A Lot of Weird Service Suggestions?

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Scottly

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The manufacturer employs a team of engineers, does short-term and long term testing of vehicles, maintains a database of known issues related to maintenance and warranty repairs that have occurred over the life of individual parts and completed assemblies spanning tens of years, then uses that information to develop a checklist of required maintenance items and the schedules that accompany them, to lower overall warranty costs and increase profits to the shareholders. They spend MILLION$$ to do this....But some arseclown from BG chemical(or other such companies) comes along and convinces the dealership personnel that selling their chemical hocus-pocus will cure everything, not to mention making them extra spiff money...F^%$ the customer, F%&$ the integrity of the dealership service department....They just sell it. AND......SUCKERS BUY IT. Follow your owners manual and tell the arseclowns to keep their chemical BS.
 

Govtman

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Just got my 2017 Bighorn 4x4 back from dealer doing regular pre-paid oil change (What a bargain that turned out to be, I take it in every 3k miles just like my Dad taught me!) They always say you only need it after 5k miles, but the service is covered at 3k, so I say why not!?

Anyway, I'm at about 73k miles, and they are recommending a lot of "odd" services I can't find in the standard maintenance schedule
  • Crankcase Cleaning $100
  • Service Fuel Injection System $255
  • Ethanol Defense Kit $50
  • Cabin Air Filter "Service package" $92 (I know the answer on this, just putting in 'cause its funny)
  • IR Conditioning Oil $80 (What is the IR?)
  • Battery Protection $80 (Put in a new battery last December for <$200)
  • Brake Fluid Flush $251
Are any of these worth it? The didn't want to talk about it much beyond that these are all "recommended".

Much appreciation for anyone who has any wisdom to share. Best to you.

I do a fuel injection service every 3-5k mi. It is called a can of B-12 Chemtool in tank with 15-20 gallons of gas.

You can replace your own cabin air filter for $25.
 

Govtman

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Ah so when I put new battery in, I put pads and electrolytic grease on posts in December, so if they had looked at all would know I don't need that.
That is the exact filter I ordered!
I'll look for Berrymans, not sure what that is but assume some kind of fuel additive. I've done that now and than, but not much lately with the price of just the gas! Yikes!

Thanks much for your time and insight!

Berrymans B12 Chemtool
 

Dean2

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Have to admit to never doing an actual brake fluid flush on any of my vehicles. Not saying it's the right thing to do, but I've been working on cars and trucks for 30+ years and have never personally seen a brake issue that was related to old fluid. My last truck I bought new and kept it for 16 years and put 150k miles on it and never any actual flush. I did change the front calipers one time so maybe had half a brake reservoir of fluid swapped out over it's life and never any brake issues. The wife had a minivan that was 8-9 years old with 130k on it with the original brake fluid when it was traded in, and again no issues.
Sure, if you get water or contaminants in the fluid it should be changed out........but where would that water and contamination come from on the normally sealed system?
I agree. Have owned a great many vehicles, a large number of which ran over 250,000 miles. I do live in a dry area so that may be part of it, but I have never once changed brake fluid just for the sake of replacing it.
 

Docwagon1776

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Have to admit to never doing an actual brake fluid flush on any of my vehicles. Not saying it's the right thing to do, but I've been working on cars and trucks for 30+ years and have never personally seen a brake issue that was related to old fluid.

Ever seen a crash that could have been avoided with shorter stopping distance? Then you just saw a problem caused by old brake fluid.

The system is not moisture tight. Water soaked brake fluid boils at a much lower temp. Boiling brake fluid is compressible. Hot brakes not have much longer stopping distances. Testing with the F-150 showed a reduction of about 40' from 60-0 with fresh fluid vs water soaked fluid, and fluid is pretty water soaked in 2-4 years.

Personally, I'd rather stop 40' sooner, or roughly 2 car lengths, by keeping my brake fluid fresh.

Change your brake fluid.
 

09TRX

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You’ve no doubt heard of the phrase “Click-Bait”.
Your pre-paid oil change program is the ”Bait”. Those unnecessary high profit margin services that the dealer is trying to sell you is the “Click”. The dealer got you into his service dept. with the oil change. Now he has an opportunity to sell you a high profit margin useless service you don’t need. I don’t know how much you paid for your oil change package, but going in every three thousand miles is way over-kill, a waste of your time and the earth’s resources.
 

Ramagain

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Have to admit to never doing an actual brake fluid flush on any of my vehicles. Not saying it's the right thing to do, but I've been working on cars and trucks for 30+ years and have never personally seen a brake issue that was related to old fluid. My last truck I bought new and kept it for 16 years and put 150k miles on it and never any actual flush. I did change the front calipers one time so maybe had half a brake reservoir of fluid swapped out over it's life and never any brake issues. The wife had a minivan that was 8-9 years old with 130k on it with the original brake fluid when it was traded in, and again no issues.
Sure, if you get water or contaminants in the fluid it should be changed out........but where would that water and contamination come from on the normally sealed system?
You are guilded then, I can't tell you how many calipers or wheel cylinders I've repaired or replaced over the last 45 years from internal corrosion. Please read the previous comments on how the water get into "sealed" systems.
 

Dean2

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Ever seen a crash that could have been avoided with shorter stopping distance? Then you just saw a problem caused by old brake fluid.

The system is not moisture tight. Water soaked brake fluid boils at a much lower temp. Boiling brake fluid is compressible. Hot brakes not have much longer stopping distances. Testing with the F-150 showed a reduction of about 40' from 60-0 with fresh fluid vs water soaked fluid, and fluid is pretty water soaked in 2-4 years.

Personally, I'd rather stop 40' sooner, or roughly 2 car lengths, by keeping my brake fluid fresh.

Change your brake fluid.
This is nonsense. You are never going to boil brake fluid in a single panic stop. Racing it on a track, yes, but in regular use, never going to happen. Vehicles I track run get a lot different maintenance schedule than a street car but the loads put on them is entirely different too.

As far as claims of caliper corrosion etc, I change brakes on average every 100,000 miles due to worn pads. I have NEVER had to replace a caliper or rebuild the piston on them. I rarely have to replace the rotors or even machine them. I have had to replace the seals and boots a few times due to age and cracking but have never seen pitted or corroded pistons or brake lines.

I know different driving styles and weather conditions can affect this but considering how extreme Alberta weather is, any weakness in your maintenance and repair program usually shows up pretty quickly.
 
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Phillyrube

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My 2008 doesnt have a cabin filter. I saw a hack where you can add one but i dont think I'll try.
 

Docwagon1776

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This is nonsense. You are never going to boil brake fluid in a single panic stop.

Good thing nobody ever gets their brakes hot and then has to stop suddenly. You've never smelled hot brakes from other motorists on the interstate? I sure have.

You do you. I'll flush my brake fluid. It's not like it's expensive or time consuming to do.
 

Ramagain

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This is nonsense. You are never going to boil brake fluid in a single panic stop. Racing it on a track, yes, but in regular use, never going to happen. Vehicles I track run get a lot different maintenance schedule than a street car but the loads put on them is entirely different too.

As far as claims of caliper corrosion etc, I change brakes on average every 100,000 miles due to worn pads. I have NEVER had to replace a caliper or rebuild the piston on them. I rarely have to replace the rotors or even machine them. I have had to replace the seals and boots a few times due to age and cracking but have never seen pitted or corroded pistons or brake lines.

I know different driving styles and weather conditions can affect this but considering how extreme Alberta weather is, any weakness in your maintenance and repair program usually shows up pretty quickly.
Brake fluid is the most overlooked maintenance item by the general public. Heck, you're lucky to see half of car owners ever change their engine oil...
About 5 years ago I replaced two front calipers and the brake lines in my used 06 Ram 3500 that was a FL truck but hauled weight constantly. The calipers had pitting in the piston bores and the pistons were rusty. The previous owner never changed the fluid. It was like black tea when I flushed it after I bought it. 3 years after I bought it, the trucks the RF caliper locked up and smoked a rotor while hauling my 5th wheel 60 miles on the HWY.
With regards to panic stops;
Attempt a panic stop while hauling some weight in the mountains, your brakes will get hot enough to boil, especially if your trailer brakes fail.
Fluid is cheap, and it's not a bad habit to get into.
What works for you isn't necessarily the best thing to do.
 
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aeromax4

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Do 2017 Rams even come with a Cabin air filter? I had to purchase an aftermarket kit and cut out the opening in my blower box for my 2013 Ram.
My 2016 required the after market kit and cut out but my 2017 did have the filter and door.
 

62Blazer

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Ever seen a crash that could have been avoided with shorter stopping distance? Then you just saw a problem caused by old brake fluid.

The system is not moisture tight. Water soaked brake fluid boils at a much lower temp. Boiling brake fluid is compressible. Hot brakes not have much longer stopping distances. Testing with the F-150 showed a reduction of about 40' from 60-0 with fresh fluid vs water soaked fluid, and fluid is pretty water soaked in 2-4 years.

Personally, I'd rather stop 40' sooner, or roughly 2 car lengths, by keeping my brake fluid fresh.

Change your brake fluid.
I don't claim to be a brake expert by any means, but am an engineer who worked for years at an automotive proving ground that did industry accredited FMVSS brake certification testing on everything from motorcycles to semis. This testing is an entire series of full apply brake stops and never once saw brake fluid get anywhere near close to boiling, and in fact the brake fluid temperature wasn't even enough of a factor that you bothered to monitor it. You did monitor the temperature of the brake pads as you could "smoke" the pads and glaze them, which did periodically happen, and had nothing to do with hot fluid...but never an issue with the brake fluid temperature. Now granted the brake fluid was in good condition and water contamination could cause it to boil sooner, but again point being it was never a concern doing testing.

Can brake fluid boil.........definitely yes, but as mentioned in some other posts it is highly unlikely it would boil in a single panic stop. Same as with the brake pads and rotor in general as it would be highly unlikely they would overheat in a single stop. Riding the brakes for a sustained long distance down a grade while pulling a trailer...yes. Aggressive driving around a track where you are constantly on and off the brakes....yes.

I'm not saying you should NOT change the brake fluid. It's relatively easy and cheap to do and something I should do....but not something you should lose sleep over either. As far as the comment about the F-150 test I would be interested in reading the article so if you could link it please do so. One item of curiosity is exactly how much water was in the fluid....did they dump an unrealistic amount of water in the fluid. Just see a lot of "tests" like this which are trying to prove a point by introducing an unrealistic variable into the situation.

Have I ever seen a crash that could have been avoided by a shorter stopping distance.......uh, well sure. But you definitely can't say with any type of certainty it was because of the brake fluid!
 

Dean2

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62Blazer, well said. Per my earlier post, I ran enough track days and pulled enough in the mountains to know the difference between what works and what doesn't. The idea that you can boil brake fluid on a single stop is silly and your extensive experience proved the same thing. Anyone overheating brakes on the freeway or pulling, won't be getting 80-100,000 miles out of a set of brake pads. Those guys probably do benefit from extra maintencae.
 

18CrewDually

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The point is brake fluid is hygroscopic. The moisture it absorbs corrodes aluminum and will rust steel. It can cause stuck caliper pistons and ruin lip seals on master cylinders amongst other things. There is no question it should be serviced to remove the chance of damage before it happens. If the fluid is discolored or showing black residue in the reservoir, you're over due.
 

Dean2

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The point is brake fluid is hygroscopic. The moisture it absorbs corrodes aluminum and will rust steel. It can cause stuck caliper pistons and ruin lip seals on master cylinders amongst other things. There is no question it should be serviced to remove the chance of damage before it happens. If the fluid is discolored or showing black residue in the reservoir, you're over due.
If my fluid was back or discolored I would agree, but I have run fluid 200,000 miles, occasionally replaced some when the brake pads were done but most of the time never needed to remove the brake lines so there was no need to bleed them. After two to three pad replacements the fluid was still perfectly clear. Why would I waste perfectly good brake fluid.

I have owned about a 100 vehicles in my life time, I have run many of them past 250,000 miles. There was a time when I average 80- 100,000 miles a year. In 50 years of driving all sorts of makes and models I have never done a motor, valves, transfer case, rear end or a transmission on a road vehicle. I am pretty convinced the maintenance schedule I am using is very effective.

Do what you want but this fascination with over servicing vehicles is expensive.
 

Scottly

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Every brake caliper and master cylinder I ever disassembled after a working life in Dot3 or 4 brake fluid had corrosion on the internal machined surfaces. I live in Florida...lots of humidity. However, the biggest issue I witness is the hardening of the square cut seal in the calipers. You may get *** miles out of the original set, but unless you replace the piston seal...You ain't getting that many miles out of the second set, as that seal acts to retract the caliper piston when the hydraulic pressure is released. And if you replace those pads...and there is corrosion built up behind the seal...that caliper is going to leak, because the piston needs to be pushed inward to make room for the new pad thickness. It never fails...Recommend to a customer complete brakes with rebuilt calipers, they decline and ask for a redneck special..'Slap pads on it"..and sure as shizit, those calipers will lock up or leak in a short period of time. Of course, they come back to you and blame you for doing a poor job, but hey....That's the American way it seems.
 

GTyankee

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What i find strange with Brakes

Take a motorcycle, a Yamaha will do

Here in the USA & every other country , we use brake fluid

Over in Japan, the same motorcycle will use distilled Water in the Brake System, it will also have Stainless Steel lines

Distilled Water does not compress the same as brake fluid
 
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