Stuck Lifter, metal filings and overhaul…

[Red Deer Ram]

So, had a stuck lifter, my truck had sit for a time without being ran. It made A ton of noise after being ran and for whatever reason but after awhile freed itself up. Didn’t drive it much… so i Changed the oil, and Lo and behold, metal filings… So I decided to be pre-emotive and swap out the cam and lifters…
So, I bought a stage 1 Comp Cam, Johnson Lifters, timing chain, Hellcat oil pump and now I dug in. But had a big surprise today… All lifters are fine, Cam is fine… not a mark on it… engine is spotless, zero varnish. The tensioner had slight wear. Engine has 70,000 miles.
After the stuck lifter, the engine ran with a little less power I believe and had a bit of a lope to it. No MIL lamp indicator.
Cylinder walls are tidy, and still show some crosshatching not a scratch… bottom end spins freely… where did the filings come from? Crank? Man… I am dropping the oil pan to swap in the new pump… guess I should be looking at crank bearings? Anyone have a similar situation?
I‘ve owned it since new, ran on synthetic and well maintained…

 

[Burla]

What did they look like? Where some longish like an inch and curled?

Pull the oil control valve and see if that has metal shavings before continuing.

If it is in bearings you might be lucky and just have them in the pan, but if it is in oil control valve the metal shavings are throughout engine.

 

[Burla]

Did you even run codes?

 

[Red Deer Ram]

Did you even run codes?

Haven't had a code show up... so no. The metal filings were super fine. The fine metal particles were in the oil as i drained the engine yesterday. I will check the oil control valve tonight... Thanks!

 

[Red Deer Ram]

Oil control valve is clean...

 

[Red Deer Ram]

No sign that the filings found their way into the top end. Not sure where they may have originated... I was sure it was from the Cam, but... she's in good shape.

 

[EdGs]

Are the filings magnetic?

 

[Burla]

Oil control valve is clean...

That is the fca standard for rebuilding engines, so I'd say it is a good choice to rebuild as opposed to get a new engine. You didnt happen to keep the oil in a container and have yet to recycle? A uoa would be a real good tool to use if you still have oil from the last change. Probably a mute point since you are rebuilding it, but it might shed light to what it is. if it is fine powder I wouldnt worry about it. Can you explain how you had a "stuck" lifter, what does that mean?

When you get your new engine broken in, research the oil strategies we have on the board here. Here is one thread, ram forum members have spent a decade finding options to deal with problems that plague hemi's, and a lubrication strategy has kept many rams for seeing a shop. FCA made a hemi specific oil that is a different then normal base oil and heavy ep additives, ram forum took that to the next level and the results have been great which is surprising since the test group of hemi all had/have hemi tick.

 

[Red Deer Ram]

Are the filings magnetic?

Yes, they were...

 

[Red Deer Ram]

That is the fca standard for rebuilding engines, so I'd say it is a good choice to rebuild as opposed to get a new engine. You didnt happen to keep the oil in a container and have yet to recycle? A uoa would be a real good tool to use if you still have oil from the last change. Probably a mute point since you are rebuilding it, but it might shed light to what it is. if it is fine powder I wouldnt worry about it. Can you explain how you had a "stuck" lifter, what does that mean?

When you get your new engine broken in, research the oil strategies we have on the board here. Here is one thread, ram forum members have spent a decade finding options to deal with problems that plague hemi's, and a lubrication strategy has kept many rams for seeing a shop. FCA made a hemi specific oil that is a different then normal base oil and heavy ep additives, ram forum took that to the next level and the results have been great which is surprising since the test group of hemi all had/have hemi tick.

The truck sat for awhile, i have a second RAM as a work vehicle... and when I started it, the lifter (I assume) was quite loud. I let it run long enough to move the truck around the block to my garage, Still clacking away... Shut it down. 2 days later, started it up, same thing. Did not drive it. About a week later I had to move the truck, started it up and the lifter noise wasn't present. But, had a noise when cold that sounded like timing chain slap, that went away at warm up.

I then drained the oil, discovered the filings, changed the oil and filter for the time being and installed a very strong rare earth magnet on the underside of the pan, I figured this would be a solution until I can get to the teardown. The truck wasn't used at this time. I was sure I would see a ruined cam lobe, or at least a rough spinning lifter roller. But such is not the case. I will pull the pan and see what else the magnet caught. I think I have the old oil still... The filings are ferrous.

So no issues on the top end... it must be something in the bottom end. I didn't plan on tackiling the crank and rod bearings... Thanks!

 

[dFRESH]

What did they look like? Where some longish like an inch and curled?

Pull the oil control valve and see if that has metal shavings before continuing.

If it is in bearings you might be lucky and just have them in the pan, but if it is in oil control valve the metal shavings are throughout engine.

Hi Burla, question for you. I just put mine in the shop after it started misfiring. They say there is metal in the oil control valve and need to replace the whole engine. Does that sound right to you? Dealer wants $13k for the engine installed! Thinking a rebuilt Jasper, installed by one of the mechanics they recommed is a better option. What are your thoughts?

 

[Burla]

Hi Burla, question for you. I just put mine in the shop after it started misfiring. They say there is metal in the oil control valve and need to replace the whole engine. Does that sound right to you? Dealer wants $13k for the engine installed! Thinking a rebuilt Jasper, installed by one of the mechanics they recommed is a better option. What are your thoughts?

yeah, that is the metric sadly, once metal is in the top of the engine it makes sense to replace. I would however get it towed to a reputable independent or drive it if it still drives and have them do it for maybe 8k. Make sure they put a warranty or have a warranty, at least 12 mos, the engine should be 36 mos I guess, but you want 12 on the labor imo, more is better, GL Burla

 

[dFRESH]

yeah, that is the metric sadly, once metal is in the top of the engine it makes sense to replace. I would however get it towed to a reputable independent or drive it if it still drives and have them do it for maybe 8k. Make sure they put a warranty or have a warranty, at least 12 mos, the engine should be 36 mos I guess, but you want 12 on the labor imo, more is better, GL Burla

You are spot on. I found a guy recommended by Jasper that will drop a Jasper refurb in with a 100k 3 year warranty for $8K. Thanks for the peace of mind!

 

[dFRESH]

You are spot on. I found a guy recommended by Jasper that will drop a Jasper refurb in with a 100k 3 year warranty for $8K. Thanks for the peace of mind!

BTW, they sent me this pic.

 

[Burn2k12Ram]

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[Burla]

You are spot on. I found a guy recommended by Jasper that will drop a Jasper refurb in with a 100k 3 year warranty for $8K. Thanks for the peace of mind!

Yeah they say refurb, but for all intense purposes those are new engines. Did they say what the labor warranty is? I'd ask and see if I could get anything on this, even 3 mos is piece of mind. If the labor warranty is included in that 3 year 100k, I wouldnt even hesitate, just do that!

 

[Burn2k12Ram]

Yeah they say refurb, but for all intense purposes those are new engines. Did they say what the labor warranty is? I'd ask and see if I could get anything on this, even 3 mos is piece of mind. If the labor warranty is included in that 3 year 100k, I wouldnt even hesitate, just do that!

Reading on the Jasper site warranty info any of their authorized installers that 3 year 100k warranty includes the parts and labor. https://www.jasperengines.com/remanufactured-engines-faq

 

[Burla]

Reading on the Jasper site warranty info any of their authorized installers that 3 year 100k warranty includes the parts and labor. https://www.jasperengines.com/remanufactured-engines-faq

thanks! wow this is great, I plan on driving this truck forever, if needed I wouldnt hesitate to do that.

I hope the jasper rfe is the same, probably is.

 

[46RamMan]

yeah, that is the metric sadly, once metal is in the top of the engine it makes sense to replace. I would however get it towed to a reputable independent or drive it if it still drives and have them do it for maybe 8k. Make sure they put a warranty or have a warranty, at least 12 mos, the engine should be 36 mos I guess, but you want 12 on the labor imo, more is better, GL Burla

Say Burla why can you not rebuild the motor ? I have rebuilt many engines over the years with great luck. Boiled and flushed and magna flux the blocks , total resurface and rebuilt the heads 3 angle valve job new guides etc... turn crank all new innerds cam bearings timing chains and gears etc. Way cheaper than a $8,000 plus motor I would think.

 

[Burla]

Say Burla why can you not rebuild the motor ? I have rebuilt many engines over the years with great luck. Boiled and flushed and magna flux the blocks , total resurface and rebuilt the heads 3 angle valve job new guides etc... turn crank all new innerds cam bearings timing chains and gears etc. Way cheaper than a $8,000 plus motor I would think.

I'm just saying dealer metric is when oil is at oil control valve that is what they use to order a new engine because of risk of metal in engine after a rebuild. If you have all those skills knock yourself out, most people including me in my later years don't have the skills or energy to pop an engine and hyper clean it to the bone and put it back. Maybe if I didnt have ten million things on my plate, but my starch is gone but not forgotten.