Blue Smoke on startup

[DoubleJ]

Getting a little blue smoke on startup after I swapped the cam, lifters, springs and seals. Should I be worried, or will it work itself out? I put 5w-20 Mopar synthetic after the swap


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[TheEnder]

Getting a little blue smoke on startup after I swapped the cam, lifters, springs and seals. Should I be worried, or will it work itself out? I put 5w-20 Mopar synthetic after the swap


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Maybe oil leaking down from the heads and upon starting it’s burning off?


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[DoubleJ]

Maybe oil leaking down from the heads and upon starting it’s burning off?


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That’s what I was thinking. I had a lot of blow by before I swapped everything, so I can imagine it’s the same. No spot for a catch can on the 6.4 intake manifold, though.


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[Burla]

Go with high hths low noack oil, at least 5w30, and see if it's less. Thinking it may be rings and not valves. If it is rings, you may get lucky with a cleaner. It could be carbon buildup or corrosion, second one is not fixable without cracking her open.

Redline si-1 boroscoped in 3 vehicles with similar results, rf member here hemi395 as well. Allthough a follow up test was weird as the carbon looked as if it was back, dunno. More testing needs to be done. 2 bottles did a real nice job on the outer ring of piston.




A good way to go is redline si-1 in gas tank with your current oil before you change it. si-1 ends up in oil, thus changing oil when your done is a good idea. And sea foam though vac lines. You just might free carbon on rings, if so it may actually fix the issue w/o cracking it open. Note I said might, nothing to loose really.

 

[DoubleJ]

Go with high hths low noack oil, at least 5w30, and see if it's less. Thinking it may be rings and not valves. If it is rings, you may get lucky with a cleaner. It could be carbon buildup or corrosion, second one is not fixable without cracking her open.

Redline si-1 boroscoped in 3 vehicles with similar results, rf member here hemi395 as well. Allthough a follow up test was weird as the carbon looked as if it was back, dunno. More testing needs to be done. 2 bottles did a real nice job on the outer ring of piston.




A good way to go is redline si-1 in gas tank with your current oil before you change it. si-1 ends up in oil, thus changing oil when your done is a good idea. And sea foam though vac lines. You just might free carbon on rings, if so it may actually fix the issue w/o cracking it open. Note I said might, nothing to loose really.

Do you suggest a brand of oil?


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[Burla]

Basically you want thick, but thick that isn't too thick or thick that will thin with use, which is what those two atsm's hths and noack will ensure. It can be as easy as looking at stat sheets for ya, and look at high mileage oils as well. You may decide to go even thicker, but it should be in stages, see the result. 5w20 shouldn't be used in HM vehicles, any vehicles over 75k miles imo, and never be used with any ring issue, that is literally the main reason to use a thick oil. It is hard to get hths and noack numbers these days, when as early as 5 years ago most oils posted them.

Synthetic is good here, Pennzoil Platinum HM 10w30, most 0w40's with dexos specs (not redline or amsoil's 0w40), redline 5w30. Redline is always going to be on the right side of hths and noack, and amsoil posts their hths and noack as well, I don't prefer 5w30 amsoil here, maybe some of their other weights that equal redline's numbers. You can look up cst which is operating viscosity and get some idea which will be good here, I would want 12 cst here for starts, see if it helps or not.

Oddly enough with the 5w20 you are running this would be the one time I would consider lucas synthetic stabilizer, not the non synthetic one, but the synthetic one. But, as a longer term strategy I'd opt for thicker oil or HM oil then an additive. but something you can do is get one quart and try 1/2 a bottle and see if it helps. You can do this right away to compliment the cleaning, if there is zero change, maybe it isn't the rings. I'd expect some change because the oil you use is so thin.

 

[Wild one]

Getting a little blue smoke on startup after I swapped the cam, lifters, springs and seals. Should I be worried, or will it work itself out? I put 5w-20 Mopar synthetic after the swap


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Blue smoke on start-up usually entails wore out valve seals and loose guides,blue smoke on de-acceleration usually points to shakey rings.Oil smoke on start-up is from oil leaking past the valve stem seals and down the valve guides,while smoke on de-acceleration is from high vaccumn in the cylinders pulling oil past the rings. I'd run 5W-30,but if your valve guides and seals are wore out,it won't do anything for the blue smoke on start-up.

 

[DoubleJ]

Blue smoke on start-up usually entails wore out valve seals and loose guides,blue smoke on de-acceleration usually points to shakey rings.Oil smoke on start-up is from oil leaking past the valve stem seals and down the valve guides,while smoke on de-acceleration is from high vaccumn in the cylinders pulling oil past the rings. I'd run 5W-30,but if your valve guides and seals are wore out,it won't do anything for the blue smoke on start-up.

Thanks! I’m gonna switch to the 5w-30 and see what it does. The swap is still new (less then 250 miles on it) and it had not problems before I did the swap. The Blue-ish color is something I old noticed today, and it isn’t a lot. It steams pretty regularly because of the high flow cats and ambient temperature here. I will run the 5w-30 in it and see what it does. I’m hopeful it will work itself out.


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[Burla]

I thought you had the issue prior, my bad, perhaps is has nothing to do with rings. Maybe the issue will correct self new valves, if it lingers you should look at valves again.

 

[DoubleJ]

I thought you had the issue prior, my bad, perhaps is has nothing to do with rings. Maybe the issue will correct self new valves, if it lingers you should look at valves again.

I think it’s just a combination of the thin oil and new seals. I’m hoping the 5w-30 and time for the seals to seat will fix it. I appreciate your help! It was your initial post that made me consider the thicker oil.


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[crackerjack1957]

No mention of mileage on engine, if valve seals are severely worn valve stems & guides maybe worn slightly also.

 

[DoubleJ]

No mention of mileage on engine, if valve seals are severely worn valve stems & guides maybe worn slightly also.

Just short of 74,000 miles on the engine


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[indept]

Just short of 74,000 miles on the engine


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I wouldn't think rings would be shot at 74k. Are you sure you didn't forget reinstalling a seal? Or possible damaged a seal when installing. Or as crackerjack1957 mentioned, are your valve guides good?

 

[ChevySlayer69]

It's definitely not because of running 5w20 vs 5w30 that actually sounds like a joke.

 

[CVX20]

I wouldn't think rings would be shot at 74k. Are you sure you didn't forget reinstalling a seal? Or possible damaged a seal when installing. Or as crackerjack1957 mentioned, are your valve guides good?

He did say he changed the parts he did because of a lot of blowby.Blowby is a ring issue(or a hole in a piston lol)and none of the parts replaced will help with that.I would bet that a seal got damaged during unstall.

 

[Burla]

It's definitely not because of running 5w20 vs 5w30 that actually sounds like a joke.

That is what you picked up?

Reread it, when you are talking about burning oil which this is, the "hot" atsm's mentioned will gauge the oils ability to resist burning. So redline 5w30 has more resistance to burning them most 0w40's as in lower noack and or >= hths. All 3 cSt, noack, hths, just measures viscosity at a given temperature, as we see it is possible for an oil to be "thicker" then a weight above it's cSt in hths or noack. Or same in hths but lower in noack, as you will see with redline versus most dexos 0w40, and noack is the hottest test, so that will be the best gauge on what is is thickest.

 

[indept]

He did say he changed the parts he did because of a lot of blowby.Blowby is a ring issue(or a hole in a piston lol)and none of the parts replaced will help with that.I would bet that a seal got damaged during unstall.

I wasn't sure if he knew it was blowby or just using the word to describe oil burning.

OP, did you do a leakage test or at least a compression test with & without a squirt of oil in each cylinder to detect worn rings?

 

[DoubleJ]

I wasn't sure if he knew it was blowby or just using the word to describe oil burning.

OP, did you do a leakage test or at least a compression test with & without a squirt of oil in each cylinder to detect worn rings?

Just burning a little at startup. A little puff and then nothing. Not getting any while during acceleration or deceleration. May have incorrectly assumed blow by for just using a little oil.
Overall, I was just curious if I should be overly concerned or wait it out to see if it gets better or worse. Also seen a lot of people running thicker oil after cam swaps and head work like I did. I realize this is not likely the culprit, but wanted to see what the community had to say. Which overall has been helpful save for a few destructive comments.


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[Burla]

I would wait a while if it were me, but keep in mind you are taxing your cats. Like a couple weeks no more. Just like your chimney, if you are burning it so hot and efficient you don't see smoke, you will have less creosote. Same thing in car engine, if you are smoking you are sending junk down the lines.

 

[Burla]

Also seen a lot of people running thicker oil after cam swaps and head work like I did. I realize this is not likely the culprit,

So there is more to it then viscosity for sure, and people will argue left and right over viscosity. The oil pump almost equals out most 5w30's and 5w20's, as in the said benefits of EITHER are exaggerated in the discussion. This forum has some long term evidence that additives can solve the issue like theorized by expert in paper below. As far as viscosity, some rams 5w30 with heavy ep additives and base oils are needed for killing hemi tick, and it other rams 5w20 will suffice. However, in those rams such as mine which are silent on 5w20 and 5w30, there is no downside to 5w30, so I run 5w30. Other hemi's tick on 5w20 with heavy ep additives and base oils, but less then other non heavy loaded oils, @Hemi395 has tried many oils, maybe he can show up and talk about that.

two options for heavy ep additives are threads with polls below, the lubegard can be added to any oil and it heavy ep additives with esters, redline is just loaded from jump street and has a little better success rates. But, one is 6 bucks plus oil and the other is like 80 bucks allin.