5.7 Performance Part Questions

Anthony Bulger · Feb 16, 2023

Well, my 2019 5th Gen DT has rolled past 85K, and I've developed the dreaded cracked exhaust manifold leaks. So, I've decided that it's time to go ahead and do some preventative maintenance and through caution into the wind and UPGRADE STUFF!

Here are my questions?

1. Long Tube Headers, ARH or Stainless Works, Kooks are too pricey and not sure I'm a fan of the Doug Thorley ones. I'm leaning Stainless because I think I'm going to keep it dual and add their mild exhaust system. Any know issues with install or other product options I should look at?
(Currently setup, first resonator removed, electric cutout, and Flowmaster FlowFX Direct-Fit)

2. A buddy gave me a set of Kook's exhaust gaskets a Stage 8 Header bolt kit, Oil catch can kit and a 90mm Throttle body. Are these worth using?
(Other than the exhaust stuff above the truck has a K&N intake setup on it and that all the performance mods I know of.)

3. I plan on doing a tuner with all of this, the HP route, or is this overkill?

4. If I go the HP Tuner route, do I need to add a Wide Band sensor to the exhaust to monitor fuel burn for tunning, or does the software show this off the existing O2 sensors?

5. laugh if you want but what in the heck is the difference between the NGK Iridium IX, Laser Iridium, Ruthenium HX plugs? I figure I replace these since I'll be in there.

Please any helpful thoughts you might have.

DILLIGAF · Feb 16, 2023

You dont need the wideband but it makes life a heck of a lot easier to dial in your tune.
Stage 8 are great, had mine for 10y now... lol... . Id still get a remflex gasket
SW or ARH are both excellent choices.
I literally use champion 446 in my cammed truck and change them out every 2 years. Way cheaper for me in the long run.
Hp tuner is the go to now. Dont even bother with diablo. they actually dont even unlock your pcm they lock it to diablo , thats some shady **** ...
And getting rid of 02 codes is way easier on HP Tuners

RodRamCar · Feb 16, 2023

Anthony Bulger said:
Well, my 2019 5th Gen DT has rolled past 85K, and I've developed the dreaded cracked exhaust manifold leaks. So, I've decided that it's time to go ahead and do some preventative maintenance and through caution into the wind and UPGRADE STUFF!

Here are my questions?

1. Long Tube Headers, ARH or Stainless Works, Kooks are too pricey and not sure I'm a fan of the Doug Thorley ones. I'm leaning Stainless because I think I'm going to keep it dual and add their mild exhaust system. Any know issues with install or other product options I should look at?
(Currently setup, first resonator removed, electric cutout, and Flowmaster FlowFX Direct-Fit)

2. A buddy gave me a set of Kook's exhaust gaskets a Stage 8 Header bolt kit, Oil catch can kit and a 90mm Throttle body. Are these worth using?
(Other than the exhaust stuff above the truck has a K&N intake setup on it and that all the performance mods I know of.)

3. I plan on doing a tuner with all of this, the HP route, or is this overkill?

4. If I go the HP Tuner route, do I need to add a Wide Band sensor to the exhaust to monitor fuel burn for tunning, or does the software show this off the existing O2 sensors?

5. laugh if you want but what in the heck is the difference between the NGK Iridium IX, Laser Iridium, Ruthenium HX plugs? I figure I replace these since I'll be in there.

Please any helpful thoughts you might have.

might as well throw the 6.4 intake on it as well

Wild one · Feb 17, 2023

Anthony Bulger said:
Well, my 2019 5th Gen DT has rolled past 85K, and I've developed the dreaded cracked exhaust manifold leaks. So, I've decided that it's time to go ahead and do some preventative maintenance and through caution into the wind and UPGRADE STUFF!

Here are my questions?

1. Long Tube Headers, ARH or Stainless Works, Kooks are too pricey and not sure I'm a fan of the Doug Thorley ones. I'm leaning Stainless because I think I'm going to keep it dual and add their mild exhaust system. Any know issues with install or other product options I should look at?
(Currently setup, first resonator removed, electric cutout, and Flowmaster FlowFX Direct-Fit)

2. A buddy gave me a set of Kook's exhaust gaskets a Stage 8 Header bolt kit, Oil catch can kit and a 90mm Throttle body. Are these worth using?
(Other than the exhaust stuff above the truck has a K&N intake setup on it and that all the performance mods I know of.)

3. I plan on doing a tuner with all of this, the HP route, or is this overkill?

4. If I go the HP Tuner route, do I need to add a Wide Band sensor to the exhaust to monitor fuel burn for tunning, or does the software show this off the existing O2 sensors?

5. laugh if you want but what in the heck is the difference between the NGK Iridium IX, Laser Iridium, Ruthenium HX plugs? I figure I replace these since I'll be in there.

Please any helpful thoughts you might have.

Throw the Stage 8 locking tabs in the garbage,you can use the bolts though.The locking tabs have a habit of rattling and giving your knock sensors fits,plus if you ever have to remove the headers,the locking tabs will make you want to strangle the guy that gave them to you.Remflex 6022 gaskets are the way to go as Dilligaf stated.The best plugs are still old fashioned copper plugs,but they require a bit more maintence.BBK's 90 mm throttle body doesn't have a good rep,plus your stock 251 throttle body is more then capable of handling the mods you're planning,it's the same throttle body used on the 485 horse SRT 6.4's

Anthony Bulger · Feb 17, 2023

RodRamCar said:
might as well throw the 6.4 intake on it as well

I had thought about changing out the intake to something else. I like the hell out of the Holly Ram intakes.

Is the 6.4l just a swap or does it need things like different injectors fuel plumbing?

On the fuel side I was contemplating maybe doing some E85. just haven't spent anytime really looking into it. Although I found a shop south of me in Austin that does some interesting E85 fuel mods.

Anthony Bulger · Feb 17, 2023

Wild one said:
Throw the Stage 8 locking tabs in the garbage,you can use the bolts though.The locking tabs have a habit of rattling and giving your knock sensors fits,plus if you ever have to remove the headers,the locking tabs will make you want to strangle the guy that gave them to you.Remflex 6022 gaskets are the way to go as Dilligaf stated.The best plugs are still old fashioned copper plugs,but they require a bit more maintence.BBK's 90 mm throttle body doesn't have a good rep,plus your stock 251 throttle body is more then capable of handling the mods you're planning,it's the same throttle body used on the 485 horse SRT 6.4's

Good to know on the Locking tabs.

The 90TB is a new OE part that has been ported and had the butterfly replaced. Not BBK.

Copper plugs hun.. No Split Fire E3's or Torque Masters? lol I'm joking..

Wild one · Feb 17, 2023

Anthony Bulger said:
I had thought about changing out the intake to something else. I like the hell out of the Holly Ram intakes.

Is the 6.4l just a swap or does it need things like different injectors fuel plumbing?

On the fuel side I was contemplating maybe doing some E85. just haven't spent anytime really looking into it. Although I found a shop south of me in Austin that does some interesting E85 fuel mods.

On a basically stock truck like what you're planning,the 6.4 intake will blow the Holley High Ram into the weeds.You need to extend the SRV harness (short runner valve),and you'll need a Jeep 6.4 or MMX egr block off plate.You're stock 5.7 injectors will work for gas,but if you want to run E85 the 6.4 injectors will be a better match,but you'll definitely need a E85 tune to run them.Search CrazyKids posts on here,as he has a write up on his 6.4 intake swap

Wild one · Feb 17, 2023

Anthony Bulger said:
Good to know on the Locking tabs.

The 90TB is a new OE part that has been ported and had the butterfly replaced. Not BBK.

Copper plugs hun.. No Split Fire E3's or Torque Masters? lol I'm joking..

Who's porting a stock throttle body to 90 mm? I'd be worried the drive inside it won't handle the bigger blade,as the motors a bit light to open and close a 90mm blade,plus the intake mouth is getting mighty thin if you port it to match the throttle body. About all i'd go on porting the mouth is 87 mm,and even then it's getting a bit thin in spots.By no stretch will your mods be moving the same amount of air through the throttle body as a 485 horse SRT 6.4 is moving,and even on a modded 6.4 the throttle body is still the very last mod you need.

evolizzee · Feb 21, 2023

Definitely set aside some $$ for the 6.4 intake manifold. The headers give you a boost in power up top but nothing down low. The 6.4 IM will boost the power down low, giving you a fluid feeling powerband. HPT is definitely a better tuning platform compared to Diablo. There are way more options and parameters available to adjust with HPT. Plus, most performance/tuning/dyno shops prefer using HPT.

That being said, the fastest 4th Gen (Rick‘s Blue RCSB) and 5th Gen (Mike’s grey TRX) trucks are utilizing Diablo for their tuning needs. Both trucks run well into the single digits in the 1/4mile. Which means, Diablo will be just fine for tuning if you go that route. I’m running very low 13’s with the basic HEMI mods in a 5200lb 4x4. No CELs, averaging 19mpg, while utilizing Diablo hardware/software.

DILLIGAF · Feb 21, 2023

Tuners no longer turn off CELs related to emissions control. So you're screwed if you dont get a CEL as end users dont have access to diablows tuning software to make those adjustments. I think its like 2K for that software if you want to buy it... lol.

The fastest TRX wasnt just tuned by one person if I remember correctly the post that was on HP Ram FB page. Those guys have direct access to tuners and probably have the software et home.

evolizzee · Feb 21, 2023

DILLIGAF said:
Tuners no longer turn off CELs related to emissions control. So you're screwed if you dont get a CEL as end users dont have access to diablows tuning software to make those adjustments. I think its like 2K for that software if you want to buy it... lol.

The fastest TRX wasnt just tuned by one person if I remember correctly the post that was on HP Ram FB page. Those guys have direct access to tuners and probably have the software et home.

DILLIGAF said:
My tuner turned my cat efficiency codes off for my old Express and my current Lone star. You just have to whisper sweet nothings into their ear.

Wild one · Feb 22, 2023

evolizzee said:
Definitely set aside some $$ for the 6.4 intake manifold. The headers give you a boost in power up top but nothing down low. The 6.4 IM will boost the power down low, giving you a fluid feeling powerband. HPT is definitely a better tuning platform compared to Diablo. There are way more options and parameters available to adjust with HPT. Plus, most performance/tuning/dyno shops prefer using HPT.

That being said, the fastest 4th Gen (Rick‘s Blue RCSB) and 5th Gen (Mike’s grey TRX) trucks are utilizing Diablo for their tuning needs. Both trucks run well into the single digits in the 1/4mile. Which means, Diablo will be just fine for tuning if you go that route. I’m running very low 13’s with the basic HEMI mods in a 5200lb 4x4. No CELs, averaging 19mpg, while utilizing Diablo hardware/software.

Long tube headers create bottom end torque plus pull up top.Think of a header like the intake manifold,the long runners in the intake are for creating bottom end torque,the same thing applies with the primary pipes on the long tubes.Spend 15 minutes and read this complete article.

Gen III Hemi Headers Shootout: Finding The Perfect Header for Your Hemi - Mopar DiY

Whether it’s a 5.7L, 6.1L, or 6.4L, every engine responds to exhaust upgrades, especially when the upgrades include dedicated long-tube headers. In design and function, headers are much like the intake manifold, only in reverse. As with the intake, the exhaust manifolds or tubular headers are...

www.mopardiy.com

evolizzee · Feb 22, 2023

Wild one said:
Long tube headers create bottom end torque plus pull up top.Think of a header like the intake manifold,the long runners in the intake are for creating bottom end torque,the same thing applies with the primary pipes on the long tubes.Spend 15 minutes and read this complete article.

Gen III Hemi Headers Shootout: Finding The Perfect Header for Your Hemi - Mopar DiY

Whether it’s a 5.7L, 6.1L, or 6.4L, every engine responds to exhaust upgrades, especially when the upgrades include dedicated long-tube headers. In design and function, headers are much like the intake manifold, only in reverse. As with the intake, the exhaust manifolds or tubular headers are...

www.mopardiy.com

Yeah, I’ve read that one. The LTs didn’t improve the bottom end of my powerband like the 6.4 intake manifold though.

Wild one · Feb 22, 2023

evolizzee said:
Yeah, I’ve read that one. The LTs didn’t improve the bottom end of my powerband like the 6.4 intake manifold though.

Well you're about the only guy who claims that. Any Dodge product i've put long tubes on,has gained a pile of bottom end torque. My truck with long tubes and a HP tune picked up a little over 6/10's compared to the stock manifolds and 93 Diablo tune,the tune was part of it,but the majority of the gain was from the long tubes,my wifes untuned 1320 gained close to 3/10's with long tubes with out any tuning being done. Other then nitrous , long tubes are generally considered to be one of the best bang for buck mods you can do to a truck.The 6.4 manifold swap is a good mod to,especially if you already have the long tubes,which i'd lay odds is the way you did it,and that would deceptively enhance your thoughts about the intake swap.You gotta get the exhaust out,before the intake manifold will let more air in,it's all in the scavenging effect

Anthony Bulger · Mar 2, 2023

Wild one said:
On a basically stock truck like what you're planning,the 6.4 intake will blow the Holley High Ram into the weeds.You need to extend the SRV harness (short runner valve),and you'll need a Jeep 6.4 or MMX egr block off plate.You're stock 5.7 injectors will work for gas,but if you want to run E85 the 6.4 injectors will be a better match,but you'll definitely need a E85 tune to run them.Search CrazyKids posts on here,as he has a write up on his 6.4 intake swap

Thanks, that's good to know. I started to look at some of the info online on the 6.4 swap.

I was curious about the 5.7 injectors having enough in the duty cycle for the E85.

Anthony Bulger · Mar 2, 2023

Wild one said:
Who's porting a stock throttle body to 90 mm? I'd be worried the drive inside it won't handle the bigger blade,as the motors a bit light to open and close a 90mm blade,plus the intake mouth is getting mighty thin if you port it to match the throttle body. About all i'd go on porting the mouth is 87 mm,and even then it's getting a bit thin in spots.By no stretch will your mods be moving the same amount of air through the throttle body as a 485 horse SRT 6.4 is moving,and even on a modded 6.4 the throttle body is still the very last mod you need.

Honestly, I couldn't tell you the origins of the TB, it's in a white box along with some bolts and gaskets. It's obviously a new part. Whether it's built that way or machined out and resembled I'd only be guessing.

I attached some images of it.

It came about because I stopped by a buddy's shop while I was traveling thru NY for work, was able to stop by and see if he could grab lunch and bs about the past. During lunch he asked about what I was driving now. When we got back to the shop, he said hold up I got some stuff here you might be able to use. That's how I got the all the stuff. The TB was just tossed in with a let me know what you think of it request.

Images- Ignore the messy desk, lol. Also, I couldn't hold the micrometer and camera at the same time so it's a tad off since its leaning.

Wild one · Mar 2, 2023

Anthony Bulger said:
Honestly, I couldn't tell you the origins of the TB, it's in a white box along with some bolts and gaskets. It's obviously a new part. Whether it's built that way or machined out and resembled I'd only be guessing.

I attached some images of it.

It came about because I stopped by a buddy's shop while I was traveling thru NY for work, was able to stop by and see if he could grab lunch and bs about the past. During lunch he asked about what I was driving now. When we got back to the shop, he said hold up I got some stuff here you might be able to use. That's how I got the all the stuff. The TB was just tossed in with a let me know what you think of it request.

Images- Ignore the messy desk, lol. Also, I couldn't hold the micrometer and camera at the same time so it's a tad off since its leaning.

I don't think that's a stock throttle body.Look for casting numbers on it,it should have 251 stamped into it. That's if it's a stock TB that's been modded,but by those 2 pics it doesn't look like a stock TB. As far as i know only BBK is making a 90mm,but there might be other manufactures floating around now.
Honestly with the mods you're planning,you'll be better off with your original throttle body,i'd sell that one,and put the money towards the long tubes you want

Anthony Bulger · Mar 2, 2023

Wild one said:
I don't think that's a stock throttle body.Look for casting numbers on it,it should have 251 stamped into it. That's if it's a stock TB that's been modded,but by those 2 pics it doesn't look like a stock TB. As far as i know only BBK is making a 90mm,but there might be other manufactures floating around now.
Honestly with the mods you're planning,you'll be better off with your original throttle body,i'd sell that one,and put the money towards the long tubes you want

Yea, no 251 or other castings marks I recognize.

Well about the only biggie I see with doing the swap is which 6.4L manifold to grab.

I'm going to assume I want to use one off of Like a 2500 Power Wagon. I say that because the TB mount on the cars, Grand Cherokee and Durango versions seems to be pointing to the driver's side.

My Ram is pointing straight up currently. The Trucks seems to point to the passenger side which might make for being able to modify the existing K&N setup, or in the least come up with something else.

I wonder if the Power Wagon engine cover might be usable too after install?

Wild one · Mar 2, 2023

Anthony Bulger said:
Yea, no 251 or other castings marks I recognize.

Well about the only biggie I see with doing the swap is which 6.4L manifold to grab.

I'm going to assume I want to use one off of Like a 2500 Power Wagon. I say that because the TB mount on the cars, Grand Cherokee and Durango versions seems to be pointing to the driver's side.

My Ram is pointing straight up currently. The Trucks seems to point to the passenger side which might make for being able to modify the existing K&N setup, or in the least come up with something else.

I wonder if the Power Wagon engine cover might be usable too after install?

You need the truck 6.4 intake manifold,as it's the only intake that'll work on a truck 5.7.The other intakes won't clear the alternator. You're K&N intake isn't really worth keeping,most guys are switching over to either the 6.4 truck air box or an S&B airbox.You can buy what's called a "track intake",but it's not really what i'd call the ideal cold air intake for a daily driver.
Leave the engine cover off,as all it does is trap heat,and heat soak the intake manifold

Nick@GotExhaust · Mar 2, 2023

Not sure how I have missed this thread for so long. Good info in here. Let us know if we can help with anything. We can certainly help with the Headers and Exhaust system. We offer ARH and SW. Both are great options with their awesome quality and fitment.

Message me if you would like a quote on anything.

5.7 Performance Part Questions

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