Oil/Valve lifter issues.

[J-13GTP]

Got the cam out. Not sure how to feel about it. Looks like some spots are more worn the the others. It's like I can see copper or brass showing through the worn sports.

 

[Ken226]

look the lifter rollers over really well.

 

[J-13GTP]

Update:
Slowly getting the truck back together and started cleaning the pushrods. Found that one intake rod was bent for sure with another being suspect. Its odd though because these are melling. Didn't think I would have a problem with them. Either way the others are fine so I'm getting two replacements.

 

[J-13GTP]

Hey guys. So I got the truck back together enough that I can spin it over with the starter. I have already spun it over by hand a dozen times with out spark plugs with no rough spots. Installed the sparkplugs and turned it over with the starter. Oil pressure finally picked up and the top end appears to be oiling. However Its got a slight gallop to it. Kinda sounds like a low compression on one cylinder. Didnt have a gallop with the spark plugs out. Am I overthinking things? Lifters are new so maybe with arent pumped all the way up? Ill recheck my rocker arms and push rods just to be sure. What do you all think? I had this issue when the lifters would bleed off on cold starts so maybe it nothing.

Edit: So after watching some start up videos I feel a bit better as far as my lope/gallop goes. Most of the videos Ive watched have heavy lifter tick on frist start up. Flood or dry starting videos I can hear a gallop or lope as they roll over.

 

[RamHondo]

Hey guys I'm about to the end of my rope on why my HEMI tick keeps coming back. To make a long story short, my original cam and lifters failed while using PUP 0W-40 at 183k miles. Thought hey if its lasted this long another set of cam/lifters would probable last the life of the truck, even replaced timing and oil pump. The first 6k miles were trouble free used 5w-30 oil during this time with lube grad. But after 6K things started going south. Cold start ticks where starting to get bad. Bad enough that I started changing my oil to see if I could see anything in the oil. Ive been seeing one or two silver slivers in my oil changes. It's possible that these were left overs from the original camp/lifters failing or could be the replacements are going bad. Either way I started noticing that after oil changes, cold start ticks would go away up until 500 miles then they would come back, during these changes I have been using lube grad as while. Changed oil back to 0W-40 PUP one last time and it did the same, lasted to 500 and then cold start ticks started coming back and even once while idling it started ticking. Finally swapped oil to Redline 5W-30. This time Ive been able to get 1k on miles before the cold start ticks came back. I know cold start ticks can be a way of life for Hemis but its taking over a minute maybe two to stop ticking and sounds awful.

What do you guys think? I'm really debating replacing the lifters and hoping the cam isn't toast. The parts are still under warranty. After that I'm probably going to sale the truck. I cannot handle anything that's just going to keep eating lifters/cams.

Get oil analysis!

 

[Burla]

Update:
Slowly getting the truck back together and started cleaning the pushrods. Found that one intake rod was bent for sure with another being suspect. Its odd though because these are melling. Didn't think I would have a problem with them. Either way the others are fine so I'm getting two replacements.

Yeah that is what I thought, great job, no oil will help a bent push rod. Maybe it could have prevented it we will never know, but once it is bent, only replacing it will get that fixed. It is so important to post video's because many of us have listened to many of them so we know what is hemi tick and what is something more fatal.

I am pretty sure it isn't the push rod itself that was the fail, but rather the thing that plagues these hemi's, this was just downstream.

 

[J-13GTP]

Update time: Got the truck together and going. Got about 400 miles on it with no issues but only time will tell. Used Valoline restore and protect on this oil change, hopefully it will clean some of this gunk out. Ill change the filter at about 1500 miles.

 

[Burla]

Good job brother. I might be inclined to use a hearty oil in the future when you are done with break it. Keep stuff sliding smooth, good large filter as well.

 

[alex6666]

thanks for documenting your journey....it's been a great read. Oddly....and i'm not sure relateted to your issue....I get the odd tick on start up that seems to be related to the truck being started on an uphill incline.
I used to get a regular start up tick that was 95% resolved with lubeguard but the odd time.....it's back....doo, doo, doo, doo

 

[Ken226]

Anyone seen this guy's video on the subject.

We look into the Hemi lifter failures and the dreaded Hemi tick

We unpack the lifter oiling issue that plague the late Hemi.Powellmachineinc.comIf you want to support us financially https://cash.app/$PowellMachine

youtu.be

It sounds like he's blaming hemi tick and the cam failures, partially at least, on the loss of oil flow through a worn rocker assembly.

 

[JHoward]

Anyone seen this guy's video on the subject.

We look into the Hemi lifter failures and the dreaded Hemi tick

We unpack the lifter oiling issue that plague the late Hemi.Powellmachineinc.comIf you want to support us financially https://cash.app/$PowellMachine

youtu.be

It sounds like he's blaming hemi tick and the cam failures, partially at least, on the loss of oil flow through a worn rocker assembly.

I couldn't stand to finish watching the video, I'm from the south and I hope I don't "drawl and twang" like that when I'm speaking.

Hopefully, someone will watch it and post an comment that I can read instead.

 

[Wild one]

Update time: Got the truck together and going. Got about 400 miles on it with no issues but only time will tell. Used Valoline restore and protect on this oil change, hopefully it will clean some of this gunk out. Ill change the filter at about 1500 miles.

I'd change oil and filter at 500 miles,then again at 1500. You're pushing your luck running a filter that long after replacing the cam,cheaper and easier to do a couple short oil change intervals then redoing the job again.

 

[Ken226]

I couldn't stand to finish watching the video, I'm from the south and I hope I don't "drawl and twang" like that when I'm speaking.

Hopefully, someone will watch it and post an comment that I can read instead.

Funny.

When I first posted it, I commented about his accent.

Then I came back and edited it out, in case someone from the south on here got butthurt.

 

[Wild one]

I couldn't stand to finish watching the video, I'm from the south and I hope I don't "drawl and twang" like that when I'm speaking.

Hopefully, someone will watch it and post an comment that I can read instead.

Basically he reiterates a bunch of Uncle Tony's ideas from a few years ago about the lifter angle in relation to the cam,but he does have a pretty good idea of how to get more oil onto the lifter wheel by using either a machined flat or groove on the topside of the lifter body. Other then that there's really nothing new to his video that already hasn't been covered by either Uncle Tony or Sky at Reignited Cycle.
Being a Canuck his accent is a bit tough to handle ,but definitely not bad enough to make me not watch his video

 

[J-13GTP]

As far as oil changes go I did forget to mention that I did use a start up oil swaped out to the oil Im using now. Just may change the filter at 500 to see whats going on.

HMM worn out rockers. Well mine to have 189k on them know, the thought didnt occur to me that they could be an issue. They looked ok, nothing really stood out.

 

[Wild one]

All these video's fail to take into account how small the actual oil feed hole is in the head gasket itself,the oil holes in the block and heads are a decent size,but the head gasket necks the feed holes down to almost nothing in size compared to the holes in the block and head. But the topend of a Hemi isn't really the issue or the actual lifter body and plunger itself,as they get enough oil to survive,it's the lack of oil actually making it to the cam lobe/lifter wheel and the axle the wheel rides on,that's where the issues are.His idea of a flat or groove in the topside of the lifter body is a good idea though. Another one would be to use a sprayer similiar to the piston squirters to spray an actual oil stream onto each cam lobe,which would accomplish a couple things,first it'd get more oil onto the cam lobe,and it'd also help pull heat out of the cam and lifter wheel,and get them closer to running at oil temp levels

 

[Ken226]

All these video's fail to take into account how small the actual oil feed hole is in the head gasket itself,the oil holes in the block and heads are a decent size,but the head gasket necks the feed holes down to almost nothing in size compared to the holes in the block and head. But the topend of a Hemi isn't really the issue or the actual lifter body and plunger itself,as they get enough oil to survive,it's the lack of oil actually making it to the cam lobe/lifter wheel and the axle the wheel rides on,that's where the issues are.His idea of a flat or groove in the topside of the lifter body is a good idea though. Another one would be to use a sprayer similiar to the piston squirters to spray an actual oil stream onto each cam lobe,which would accomplish a couple things,first it'd get more oil onto the cam lobe,and it'd also help pull heat out of the cam and lifter wheel,and get them closer to running at oil temp levels

That would be really easy to do. I have a machine shop and a good selection of tungsten carbide end mills.

A single pass lengthwise with a 1/16" ball mill, 1/32" deep, on the up facing side of the lifter body would provide a very small but continuous flow of oil into the roller. It would take about 10 seconds per lifter to do this on my milling machine.

But, is a lack of oil on the cam/rollers the actual problem? Some say that the lack of oil after the top end drains down, and the beating that the cam and rollers are subjected to while waiting for oil to pump up the lifters, is the biggest issue.

 

[Wild one]

That would be really easy to do. I have a machine shop and a good selection of tungsten carbide end mills.

A single pass lengthwise with a 1/16" ball mill, 1/32" deep, on the up facing side of the lifter body would provide a very small but continuous flow of oil into the roller. It would take about 10 seconds per lifter to do this on my milling machine.

But, is a lack of oil on the cam/rollers the actual problem? Some say that the lack of oil after the top end drains down, and the beating that the cam and rollers are subjected to while waiting for oil to pump up the lifters, is the biggest issue.

I kind of subscribe to the theory the valve springs are a bit weak,especially after they've had a few miles put on them,and they start to allow the lifters to bounce on the down side of the ramp,and more of an oil cushion would soften the bounce back blow,but i'm not sure if that's a cause either. About all that backs up that theory is the fact the guys who replace the valve springs with a decent high performance valve spring like Ma Mopars .625 lift springs when they do an aftermarket cam,never seem to have another issue with lifter failure afterwards,while you'll hear of guys who use the same cam/lifter package but don't replace the springs,and they're back into the engine doing another cam in 50,000 or less miles.

 

[JHoward]

Basically he reiterates a bunch of Uncle Tony's ideas from a few years ago about the lifter angle in relation to the cam,but he does have a pretty good idea of how to get more oil onto the lifter wheel by using either a machined flat or groove on the topside of the lifter body. Other then that there's really nothing new to his video that already hasn't been covered by either Uncle Tony or Sky at Reignited Cycle.
Being a Canuck his accent is a bit tough to handle ,but definitely not bad enough to make me not watch his video

Well, my Canadian(Canuck)friend, I appreciate your reply.

I've resided in the south since my father's military retirement (he was twenty years and one day, USAF).

I've been to many places around the world growing up an military brat and still get anxious and retort on some of the "southern drawl" that folks speak where I reside... and heck, my family has been southern from the git go ...,lol.

 

[JHoward]

Basically he reiterates a bunch of Uncle Tony's ideas from a few years ago about the lifter angle in relation to the cam,but he does have a pretty good idea of how to get more oil onto the lifter wheel by using either a machined flat or groove on the topside of the lifter body. Other then that there's really nothing new to his video that already hasn't been covered by either Uncle Tony or Sky at Reignited Cycle.
Being a Canuck his accent is a bit tough to handle ,but definitely not bad enough to make me not watch his video

Okey dokey, thanks for that, Rick.