Starter Issues - Or Worse?

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SaintlySins

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Starter Motor stays engaged for a long time before motor turns over.
Sounds a little like it's spinning faster than usual - but I may be wrong about speed as it's never spun very long at all

Any clues, ideas?

2021 EcoDiesel Limited
25K miles
Just started within 50 miles after a fill up from 1/8 tank
Ambient Temps 35 degrees.
 
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SaintlySins

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Thanks - my intention is to get it into shop - but I'm traveling thus Turkey Day weekend and worried I'm doing harm with each start - about 4 times daily - or, I'll go somewhere and get stranded.

If I was back home, I could just use another car until Ram could go into the shop.

If this is serious, I'll see what dealer can take it, fly home Sunday and come back when it's fixed.


Still looking for answers.
 
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SaintlySins

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No dealership in the Rocky Mountains can even take the truck till Mid December.

So I took a deep dive into the Internet and came back with two "possible" problems and temp solutions.

1. When I filled the tank, it was bad Diesel and to have tank drained (not possible on my own in remote Mountains) and\or add Diesel conditioner\booster to the tank.


2. It might be a plug that prevents the Fuel from flowing back to the tank after stopping is malfunctioning.
Turn the Aux on for a minute before hitting ignition, which should reload the fuel line and it'll start right up.


The 2nd one worked. Several times. And I got Hot Shots Diesel Additive into the tank too.


I'm feeling a LOT MORE comfortable now. When I get back home I'll have my local Dealer take a look.


Hope everyone has a good Thanksgiving!
 

06 Dodge

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No dealership in the Rocky Mountains can even take the truck till Mid December.

So I took a deep dive into the Internet and came back with two "possible" problems and temp solutions.

1. When I filled the tank, it was bad Diesel and to have tank drained (not possible on my own in remote Mountains) and\or add Diesel conditioner\booster to the tank.


2. It might be a plug that prevents the Fuel from flowing back to the tank after stopping is malfunctioning.
Turn the Aux on for a minute before hitting ignition, which should reload the fuel line and it'll start right up.


The 2nd one worked. Several times. And I got Hot Shots Diesel Additive into the tank too.


I'm feeling a LOT MORE comfortable now. When I get back home I'll have my local Dealer take a look.


Hope everyone has a good Thanksgiving!

How long has to been since you drained the fuel filter, changed out the fuel filter? I have no experience with Hot Shot products, I have been using Opti lube products in my 22 for the past 7 months, the old fail safe that is available all most everywhere is Power Service Winter in the white bottle as it will help with water in your fuel and its also an anti gel, good luck...
 
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SaintlySins

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How long has to been since you drained the fuel filter, changed out the fuel filter? I have no experience with Hot Shot products, I have been using Opti lube products in my 22 for the past 7 months, the old fail safe that is available all most everywhere is Power Service Winter in the white bottle as it will help with water in your fuel and its also an anti gel, good luck...
Ram had a full service (dealer) about 800 miles ago, all filters emptied and changed.

I've used vehicle several times: first two I turned did the Aux for 20 seconds before starting and no issues.

Had a brain-fart and used AutoStart and happy to report it started right up. Went straight to ignition every time since and it's starting immediately.

As for why I picked what Diesel Additives to use, I was shown/given a link to this very detailed test of the major Diesel brands. Here's the video - hope it helps:

 

KoboldTaco

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OP for your back-of-mind thoughts, a clogged DPF will also cause long crank. Does not seem to be your issue but good to know for the future.
 

06 Dodge

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Ram had a full service (dealer) about 800 miles ago, all filters emptied and changed.

I've used vehicle several times: first two I turned did the Aux for 20 seconds before starting and no issues.

Had a brain-fart and used AutoStart and happy to report it started right up. Went straight to ignition every time since and it's starting immediately.

As for why I picked what Diesel Additives to use, I was shown/given a link to this very detailed test of the major Diesel brands. Here's the video - hope it helps:


I'm not one to trust any U tube person, as for long cranks if your in colder temps of the Rocky Mt it takes longer for the engine to start in cooler temps, this is why Cummins put a grid heater in the air intake to aid in start up in cold temps. Also if your in areas of cold the fuel sold is normally winterized (aka blended with #1 diesel) for the expected temp in that area as #2 diesel will start to gel around 32 degrees so its a good idea to let the glow plugs ( I think the newer once still have them) in your eco diesel to run there cycle to aid startup....
 
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SaintlySins

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Thank you to @KoboldTaco & @06 Dodge for optional advice/opinions.

Sad to report the long crank is back. HOWEVER ... for the first time, so is the warning the Water Fuel Filter Warning Light.

Makes me think the Ram Service I had only 800 Miles and two tank-fulls ago didn't really do the Fuel Filter as it says on my receipt! It's hard for me to believe there's a filter full of water in only 36 gallons, one fill from a Truck Stop on highway with a line of truckers and high diesel turn over and a popular intersection in Denver Fuel station.

Got back to house in the mountains and will go out in morning and drain the filter. Brrrr!

If this is/was the problem - there's a meeting with a Service Manager and I when I get back home! LOLOLL
 
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No dealership in the Rocky Mountains can even take the truck till Mid December.

So I took a deep dive into the Internet and came back with two "possible" problems and temp solutions.

1. When I filled the tank, it was bad Diesel and to have tank drained (not possible on my own in remote Mountains) and\or add Diesel conditioner\booster to the tank.


2. It might be a plug that prevents the Fuel from flowing back to the tank after stopping is malfunctioning.
Turn the Aux on for a minute before hitting ignition, which should reload the fuel line and it'll start right up.


The 2nd one worked. Several times. And I got Hot Shots Diesel Additive into the tank too.


I'm feeling a LOT MORE comfortable now. When I get back home I'll have my local Dealer take a look.


Hope everyone has a good Thanksgiving!
Hot Shots Secret is excellent for diesel fuel. Highly Recommend! Especially below freezing temps.
 

06 Dodge

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Thank you to @KoboldTaco & @06 Dodge for optional advice/opinions.

Sad to report the long crank is back. HOWEVER ... for the first time, so is the warning the Water Fuel Filter Warning Light.

Makes me think the Ram Service I had only 800 Miles and two tank-fulls ago didn't really do the Fuel Filter as it says on my receipt! It's hard for me to believe there's a filter full of water in only 36 gallons, one fill from a Truck Stop on highway with a line of truckers and high diesel turn over and a popular intersection in Denver Fuel station.

Got back to house in the mountains and will go out in morning and drain the filter. Brrrr!

If this is/was the problem - there's a meeting with a Service Manager and I when I get back home! LOLOLL
The WIF light does not mean the filter is full of water but that it has detected enough water that you need to drain it asap, btw yes you can collect that much water in just a few tanks of diesel if its mixed with Bio or the station got a bad load of fuel, if people knew what can get mixed with diesel or even gas at the tank farms they would be shocked....
 
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SaintlySins

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Hi All,

Looking for advice I can't find on the Interwebs ...

Some may think this is old, well known knowledge, but this is my first Diesel and I'm looking to get informed ... especially when I go against the Gas/Diesel Station as well as getting to know details I just can't find in the Owners Manual or on line.

When purging water from the Fuel Filter, what is the max amount of water I should expect?

Does the Winter make more water than summer?

Have you heard of anyone getting bad Diesel from a fuel vendor and success in getting reimbursement? (damages/values to be determined)

If winter does make for more water/condensation the Filter clears ... is it more water at higher altitudes than lower ... I as I didn't have one issue during the entire lift of the Ram in last years Chicago winter storms.

How ofter do you purge the filter?

.... and feel free to add to what I'm asking yet would be helpful to know.

Thank you in advance

Gregory
 

06 Dodge

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Hi All,

Looking for advice I can't find on the Interwebs ...

Some may think this is old, well known knowledge, but this is my first Diesel and I'm looking to get informed ... especially when I go against the Gas/Diesel Station as well as getting to know details I just can't find in the Owners Manual or on line.

When purging water from the Fuel Filter, what is the max amount of water I should expect?

Does the Winter make more water than summer?

Have you heard of anyone getting bad Diesel from a fuel vendor and success in getting reimbursement? (damages/values to be determined)

If winter does make for more water/condensation the Filter clears ... is it more water at higher altitudes than lower ... I as I didn't have one issue during the entire lift of the Ram in last years Chicago winter storms.

How ofter do you purge the filter?

.... and feel free to add to what I'm asking yet would be helpful to know.

Thank you in advance

Gregory

Trying to get a reimbursement from a station for a small amount of water in your fuel is most likely not going to happen as you would need a lot of Proof it was their fuel, I have never heard of anyone doing so in 40 years, I'm not saying it has not happed just I have not read or heard of anyone doing so...

I have never had my WIF light come on in either of my 2 Ram trucks in the past 16 years (including 13 years in cold Midwest) in the winter I drain filter every few months but then I also use winter fuel additives that help deal with water when temps may reach 32 degrees... If you use Bio diesel I would treat every tank from fall until late spring and also drain fuel filter twice a month year round.. Also make sure you only use OEM fuel filters too many aftermarket one come from China do not meet the 3 micron rating that Ram requires to be used..
 

20IndyRam

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Hi All,

Looking for advice I can't find on the Interwebs ...

Some may think this is old, well known knowledge, but this is my first Diesel and I'm looking to get informed ... especially when I go against the Gas/Diesel Station as well as getting to know details I just can't find in the Owners Manual or on line.

When purging water from the Fuel Filter, what is the max amount of water I should expect?

Does the Winter make more water than summer?

Have you heard of anyone getting bad Diesel from a fuel vendor and success in getting reimbursement? (damages/values to be determined)

If winter does make for more water/condensation the Filter clears ... is it more water at higher altitudes than lower ... I as I didn't have one issue during the entire lift of the Ram in last years Chicago winter storms.

How ofter do you purge the filter?

.... and feel free to add to what I'm asking yet would be helpful to know.

Thank you in advance

Gregory
As Luck would have it, I just returned from The Denver area after spending Turkey day with my son.

I'm a relative newbie with the EcoDiesel (2020) but have had good luck so far (40K Miles). I did get bit in Texas in Feb of 2021 when they had their freeze. I learned the hard way that you can't trust anyone to use winter diesel blends. Since then I always add additives. I have never had the water in filter warning pop up.

The Denver area being high (altitude - not the other stuff) and dry would be far less likely to produce condensation than Chicago. My home is 90 miles east of you in Indiana/Michigan and I have never had an issue with water at any station in the area. If you got a bad fuel load, I would chalk that up to maintenance at the station. Stations do need to maintain their tanks to prevent water and microbes from contaminating the fuel.

You fuel filter should have been changed at 20K Miles (maintenance schedule). If you can't tell whether it was changed (previous owner, etc) have it done. I have only drained my filter once during at 5K into a 10K oil change. I got a minimal amount of water (teaspoon?).

What I would suggest (again) is additives. I started using Howes antigel and Hotshots Every Day Treatment after the Texas issues. Discontinued Howes after some reports on wear. Bottom line - the CP4 high pressure pump in our diesels is suspect and there is currently a recall looming (due out in December time frame). Lubricity is your friend in holding off the CP4 fuel pump degradation.

Our EcoDiesels are less prone to the CP4 pump failure due to the lower fuel requirements of our engines. The GM Duramax engines (6.6L no lift pump) are reported to be far worse.

Don't want to scare you on the EcoDiesel. It is a different beast, but I love mine. Got me 28 Mpg running from Denver to Indiana yesterday with a headwind. We use it as our trip vehicle. Comfortable, reliable, and good road mileage (as long as you keep it under 75).

Hope things work out for you out west.
 
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