CanBus keeping dash and shift indicator lights on 24/7

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Shane Allaire

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I recall reading some threads last year about the issue I'm having but can't find them anymore. My 2016 Ram 1500 Sport has 125,000 miles on it and has been the perfect truck up til the day I bought Yukon Denali, literally the next day my Ram decides to not start (dead battery). I replaced the battery and alternator as both came with the truck when I bought it 4 years ago. Nothing. Still dead the next morning. A few days later I went out to move trash cans to the street and noticed my dash lights were on! I couldn't do anything to turn them off except disconnect the battery (alternative would be to pull fuse). So I did this routine for a while before taking it to the Ram dealer. I explained that numerous people post on this issue and I have yet to hear of anyone actually getting it permanently fixed. Seems like they try updates, replace modules, replace wire harnesses and in the end the customer has the same issue. Well, now my Ram has been there for 2 months. Nothing they've tried has worked. I reached out to "Ram Cares" in this forum. They wrote back and said due to the mileage and year there's nothing they can do to help, stick with the dealer and see what they come up with". Today I reached out to Fiat Chrysler's customer service. They have assigned a case manager and should get back to me in a day or two (supposedly). Can you guys that have been through this give me your stories and outcomes? If you're currently going through this, maybe we can trade notes and help each other speed it up. 2 months is ridiculous. I refuse to bring the truck home until they can show me it sits there for more than a day w/o having a dead battery. We live 45 minutes from the service center. Thank in advance! Attached is one of the messages I started getting infrequently after the problem started. I sent that to the dealer with no feedback. I told them to start with the electronic brake module and go from there, guessing it didn't work.
 

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Shane Allaire

Shane Allaire

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HaHa, we needed a big family SUV for our frequent road trips and the 03 Yukon with 300,000 miles was getting risky for those long trips. It is odd how the Ram felt snubbed despite refusing to trade it in or sell it.
 
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Shane Allaire

Shane Allaire

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UPDATE: After 105 days at BlueBonnet Ram in New Braunfels they claim that the issues with my truck were related to an aftermarket alarm keeping the canbus from going to sleep. I had them remove the alarm system (it was installed by previous owner). The dash lights are no longer staying on all night but still turn on periodically for a few seconds throughout the night then shut off. Other things I noticed are; the first few nights, the headlight control knob did not function. Meaning, if the truck was running and lights were on, you could not turn them off or switch to just parking lights. Every time you open the driver's side door the headlights shut off until the door is closed. I tested all 4 doors, only the driver's door does this. Then on a dark road heading home at 5am traveling at 70mph all lighting shut off for about 3 seconds, beeps and messages started popping up in the display. After 3 seconds it all stopped and lights came back on. 3 days later all issues went away and a new set of issues popped up. Now when the driver's door is open, the parking lights turn on then turn off when the door is closed. Headlight control knob works again. Last night I had no issues at all. Everything worked, no weird issues when opening the door, no issues at all! I doubt it will stay this way. The charge was $700 for the electrical diagnosis, removing the alarm and replacing the psgr side manifold bolts. Considering trading it in before more symptoms start. Oh, and extended warranty would not cover the repair due to the alarm being aftermarket, despite it being installed prior to my purchase....
 
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Shane Allaire

Shane Allaire

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I don't know what changed but it's been running like a top the last week + now. Unfortunately I think I'm going to let it go however. So this will likely be my final post here Ram friends :)
 

Mister Luck

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EDIT
previous didactic retracted
sorry for your loss
 
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Sherman Bird

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UPDATE: After 105 days at BlueBonnet Ram in New Braunfels they claim that the issues with my truck were related to an aftermarket alarm keeping the canbus from going to sleep. I had them remove the alarm system (it was installed by previous owner). The dash lights are no longer staying on all night but still turn on periodically for a few seconds throughout the night then shut off. Other things I noticed are; the first few nights, the headlight control knob did not function. Meaning, if the truck was running and lights were on, you could not turn them off or switch to just parking lights. Every time you open the driver's side door the headlights shut off until the door is closed. I tested all 4 doors, only the driver's door does this. Then on a dark road heading home at 5am traveling at 70mph all lighting shut off for about 3 seconds, beeps and messages started popping up in the display. After 3 seconds it all stopped and lights came back on. 3 days later all issues went away and a new set of issues popped up. Now when the driver's door is open, the parking lights turn on then turn off when the door is closed. Headlight control knob works again. Last night I had no issues at all. Everything worked, no weird issues when opening the door, no issues at all! I doubt it will stay this way. The charge was $700 for the electrical diagnosis, removing the alarm and replacing the psgr side manifold bolts. Considering trading it in before more symptoms start. Oh, and extended warranty would not cover the repair due to the alarm being aftermarket, despite it being installed prior to my purchase....
Can/Bus system diagnosis is the bane of many automotive technicians. The very expensive equipment necessary to properly make accurate diagnosis and repair isn't owned by many guys in the trade. The entire concept is beyond the norm on automotive applications.
 
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Shane Allaire

Shane Allaire

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Can/Bus system diagnosis is the bane of many automotive technicians. The very expensive equipment necessary to properly make accurate diagnosis and repair isn't owned by many guys in the trade. The entire concept is beyond the norm on automotive applications.
True but you think the actual Ram dealer would have this equipment. Then when FCA got involved on the corporate level they should have made a judgement call to send the vehicle to a dealer that did, if in fact any do. My trusted neighborhood mechanic could have done the steps they took but in 5 days, not 100 plus days that the dealer took. The whole experience was a mess and rather than wait for the next electrical issue to surface, I abandoned ship and sold the truck while it was functioning as it should. It was a hard decision to make as I loved the truck. Minus the electrical issues, she ran better than any other truck I've owned. Too many folks with the same issue reported the problems resurfacing weeks later. I didn't want the headache...I wonder why there aren't technicians that specialize in just this area of can/bus that float around between the dealer repair centers?
 

Sherman Bird

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True but you think the actual Ram dealer would have this equipment. Then when FCA got involved on the corporate level they should have made a judgement call to send the vehicle to a dealer that did, if in fact any do. My trusted neighborhood mechanic could have done the steps they took but in 5 days, not 100 plus days that the dealer took. The whole experience was a mess and rather than wait for the next electrical issue to surface, I abandoned ship and sold the truck while it was functioning as it should. It was a hard decision to make as I loved the truck. Minus the electrical issues, she ran better than any other truck I've owned. Too many folks with the same issue reported the problems resurfacing weeks later. I didn't want the headache...I wonder why there aren't technicians that specialize in just this area of can/bus that float around between the dealer repair centers?
I cannot speak for FCA, but I was a dealer tech for GM most of 2 decades and a Ford tech for 7 years over the 46 years I've been doing this. That said, I'd like to comment on a program that GM had (might still have?) called STG... Service Technology Group. This was a program of mobile tech engineers who travelled across the country to address difficult situations, such as yours. Several particularly difficult issues I'd seen over those years are burned into my memory, given the particularly difficult level of finding the solution.

One was a 1995 Chevy Lumina (had about 4,000 miles or so, and was less than a year old). This car ate 5 heater cores in very short order. The technical assistance hotline available to dealer techs had the technician test for electrolysis in the coolant, check for floating or high resistance grounds throughout the car, all to no avail. Each time the tech installed a new heater core, it would start leaking shortly afterwards.

Finally, the STG engineers flew in and descended upon this car. There were about 4 or 5 guys involved on this one. After a day or 2 of testing, they determined that the blower motor was improperly designed (by a major vendor) and was ionizing the air stream and eating the soft aluminum core from the outside. Their temporary fix was to take a piece of metal window screen and solder a piece of wire to it, attach it to the face of the heater core, and ground the other end of the wire, thus diverting the electrical charge in the airstream to ground. GM had the vendor redesign the blower motor, and issued a campaign and TSB to correct the issue.

Another one (This one REALLY impressed me) was a 1997 Pontiac Bonneville with the 3.8L Buick design motor in it. This car had a misfire and a code which illuminated the check engine light. Our drivability tech looked it over, performed tests, and determined that there must be a mechanical issue, but none presented with typical testing. So, he shipped it over to the line department for one of those techs to find out the problem, which they couldn't with technology available to us techs back then. Enter the STG engineers, and with their fancy equipment determined that the camshaft had a mis-indexed lobe. STG used a pressure transducer with an oscilloscope to find the problem. A replacement camshaft was installed, and the car was returned to the customer, repaired.

My point is, that the level of engineering skills required to determine causes of problems accurately and the ability to repair the problem correctly the first time on these highly intricate cars today FAR exceed the capacity of many skilled technicians out there today.

I possess both a high powered oscilloscope AND pressure transducers for my diagnostic work, along with many other tools in my arsenal. These pieces of sensitive equipment are extremely expensive, and require specialized training to use accurately. The cost of these tools exceed what normal employees in a dealer service department are capable of affording. The dealers are independent businessmen and typically will not invest in these tools nor will they pay to train the techs.

I recently used my scope to accurately diagnose a bad alternator on a 2006 Expedition. The alternator was putting out excessive AC ripple voltage, causing CAN/BUS issues, causing a crank, no start problem which was intermittent. The customer had been on holiday the prior summer and the original alternator failed. The customer took the vehicle to the local dealer in that town and had a genuine Ford Motorcraft alternator installed. The customer didn't want to pay me for a replacement alternator, because the bad one was (supposedly) covered by FoMoCo at any dealer, nationwide. So, he came and got the car and took it to the nearby dealer, who used a voltmeter for their diagnosis! How archaic! I know this because the dealer refused to fix it under Ford warranty, and got me in the middle of the fight! (UGH!) The dealer texted me a picture of a voltmeter with a normal DC voltage reading across the battery!

After nearly a week of bickering and the dealer digging in their heels, the customer paid these goons 145 dollars for their "diagnosis" and brought it back to me and paid me to replace the alternator.

These horror stories, like you had, are sadly all too commonplace. Look at job sites such as Glassdoor and see how low the pay offer is in this industry for techs who are supposed to function at this level. I have bigshots call me from time to time who manage dealership chains (e.g. Group 1 Automotive who own many dealerships across the country, and Sonic Automotive) wanting me to go to work for them.

Meanwhile, consumers have no idea why they can't get their vehicles properly repaired in any sort of timely fashion.
 
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Shane Allaire

Shane Allaire

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Your experience is impressive! What's scary is that each passing year automobile electronics get more and more complicated. Long gone are the days of the shade tree mechanic when a computer / electronic issue pops up these days. The only upside to my story is that with the used car market the way that it is, I was able to fetch a much better price for my immaculate truck than I would have 2 years ago. The truck was running great when I sold it. The extended warranty was still intact and transferable to the new owner in case the issues returned. I've been very happy with our 2018 Yukon Denali so far, but god forbid the electrical gremlins show up in this truck. Every stinking thing in it is electronic, ha. I do miss the Ram though. Due to my experience with the dealer's inadequate service department and FCA's inability to assist them, I won't be buying another Dodge, Chrysler, Ram product.
 

anthony20mcbride

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I had the exact same issue with a 2013 Dodge Ram 1500 Long Horn 5.7. I spent about 6 Hours Yesterday Diagnosing it and the issue was the Radio Frequency Hub located behind the Drivers side back seat. I had a currant draw of 6.6Amps on fuse 49.
 

Sherman Bird

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Your experience is impressive! What's scary is that each passing year automobile electronics get more and more complicated. Long gone are the days of the shade tree mechanic when a computer / electronic issue pops up these days. The only upside to my story is that with the used car market the way that it is, I was able to fetch a much better price for my immaculate truck than I would have 2 years ago. The truck was running great when I sold it. The extended warranty was still intact and transferable to the new owner in case the issues returned. I've been very happy with our 2018 Yukon Denali so far, but god forbid the electrical gremlins show up in this truck. Every stinking thing in it is electronic, ha. I do miss the Ram though. Due to my experience with the dealer's inadequate service department and FCA's inability to assist them, I won't be buying another Dodge, Chrysler, Ram product.
My shade tree has been cut down.
 
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Shane Allaire

Shane Allaire

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I had the exact same issue with a 2013 Dodge Ram 1500 Long Horn 5.7. I spent about 6 Hours Yesterday Diagnosing it and the issue was the Radio Frequency Hub located behind the Drivers side back seat. I had a currant draw of 6.6Amps on fuse 49.
It's crazy how many different things can cause this issue. I don't think I've heard anyone with the same exact problem yet. Thanks for the heads up.
 
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