CTD Flaw: Heater Grid Bolt

[nlambert182]

Wow... struck a nerve....

No one said his work is below average quality. The only thing that has been said is that they use less than ideal marketing tactics to sell their stuff. I'm glad you're happy to spend it. Doesn't make anything I nor anyone else has said less true. You had a 1:10k+ chance of a heater bolt failing. You didn't like those odds, and mitigated the risk. Nobody is faulting you for it.

Unless you're tuned, the HP you noticed is mostly a placebo. But again... if it makes you happy, go for it.


Being honest is not the same as being nasty. That's what's wrong with the country now... too many can't speak the truth without it hurting someone else's feelings.

 

[chri5k]

I had to bring this back up because of the ad I am looking at on the forum right now. Tell me this isn't a scare tactic.

"OVER 20,000 ENGINES SAVED". As if they have any way to quantify how many of the engines would have actually had this problem. Given that the problem is a fraction of a percent (I believe the last article I found somewhere showed .03%), best case scenario, that's 6 potential engine saves out of the 20,000.

At $1k a pop, Banks has made almost $20k from scare tactics just from what this ad claims (if it's true). The other options out there simply post their test data and explain what improvements they saw over stock. Not one that I can find mentions anything about saving an engine or that not doing it could cause a catastrophic loss. Even their test data doesn't really show improvements over stock, but they don't advertise that it will gain you anything either.

This is marketing at it's finest (worst).

View attachment 554008

Hopefully you are not an accountant. $1,000 x 20,000 = $20,000,000. Or maybe you are but for the mob. ;-)

 

[nlambert182]

Hopefully you are not an accountant. $1,000 x 20,000 = $20,000,000. Or maybe you are but for the mob. ;-)

Ha good call! That was what I meant, but absolutely not what I typed. I'm getting old.

 

[68PowerWagon]

Wow... struck a nerve....

No one said his work is below average quality. The only thing that has been said is that they use less than ideal marketing tactics to sell their stuff. I'm glad you're happy to spend it. Doesn't make anything I nor anyone else has said less true. You had a 1:10k+ chance of a heater bolt failing. You didn't like those odds, and mitigated the risk. Nobody is faulting you for it.

Unless you're tuned, the HP you noticed is mostly a placebo. But again... if it makes you happy, go for it.


Being honest is not the same as being nasty. That's what's wrong with the country now... too many can't speak the truth without it hurting someone else's feelings.

I bought it mostly for the performance of it. Saving my nuts was just an extra. Does it have enough bang for the buck? Probably not for most people but I did notice a big difference in performance & the extra mpg was nice to. Would I do it again on another truck... likely. I also have to give a shout out to Banks customer service. The guy I talked to knew his stuff. Something that one mechanic at a private shop, & one mechanic at the dealership couldn't figure out. This guy solved my problem in about 5 minutes from 2k miles away.
Being honest & helpful is what this forum should be about. But there is always one or two on every forum that have to be nasty. And honest & calling people "suckers", "idiots", & "paranoid" are two separate things. Did strike a nerve? No... I don't really care what most people think anymore. Just family & close friends. The rest are just blowhards that like to hear themselves speak. I only chimed in here because I didn't think the one or two were being very helpful to the OP & to express my positive experience with Banks products.

 

[Scottly]

I did notice a big difference in performance & the extra mpg was nice to.

Please help me understand something...Feel free to call Banks customer service and ask them, if necessary...BUT, how did you get more power if you didn't add more fuel? This isn't gasoline engine we're talking about, where you can improve the stoichiometric ratio of a rich mixture by adding more air...This is a diesel that pumps a continuous amount of air at a given RPM (Because, there is no throttle body) using a turbo with a variable geometry that's controlled by the computer...??? The engine isn't drawing air, it's being force-fed. So how does the mystical Gail magic get more air into an engine that's force-fed without increasing the amount of air being forced, through bigger turbos, charge-air coolers, or different programming for the variable turbo that's in there? And if his mysticism exists, how did you magically get more fuel into the cylinder at a given RPM without reprogramming the computer to deliver it? Somewhere around 350hp++ over factory, restrictions to airflow become an issue...routing of the charge tubes becomes an issue...shape of the charge tubes becomes an issue...But with a factory motor and factory fuel delivery with a computer controlled factory turbo, your butt dyno is lying to you and your fuel mileage calcs are false...No disrespect, but you can scream it to the high heavens, that doesn't make it factual.

 

[nlambert182]

They advertise that it raises boost without increasing backpressure at the turbine to make the engine more responsive. If anything... I'd think that "maybe" it doesn't increase boost (as you said... controlled by the computer) but rather allows the turbo to spool slightly faster giving the perception of more HP.

Dig into their fine print in the ad and they say something interesting....

"By increasing the mass of the air delivered to it, your stock-tuned engine will breathe more efficiently with less stress and set the stage for huge power gains when stacked with a tune."

So by their own admission... it seems that they're telling you that it doesn't increase power without a tune.


Pretty smart advertising if you think about it.

For $968, we can delete the grid heater and increase the size of the intake horn for more airflow and a slightly faster boost response.



Want a little more seat of the pants feel? We'll sell you the throttle commander. $300


Need even more? We'll sell you our new Derringer Tuner (that is coming soon, but somehow already has 9 testimonials for it and no data on what the performance improvements are)


Oh... but wait. To use this, you MUST use the iDash monitor. Good thing we sell those too!




For the low low price of only ~$2,000 (no idea on the Derringer cost).... you too can feel the butt dyno without adding any noticeable horsepower.

 

[Scottly]

Well, that coupled with the Pedal Sphincter will give GINOURMOUS results at the drag strip. Or, you could just hold the brake pedal a bit while the turbo spools up...

 

[nlambert182]

Before anyone tries to flame me.....

The advertisement for their tuner does NOT show ANY data. But they do have a way with words.

 

[68PowerWagon]

Please help me understand something...Feel free to call Banks customer service and ask them, if necessary...BUT, how did you get more power if you didn't add more fuel? This isn't gasoline engine we're talking about, where you can improve the stoichiometric ratio of a rich mixture by adding more air...This is a diesel that pumps a continuous amount of air at a given RPM (Because, there is no throttle body) using a turbo with a variable geometry that's controlled by the computer...??? The engine isn't drawing air, it's being force-fed. So how does the mystical Gail magic get more air into an engine that's force-fed without increasing the amount of air being forced, through bigger turbos, charge-air coolers, or different programming for the variable turbo that's in there? And if his mysticism exists, how did you magically get more fuel into the cylinder at a given RPM without reprogramming the computer to deliver it? Somewhere around 350hp++ over factory, restrictions to airflow become an issue...routing of the charge tubes becomes an issue...shape of the charge tubes becomes an issue...But with a factory motor and factory fuel delivery with a computer controlled factory turbo, your butt dyno is lying to you and your fuel mileage calcs are false...No disrespect, but you can scream it to the high heavens, that doesn't make it factual.

My butt dyno might be lying to me but I "really feel like" I gained some power. Maybe that's better wording for you. And after I finally got the clutch fan unlocked it felt like it gave me just a little more. I can't say which item did it because I added the air box, boost tubes, & elbow all at once. Maybe it took all of them together. My fuel mileage calcs are not off I do know that! I am **** about that & usually do hand cals. & check the gauge every fill up. I have averaged 1.5 to 1.7mpg better since adding all of that. Could it be that this was done around 7,000 miles & the engine was fully broke in at that point? Maybe. It's also not a thing of changing from winter to summer blend as this was all done in late June of last year. We run the camper around enough to get rid of that fuel way before the switch.
I am having a hard time understanding why some of you get so bent out of shape & defensive about what others do & spend on THEIR vehicles. It's not like the government where they take your hard earned money & do something with it that you completely disagree with. If the purchase was a bad one then hopefully that person learns from their mistake & can maybe help someone else not make that mistake. I am completely happy with my purchase & I haven't read any other bad views on any of their products. Was it a little more than I would like to have paid... yes but since covid I fully expect to pay more than what I think is right for quality items. Hopefully that will change here in the near future with the events unfolded last night.

 

[Scottly]

My butt dyno might be lying to me but I "really feel like" I gained some power. Maybe that's better wording for you. And after I finally got the clutch fan unlocked it felt like it gave me just a little more. I can't say which item did it because I added the air box, boost tubes, & elbow all at once. Maybe it took all of them together. My fuel mileage calcs are not off I do know that! I am **** about that & usually do hand cals. & check the gauge every fill up. I have averaged 1.5 to 1.7mpg better since adding all of that. Could it be that this was done around 7,000 miles & the engine was fully broke in at that point? Maybe. It's also not a thing of changing from winter to summer blend as this was all done in late June of last year. We run the camper around enough to get rid of that fuel way before the switch.
I am having a hard time understanding why some of you get so bent out of shape & defensive about what others do & spend on THEIR vehicles. It's not like the government where they take your hard earned money & do something with it that you completely disagree with. If the purchase was a bad one then hopefully that person learns from their mistake & can maybe help someone else not make that mistake. I am completely happy with my purchase & I haven't read any other bad views on any of their products. Was it a little more than I would like to have paid... yes but since covid I fully expect to pay more than what I think is right for quality items. Hopefully that will change here in the near future with the events unfolded last night.

Fair response. In no way am I bent out of shape at YOU. You are a consumer who spent his hard earned money on his own choice. I'll always defend your right to do that. What i am doing is QUESTIONING the claims that are made by both the manufacturer of these parts and the user of these parts. The marketing hype generated by these companies is almost a brainwash on the consumer. Example: Cold air intakes...They don't do ANYTHING to add power on modern day cars. What they DO is produce more intake NOISE, which the mind of the consumer interprets as more power. Push pedal, more noise, brain says more power, consumer tells all the interwebs how much more power they have. Those that understand call BS, and feelings get hurt. That's kinda where I am at here...I'm calling BS. Not that YOU are INTENTIONALLY trying to BS me, but you are a victim of the marketing machine also known as Gale Banks. As to your fuel mileage calcs...I know my Cummins produced better mileage after break in. I know that Florida humidity, temperature, load, driving conditions, etc etc etc affect that. Hand calculating it proves this...You slapped on some Banks hocus pocus and SHAZAMM!! Better fuel mileage, on a vehicle that is LITERALLY delivering the same fuel qty as it was before because it hasn't been tuned. Same fuel = same power on a diesel, unless you are at the upper end of the performance range, of which you are not. So, as stated, believe as you wish...But the reality tells a different tale.

 

[nlambert182]

Fair response. In no way am I bent out of shape at YOU. You are a consumer who spent his hard earned money on his own choice. I'll always defend your right to do that. What i am doing is QUESTIONING the claims that are made by both the manufacturer of these parts and the user of these parts. The marketing hype generated by these companies is almost a brainwash on the consumer. Example: Cold air intakes...They don't do ANYTHING to add power on modern day cars. What they DO is produce more intake NOISE, which the mind of the consumer interprets as more power. Push pedal, more noise, brain says more power, consumer tells all the interwebs how much more power they have. Those that understand call BS, and feelings get hurt. That's kinda where I am at here...I'm calling BS. Not that YOU are INTENTIONALLY trying to BS me, but you are a victim of the marketing machine also known as Gale Banks. As to your fuel mileage calcs...I know my Cummins produced better mileage after break in. I know that Florida humidity, temperature, load, driving conditions, etc etc etc affect that. Hand calculating it proves this...You slapped on some Banks hocus pocus and SHAZAMM!! Better fuel mileage, on a vehicle that is LITERALLY delivering the same fuel qty as it was before because it hasn't been tuned. Same fuel = same power on a diesel, unless you are at the upper end of the performance range, of which you are not. So, as stated, believe as you wish...But the reality tells a different tale.

Well said. @68PowerWagon nothing I said was pointed towards you as the consumer. You can spend your money on anything you'd like. That's none of my business nor my concern.

If it makes you feel good and helps you enjoy your truck, then I am all for it.

I'm addressing the marketing tactics and as Scottly said... the brainwashing that some of these companies are using. Unless you've tuned a diesel engine, it will not make more power on its own. The stock fuel maps just won't let it. Also, if you're still running the emissions equipment any emissions compliant tunes are going to be extremely conservative to keep that system happy, so gains from those are very minimal. The only way to really make power is delete it and then tune.

For the mpg... if you were just at 7k miles when you did this, then break in is almost certainly what increased your mpg. They pick up a substantial mpg increase as they get broken in. You also mentioned that your clutch fan was locked up. I had that happen on my 16 3500 and I dropped almost 3mpg when it was fully engaged all the time. Another likely culprit. It does rob the engine of some power and fuel economy.