Good deal?

[brilliantnick]

Hey all

Quick background about me: I've been hunting for a 1500 bighorn that would fit by budget and desires for a long while now, I went for a test drive a couple weekends ago, had my sights set on the quad initially but then after the ride have now set for the crew. I have a particular taste I guess because there are few trucks out there that meet my strongly desired packages (without adding a whole ton of other stuff that pushes the price up more than I'm willing)

Talked to a whole bunch of dealerships, got the general idea of how things work. Was debating about ordering but I'm afraid of loosing incentives and APR which could really drive the price up.

I finally found one though, it basically matches what I would like, only difference is exterior color which I dont mind, and adding in the nav, which just pushes up the price a bit.

Talking to salesman

MSRP of $54k, Invoice to 51k, after incentives, to 46k. Then tax + licensing after

Given covid and that, I'm wondering if first off is this a good deal, or if this is the normal average every day discount?

Then next is there going to be some future 'massive blowout' of some sort that typically happens that might be worth waiting for?

Any insights would be appreciated!
Thanks

 

[Daw14]

Watch out for the finance person they are the one going to try to stick it to you dry.

 

[Bose48]

Was that for a 2020 or 2021?I think the rebates are pretty good right now on both but I'd have to look again.

 

[brilliantnick]

Watch out for the finance person they are the one going to try to stick it to you dry.

Good tip, hopefully being remote will be able to give easier leverage against them

Was that for a 2020 or 2021?I think the rebates are pretty good right now on both but I'd have to look again.

Sorry I should have specified, it's a 2021

Yeah the listed sales like $5,800 off of course always look great on the surface but have limitations so a few of them don't apply.

 

[Papa Red]

I paid slightly more than that for my truck and I had ordered it to get exactly what I wanted. Not saying it's not a good deal but don't be afraid to order and get what you really want. Good luck. These trucks are awesome.

Red

 

[rws1944]

Did you try a search in Autotrader.com? If you are in Washington try a 200 mile radius from Seattle and also look at the two big sellers in Idaho, Dennis Dillion and Dave Smith. It looks to me that the quote you are getting off MSRP is about average. I'm sure they will take a little more off the $46K they are showing you.

 

[Amerinamese]

I would say that may be average, but I can tell you I paid less than that after taxes and taking on $1,100 of negative equity on my trade. The MSRP on my truck was $55,840 and I paid $45,655 out the door. The dealership's original quote was $51k OTD. I told them I wanted to pay $45k out the door. They initially said they couldn't do that. I said I'm gonna leave so the went to get the keys to my car that I was trading. As I'm waiting, the sales manager comes over and says they can get me out the door at $45,655 if I finance through them. He guaranteed they can get me within .5% of my pre-approved APR of 2.19%. They got me 2.29% so I bought the truck.

As they say, be prepared to walk away. I walked away from 2 other dealerships that wouldn't come down at all in their price.

 

[brilliantnick]

I paid slightly more than that for my truck and I had ordered it to get exactly what I wanted. Not saying it's not a good deal but don't be afraid to order and get what you really want. Good luck. These trucks are awesome.

Red

Yeah they are pretty nice trucks, my dad my uncle and my cousin all have one. So that might be because my uncle actually works at a mechanic shop for chrisler

What I worry about for ordering mostly is that losing out on the incentives and possibly APR might mean a difference of maybe four to 10 thousand? I suppose it depends on whatever kind of deal you can get from something that's on the lot. Knowing my luck it wouldn't turn out for the better.
Ordering online does mean that I could at least get the MSRP slightly cheaper because I can cut out the extras that I don't really need. I would enjoy those upgrades, it's just pushing my affordability.

Did you try a search in Autotrader.com? If you are in Washington try a 200 mile radius from Seattle and also look at the two big sellers in Idaho, Dennis Dillion and Dave Smith. It looks to me that the quote you are getting off MSRP is about average. I'm sure they will take a little more off the $46K they are showing you.

Yeah I've looked all over from Washington to Minnesota and as far as south as Utah, and california. Granted the last couple months there's been slowly more and more vehicles actually tricking into the lot, but of the 1000's some vehicles around there only a couple hundred had this safety package that I'm really wanting. Of those couple hundred fewer yet have blind spot included, while not tacking on a whole ton of other stuff. Most vehicles are >55k msrp. There are a couple better in my window of possibility I think so far I've sent out messages to all the dealerships and I've been starting to get some hard numbers.

I would say that may be average, but I can tell you I paid less than that after taxes and taking on $1,100 of negative equity on my trade. The MSRP on my truck was $55,840 and I paid $45,655 out the door. The dealership's original quote was $51k OTD. I told them I wanted to pay $45k out the door. They initially said they couldn't do that. I said I'm gonna leave so the went to get the keys to my car that I was trading. As I'm waiting, the sales manager comes over and says they can get me out the door at $45,655 if I finance through them. He guaranteed they can get me within .5% of my pre-approved APR of 2.19%. They got me 2.29% so I bought the truck.

As they say, be prepared to walk away. I walked away from 2 other dealerships that wouldn't come down at all in their price.

Hey that's very good to know, if you don't mind me asking what did you get for your trade in?

So I did just enter the next phase of the negotiating bit and I just found the catch... Apparently the 0% APR that's running now has a catch that says "this program is not compatible with the customer cash allowance, combo cash, combo APR and non-prime programs" which apparently must be including the national 2021 retail bonus cash incentives right now.

So that just add on that i wasn't expecting. Now it's basically a split of paying nearly $3,000 in interest or getting $4,000 cash back. Then tack on the nearly $4,000 sales tax and who knows what kind of fees that they will want to add after that... That will bring the total price back up to at least $50k.

Well fortunately even before going in I was already willing and ready to walk out the door, not just because I might be afraid of getting a raw deal but also because I wasn't quite sure I would be actually truly able to afford this either. I wondered what the true walk away price might be and if I had to lower my expectations a little.

I'm going to keep pushing on the other fronts, just to see what shakes out, who knows, maybe this one will come back

 

[Amerinamese]

I traded in a 2018 Maxima SR Midnight Edition. I owed $21,600 and they offered me $20,500. They wanted to give me $17,000 for my car, but brought the price up when I was trying to leave.

I too was interested in the 0% for 72 months until they told me I lose all other rebates.

 

[rws1944]

Yeah they are pretty nice trucks, my dad my uncle and my cousin all have one. So that might be because my uncle actually works at a mechanic shop for chrisler

What I worry about for ordering mostly is that losing out on the incentives and possibly APR might mean a difference of maybe four to 10 thousand? I suppose it depends on whatever kind of deal you can get from something that's on the lot. Knowing my luck it wouldn't turn out for the better.
Ordering online does mean that I could at least get the MSRP slightly cheaper because I can cut out the extras that I don't really need. I would enjoy those upgrades, it's just pushing my affordability.




Yeah I've looked all over from Washington to Minnesota and as far as south as Utah, and california. Granted the last couple months there's been slowly more and more vehicles actually tricking into the lot, but of the 1000's some vehicles around there only a couple hundred had this safety package that I'm really wanting. Of those couple hundred fewer yet have blind spot included, while not tacking on a whole ton of other stuff. Most vehicles are >55k msrp. There are a couple better in my window of possibility I think so far I've sent out messages to all the dealerships and I've been starting to get some hard numbers.




Hey that's very good to know, if you don't mind me asking what did you get for your trade in?

So I did just enter the next phase of the negotiating bit and I just found the catch... Apparently the 0% APR that's running now has a catch that says "this program is not compatible with the customer cash allowance, combo cash, combo APR and non-prime programs" which apparently must be including the national 2021 retail bonus cash incentives right now.

So that just add on that i wasn't expecting. Now it's basically a split of paying nearly $3,000 in interest or getting $4,000 cash back. Then tack on the nearly $4,000 sales tax and who knows what kind of fees that they will want to add after that... That will bring the total price back up to at least $50k.

Well fortunately even before going in I was already willing and ready to walk out the door, not just because I might be afraid of getting a raw deal but also because I wasn't quite sure I would be actually truly able to afford this either. I wondered what the true walk away price might be and if I had to lower my expectations a little.

I'm going to keep pushing on the other fronts, just to see what shakes out, who knows, maybe this one will come back

 

[rws1944]

Several things to know about dealer financing. As you found out, if you take the 0 interest option you can not take any other incentives they offer. If the dealer offers a low interest rate the lender will give the dealer a cash kick back. The trade off between zero financing verses cash incentives is purely mathematical. On low interest rate financing its best to have a solid quote from a lending institution of your choice before negotiating with the dealer. If the rates are close take the dealer offer as some of the cash kick back will be passed to you low through a lower purchase price and you get the other incentives. The next step is see if there are any minimum required payments you have to make before you can pay the contract off. Some folks take the dealer financing up front and then refinance with another lender at a rate less than what the dealer rate was. The dealers lender will not pay the kick back to the dealer unless you make a minimum number of payments even though the dealer passed what he was expecting on to you upfront. If you go this route you must be sure that there are no minimum number of payments required in the contract you sign with the dealer. The dealer will not be happy with you if he does not receive his kick back.

 

[Doug Ram]

I really enjoy buying and selling cars and boats..... It's sort of a hobby of mine. My #1 suggestion is this:

Read "What Car Dealers Don't Want You to Know". The latest version is at....
https://www.amazon.com/What-Dealers-Dont-Want-Know/dp/B00AK3LH04

Basically the book says do your homework before you walk in.... Take control. Walk in with pre-approved financing. Bring bank check with you. Know what the price guide you use says the truck should sell for today. Show it to them. Tell them how you are financing it at that price, what taxes, fees and and delivery should be (aka the "out the door" price). And feel free to waive the check in front of them. Do all the calculations yourself before you arrive. If you want, give them a chance to better your out the door number. Also know what you want: Before you walk in the door you've reviewed multiple dealer inventories, and have the pricing data on the couple of cars you want.

I had to order mine. I would have bought off area inventory, but the trucks available that had the options I need for towing also had a ton of stuff I don't. I knew I would be ordering when I made the appointment. I told them when I walked in that they would be ordering my car. Ultimately I used Costco's pricing service before I walked in. But I could also have used AAA, Consumer Reports or Navy Federal CU, which is financing mine. Don't accept any higher price. If the dealer can get the car you like off area inventory, that's the one you go with. If you have to order, you risk that current incentives, rebates etc will be replaced or go away in the 6 to 8 weeks it takes to build and deliver. Again, try to avoid ordering, because you risk price changes (up) between now and when the ordered truck is delivered.

Once you think you have settled on the price and financing, and are signing the paperwork, the real dealer upselling "commences to begin". You think you are done. You aren't. They will now try to sell you all sort of car-crap. Don't buy any of it. They will push stuff like paint-sealing, fabric protector, prepaid maintenance, rustproofing, yet another extended warranty, VIN theft protection etching, lifetime waxes, lifetime washes, GPS theft locator services, additional theft alarm, lojack or another theft retrieval service, lifetime maintenance, prepaid oil changes, loan payment protection (a form of life insurance), and who knows what else.. I don't know because I am sure I have left something out. You can even get offered identity theft protection (insurance) at some dealers. IT'S ALL OVERPRICED JUNK! that ADDS DEALER PROFIT. If you aren't satisfied with the basic manufacturer warranty and want an extended warranty, don't buy it from the dealer at this point. Go home and comparison shop for it like you shop online for the lowest price for liability and comprehensive car insurance...... Because it is insurance, and it's offered by hundreds of companies, and I guarantee you can find it cheaper than the dealer's policy, which is padded to increase dealer profit.

 

[brilliantnick]

Several things to know about dealer financing. As you found out, if you take the 0 interest option you can not take any other incentives they offer. If the dealer offers a low interest rate the lender will give the dealer a cash kick back. The trade off between zero financing verses cash incentives is purely mathematical. On low interest rate financing its best to have a solid quote from a lending institution of your choice before negotiating with the dealer. If the rates are close take the dealer offer as some of the cash kick back will be passed to you low through a lower purchase price and you get the other incentives. The next step is see if there are any minimum required payments you have to make before you can pay the contract off. Some folks take the dealer financing up front and then refinance with another lender at a rate less than what the dealer rate was. The dealers lender will not pay the kick back to the dealer unless you make a minimum number of payments even though the dealer passed what he was expecting on to you upfront. If you go this route you must be sure that there are no minimum number of payments required in the contract you sign with the dealer. The dealer will not be happy with you if he does not receive his kick back.

Thanks for the info all, So I worked the numbers and decided to go for it

I had actually went to several other dealerships looking at slightly different deals but they couldn't or wouldn't drop them down to the level that I was looking for. In so doing however I managed to make them nervous enough? Or something anyway for them to come back and offer the 0% APR with all the discounts at the same time. Coincidentally of the bajillion times that I had jumped onto the RAM trucks website managed to get a ad or a page that said '$1,500 off your next purchase if you sign up with your email' So that was awesome.

That meant that The only add-on costs were tax and licensing, so that was pretty sweet.

I really enjoy buying and selling cars and boats..... It's sort of a hobby of mine. My #1 suggestion is this:

Read "What Car Dealers Don't Want You to Know". The latest version is at....
https://www.amazon.com/What-Dealers-Dont-Want-Know/dp/B00AK3LH04

Basically the book says do your homework before you walk in.... Take control. Walk in with pre-approved financing. Bring bank check with you. Know what the price guide you use says the truck should sell for today. Show it to them. Tell them how you are financing it at that price, what taxes, fees and and delivery should be (aka the "out the door" price). And feel free to waive the check in front of them. Do all the calculations yourself before you arrive. If you want, give them a chance to better your out the door number. Also know what you want: Before you walk in the door you've reviewed multiple dealer inventories, and have the pricing data on the couple of cars you want.

I had to order mine. I would have bought off area inventory, but the trucks available that had the options I need for towing also had a ton of stuff I don't. I knew I would be ordering when I made the appointment. I told them when I walked in that they would be ordering my car. Ultimately I used Costco's pricing service before I walked in. But I could also have used AAA, Consumer Reports or Navy Federal CU, which is financing mine. Don't accept any higher price. If the dealer can get the car you like off area inventory, that's the one you go with. If you have to order, you risk that current incentives, rebates etc will be replaced or go away in the 6 to 8 weeks it takes to build and deliver. Again, try to avoid ordering, because you risk price changes (up) between now and when the ordered truck is delivered.

Once you think you have settled on the price and financing, and are signing the paperwork, the real dealer upselling "commences to begin". You think you are done. You aren't. They will now try to sell you all sort of car-crap. Don't buy any of it. They will push stuff like paint-sealing, fabric protector, prepaid maintenance, rustproofing, yet another extended warranty, VIN theft protection etching, lifetime waxes, lifetime washes, GPS theft locator services, additional theft alarm, lojack or another theft retrieval service, lifetime maintenance, prepaid oil changes, loan payment protection (a form of life insurance), and who knows what else.. I don't know because I am sure I have left something out. You can even get offered identity theft protection (insurance) at some dealers. IT'S ALL OVERPRICED JUNK! that ADDS DEALER PROFIT. If you aren't satisfied with the basic manufacturer warranty and want an extended warranty, don't buy it from the dealer at this point. Go home and comparison shop for it like you shop online for the lowest price for liability and comprehensive car insurance...... Because it is insurance, and it's offered by hundreds of companies, and I guarantee you can find it cheaper than the dealer's policy, which is padded to increase dealer profit.

Well I didn't manage to get the book in time but I had watched a bunch of YouTube videos from Kevin Hunter about dealerships and that sort of thing, they didn't go for any of that window etching or any of that kind of nonsense but they did try and sell the 'super paint sealing coating on the outside of the vehicle So you don't need to wax for the rest of your life' and this Scotchgard thing for your interior fabric which I thought would be exactly the same as the Bissell pro cleaning solution with Scotchgard so that really wasn't worth the extra $1,500 or so. I did fall for the extended warranty unfortunately It is a good deal I think to get a long extended warranty but they sold it to me for $3,000 and I looked up on the website I think if it is exactly the same as what's on the website I could have got it for $1,600. They didn't even offer any of the gap insurance or stuff like that I already checked with my car insurance company they said it would only increase like $10 a month for it but I didn't even need it anyway because I was putting so much down initially that I'm already well covered.

Now that that stressful bits is all done time to get working on a few upgrades like getting a bed liner and cover in and getting some plastic for the wheel wells. Then it'll be time to go test out the off-roading package

 

[Doug Ram]

What, wha..... Wait a minute!

Did you say you paid $3,000 for an extended warranty, think you got a deal, but saw a similar deal for $1,600?! REALLY!???

No wonder they didn't offer you the VIN etching or gap insurance. Get on the phone or Interewbs NOW and cancel that $ # ! + . Buy the online $1,600 policy.

Extended warranty rip off profit maker strikes again!

 

[Rick Gabler]

Did I get a good deal or just a fair deal? Along with this same question I’m a first time truck owner. I bought a brand new 2019 1500 Classic Warlock Quad. Nice looking truck and a great ride. I put 2K down and pay $259 per mo. 3.5 year lease. 10K per year. After 3.5 years the buy out is 17K. I’ll only have about 15-18000 miles on it (sports car during the warm months here in Mn). When it’s time to turn the truck in. Trucks hold there values do well, it feels like I’d be stupid not to buy this truck at that time...being the only owner. Your thoughts, opinions, advise? To the guy who is looking at a new truck, you can’t worry about the deals down the road. If it’s good enough now, start enjoying it now and waste no time.

 

[Cactusmonkey]

We just bought a 1500 from a dealer in central washington and felt like it was a honest deal with good people. I know they have to make something so I was good with it.

 

[Doug Ram]

Did I get a good deal or just a fair deal? Along with this same question I’m a first time truck owner. I bought a brand new 2019 1500 Classic Warlock Quad. Nice looking truck and a great ride. I put 2K down and pay $259 per mo. 3.5 year lease. 10K per year. After 3.5 years the buy out is 17K. I’ll only have about 15-18000 miles on it (sports car during the warm months here in Mn). When it’s time to turn the truck in. Trucks hold there values do well, it feels like I’d be stupid not to buy this truck at that time...being the only owner. Your thoughts, opinions, advise? To the guy who is looking at a new truck, you can’t worry about the deals down the road. If it’s good enough now, start enjoying it now and waste no time.

Re leases.... I looked into leasing twice but I didn't for the very reason you ask if you got a good deal. It's hard to figure whether you got a deal or not. Leasing is a far more complicated transaction, and when things get complicated the more opportunity there is for getting confused, or screwed. First you have to figure what is a fair price for the new car (which you do when you buy), then you have to agree on the lease term and estimated value it will be at the end of the lease (which you don't do when you buy), and that varies based on the estimated resale value and you have to estimate the number of miles you drive it. Take the difference between the two values and that should be the amount of the car's value you use during the lease. But good luck seeing that anywhere in your lease documents. Then your monthly payment also has to factor in financing that amount. Plus there are fees and there can be a deposit or up front payment. I found it impossible to figure out what was a good lease given all that.

Worse in my book, is that during the entire lease you worry about how every nick and scratch and kid or pet getting sick in the back seat will add more depreciation than is allowed in the lease agreement. At the end of the lease term you are paying for detailing the car, paying a mileage penalty because you took it on too many long trips, or you had to change jobs in the middle of the lease and your commute is now 25% longer. My brother in law started asking his father and then his other relatives to borrow their cars as he realized he was racking up mileage driving his kid all over the state. The the kid qualified for a traveling semi-pro soccer team. Cost him a small fortune.

Leasing seems so attractive, it looks like you can get a better car than you can afford.... But leasing can be a real trap. The truth is that the true price is well hidden and you really can't afford that better car. You just won't know how much you paid until the end of the lease.

Sorry.

 

[brilliantnick]

Did I get a good deal or just a fair deal? Along with this same question I’m a first time truck owner. I bought a brand new 2019 1500 Classic Warlock Quad. Nice looking truck and a great ride. I put 2K down and pay $259 per mo. 3.5 year lease. 10K per year. After 3.5 years the buy out is 17K. I’ll only have about 15-18000 miles on it (sports car during the warm months here in Mn). When it’s time to turn the truck in. Trucks hold there values do well, it feels like I’d be stupid not to buy this truck at that time...being the only owner. Your thoughts, opinions, advise? To the guy who is looking at a new truck, you can’t worry about the deals down the road. If it’s good enough now, start enjoying it now and waste no time.

I'm with Doug, i never did like the idea of leasing, always like to own my stuff at the end of the day. and my truck's only a week and a half old and I've already got scratches in the bed. not worried about it since I'm going to be putting in bedliner as soon as it warms up anyway but still.

It sounds like with your current info there that's the cost of that warlock not counting warranty and tax equals to $29,878. That seems off since the starting price for a warlock is $36, 000 at least on the website right now. Then of course add in for upgrades like 4x4 the 5.7 etc. I looked at that setup before but after adding all the other options that I wanted turned out to be the same price if not more than the bighorn and capacity too.

But there's got to be something else that's being missed there, out the door for a 30,000 feels way too low for a new truck.