don't see/hear any direct difference between the 5-20 and 5-30 here in NC, but both (so far) have been run in the summer. 5-20 got put in late spring, and the 5-30 just about a month or so ago.
One thing I would caution about "good" filters... RP 20-500 DOESN'T fit if you have a 4x4 Rebel. Removing that on this next change might require the Saw-z-all...
 

Burla

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Mopar filters are wix, see oil filter thread for options. Fram xg2 is a good choice if RP 20-820 cant be bought.

Redline high performance series is a race oil designed for passenger cars. You can see race oils with voa's or uoa's out there, redline uses a stout formula but also keeps the additive levels within reason because of Cats, true race oils are not suitable for passenger vehicles. This formula especially 5w30 kills hemi tick in roughly 80% of the rams that have tried it, not only this latest poll but these numbers helf true for the 6 years prior to polling it, most of those users are long gone, but the votes are public, so they are very precise. These trucks are the worst of the worst, they are already ticking, and yet 80% of the time they go silent with an oil change? Despite this group of ticking hemi's, there was only like one and even that is unverified that needed a new cam/lifters. There were two that did need cam but those trucks had a mis fire first, so no oil can help that, damage was done. Redline gives you the best chance at killing tick and avoiding cam/lifters, most of these trucks also use the royal purple 20-820 oil filter. Best price I see now is 83 bucks per 6 quarts, so it isnt cheap, nothing this good is.

Did redline kill your hemi tick

Redline killed hemi tick - 59 votes
Redline partially killed hemi tick- 26 votes
Redline didn't kill hemi tick - 14 votes

Now, there has always been a desire on the guys responsible for these tests to find other suitable alternatives. Enter lubegard strategy, it is the same science just less of it and results also were less, but much better then w/o this moly strategy.

Did lubegard biotech kill hemi tick

Yes it killed hemi tick -16 votes
Yes it made it better but not 100% -25 votes
No it didnt work -11 votes


So there is a bunch of considerations that goes into these strategies, first and foremost are they safe. Since all of the additives are already used in oil, safe to say yes they are. Furthermore redline has time tested base oils that are also proven safe, in many rams over a decade such as mine and those engines are butter smooth and safe. Also if you followed the oils threads, myself and m,any others cut open filters and did many other things as well, proving these two strategies are 100% safe. There is also a when not to use redline thread, and one of those is in older engines. There is no risk per say, but see that thread for any cons to running this strategy in an older ram.

Many many ram members took part in these tests and tested many other products, these two came out on top, and the results really follow the science. There are other "potential" strategies that show promise, HPL lubricants and Shaeffers are among those, and those also have similar science to the two above. Personally, unless HPL is proven eventually, redlione 5w30 is a no brainer in cam fail prevention, and at a minimum order a case of lubegard biotech 16 ounce and dump it in every oil change, this is the cheaper alternative but may work just as good in a non hemi tick engine, this we don't know. There is also a way to expand redline a bit to help with costs, bg moa can be used as a tbn booster, the new formula with high mag is particularly good. 1/2 through an interval, it buys you a little security and extends interval. If you want to push interval out past 10k miles, it is best to use blackstone oil labs to set your interval.

Most additives are really unsafe, research them before using. Oil thickners and chlorinated parrifins can mess your truck up, just avoid them. Powdered moly is also no good, it gels up in the sump. And most others may not be harmful, but not beneficial either.
 
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CAGEYAR

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With my 2017 Longhorn 5.7 at 77K miles, I've read the lifter/cam/tick experiences with some concern.
Here's my strategy with a truck that sits outside 365 days per year and has 572 idle hours to date:
Mobil 1 5W20 & Mopar filter every 3K miles. I changed at 1K, 3K and every subsequent 3K for 27 changes to date. I use Mobil 1 because with the change frequency, it's affordable. I use a Mopar filter because I have a MaxCare lifetime service contract and I want to avoid issues about "non-OEM" parts. Plus, it looks like a decent filter. I Love Redline products and use them in my BMWR1200S motorcycle. But at $16-$18 per quart, the 3K mile change interval would hurt. I use no oil additives. Mobil 1 5W20 has Zinc at 900 PPM, definitely less than 20 years ago. I guess I'm hanging my hat on keeping the oil in the engine pristine at all times with the 3K interval. I take trips to VA and IN/IL frequently putting in 3K miles in 6 weeks. I still change at the 3K mark. So, I guess I'm a test case-will this strategy prevent the lifter/cam/tick issue or will it fail as so many have failed. 76,945 miles as of tonight and knock aluminum, still good.
IMG_7792.jpeg
 

crackerjack1957

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Hello everyone, I am currently having my truck fixed of a lifter issue, along with a messed up camshaft from it. Any tips of preventing this from happening again? I’ve heard idle as less as possible, change oil frequently 4000 miles intervals. Now oil I use is a mopar filter and pennzoil full synthetic 5w20 high mileage. My truck has 150k atm. If y’all recommend anything that could help prevent it from happening again I’m all ears
Bump idle rpm up to 750/800........will get you more oil pressure at idle to cam & lifters......if you don't have a tuner/programmer take it to someone that can.
 
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MarcoFuc

MarcoFuc

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They're replacing all the lifters (and cam), right?

At this point I wouldn't worry. Your tk made it to 150k. Some guy's pickups make it to 200k (some don't make it to 100k). If the new cam/lifters make it another 150k, you'll have other issues to deal with by then, and I doubt you'll still own it. Just keep doing what you're doing. There've been guys who've used boutique oils, etc ..and cam/lifters still went out. But if it makes you feel better, go for it, certainly can't hurt.

When I make short trips, I often lock it out of MDS ...but some believe that may do more harm than good ...IDK

Can I ask what they estimated the cost to be (for the cam/lifter replace)?
Yah all lifters and cam along with timing chain. And he’s quoting me about 4K dealership wanted 7200$
 
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MarcoFuc

MarcoFuc

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Has your truck already had the exhaust manifolds fixed? If not, you might work it out where you grab yours from the dealer (while they're off), and have them checked for warpage ...and if so, have them machined (flat) at a local machine shop. If you did it while they were already off it would kill two birds at the same time and save you that expense. Once the old manifolds are machined flat they don't seem to ever cause problems (because they're heat-relieved by age already).
I’ve already changed bolts, and the exhaust manifold fixed 2 years ago both sides. I did that my self, other then machine flattening part
 

Marmay

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For me it comes to this as soon as you start the engine for the first time, the clock starts ticking .this is my definition of hemis engines.
 

huntergreen

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If it’s a design flaw as some suspect, there is no prevention. IMHO, it’s a quality control issue. Hence why some hemi engine run 200000 miles plus without incident and some get new lifters and cam under warranty.
 

Marmay

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If it’s a design flaw as some suspect, there is no prevention. IMHO, it’s a quality control issue. Hence why some hemi engine run 200000 miles plus without incident and some get new lifters and cam under warranty.
Many FCA procedures make no sense take the oil minder percentage, my 2019 classic comes filled with semi blend oil 5w20,there is no way this oil can be use of the full interval cycle, over 13 000 km,only full synthetic oil will be good for that,stupid and very confusing gadget,anyway no one followed this future anyway, guys change full synthetic oil after 4 or 5000 miles which is not good either, way to soone for full synthetic oil,but they are worry about the hemi tick, if a gas engine can not run with full synthetic oil more then 5000 miles,something is not right there.
 

huntergreen

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Many FCA procedures make no sense take the oil minder percentage, my 2019 classic comes filled with semi blend oil 5w20,there is no way this oil can be use of the full interval cycle, over 13 000 km,only full synthetic oil will be good for that,stupid and very confusing gadget,anyway no one followed this future anyway, guys change full synthetic oil after 4 or 5000 miles which is not good either, way to soone for full synthetic oil,but they are worry about the hemi tick, if a gas engine can not run with full synthetic oil more then 5000 miles,something is not right there.
I come from the days of 3000 mile oci. I’m up to to 6000 or six months oci now. Oil minder is usually at 50%. That’s pup 5/20 and fram ultra filter. So far my 16 bighorn is quite, no tick. I don’t use the oil filter minder thing to tell me when to change the oil.
 

CAGEYAR

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".........guys change full synthetic oil after 4 or 5000 miles which is not good either, way to soone for full synthetic oil......."
I come from the days of 3000 mile oci. I’m up to to 6000 or six months oci now. Oil minder is usually at 50%. That’s pup 5/20 and fram ultra filter. So far my 16 bighorn is quite, no tick. I don’t use the oil filter minder thing to tell me when to change the oil.
To me, it's not about changing the oil when it's needed-I prefer to have pristine oil in the crankcase at all times, that's why I change Mobil 1 5W20 every 3K miles. I pay $42 for 7 quarts at Walmart. I get the Mopar filters online for $8.50. I have a local quick lube chain do the change. They charge me $27.49 less a $3 credit for using my own filter. So every 3K miles I spend $75 for a 7 qt. synthetic oil change. That's worth it to me to always have fresh oil in my engine. Will it save me from the Tick? Only time will tell.
 

Marmay

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To me, it's not about changing the oil when it's needed-I prefer to have pristine oil in the crankcase at all times, that's why I change Mobil 1 5W20 every 3K miles. I pay $42 for 7 quarts at Walmart. I get the Mopar filters online for $8.50. I have a local quick lube chain do the change. They charge me $27.49 less a $3 credit for using my own filter. So every 3K miles I spend $75 for a 7 qt. synthetic oil change. That's worth it to me to always have fresh oil in my engine. Will it save me from the Tick? Only time will tell.
I got your point,but again the oil interval question, why and what was the reason to come up with synthetic oil?much better lubrication, faster spray in all engine parts at start,heat resistance and much better longevity of this oil,and I am a 100% sure that after 3000 miles with full synthetic oil,nothing is wrong with it,the lab proofing that allready, guys send oil samples even after 10.000 miles and the result was not bad at all,in other words,we are throwing out good quality oil way to soone because of the hemi engine.
 

CAGEYAR

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"....we are throwing out good quality oil way to soone because of the hemi engine."
That is true. However, I have used this strategy with other engines to some success. My zero turn mower has a 900cc Briggs & Stratton air cooled v-twin with 2 1/2 qts. of oil. That engine runs at full throttle every minute of operation. I change the Mobil 1 10W30 and Wix filter every 25 hours. After 16 years and 1200 hours, that engine uses zero oil between changes. What was the old saying?-cheap insurance.
 

huntergreen

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I got your point,but again the oil interval question, why and what was the reason to come up with synthetic oil?much better lubrication, faster spray in all engine parts at start,heat resistance and much better longevity of this oil,and I am a 100% sure that after 3000 miles with full synthetic oil,nothing is wrong with it,the lab proofing that allready, guys send oil samples even after 10.000 miles and the result was not bad at all,in other words,we are throwing out good quality oil way to soone because of the hemi engine.
All good questions. In my case I do a lot of local short trips. I change early for two reasons, 1) old habits die hard, 2) I want to make sure I get rid of any accumulated contamination that isn’t burnt off on my occasional long drives.
 
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