Uncle Tony SPEAKS on cam and lifter failure in 5.7 hemi

[Tom8]

What is the failure rate of these engines using 5w-20 and not red line or other additive oil? I’m curious the failure rate and the average miles it failed at and per which type of driving habit.

I can’t imagine the failure rate of these engines being pass 10 percent or there would be a class action lawsuit against fca.

 

[RLJ10X]

My question is: What can the Engine Rebuilders do to the block to make it flow more oil to critical areas?

^To me, that would be the definitive solution; not that better oils aren't another avenue for the time being.

How long will it take FCA to modify the block to provide the cure?

 

[dell1991]

So it best to switch from 5w-20 to 5w-30 ???


Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

 

[16RamHemi]

My question is: What can the Engine Rebuilders do to the block to make it flow more oil to critical areas?

^To me, that would be the definitive solution; not that better oils aren't another avenue for the time being.

How long will it take FCA to modify the block to provide the cure?

I see where you are coming from, but I disagree with it being the definitive solution. I'm no mechanic, and I see the flaw. I'm sure every engine builder can see it. We know fca is aware. It falls on them. They either built engines with known flaws to lead to faster failure or wasn't aware, yet never looked into failures and redesigned. I do not believe one percent that fca is not aware of this.

 

[seabrook]

What is the failure rate of these engines using 5w-20 and not red line or other additive oil? I’m curious the failure rate and the average miles it failed at and per which type of driving habit.

I can’t imagine the failure rate of these engines being pass 10 percent or there would be a class action lawsuit against fca.

I run 5-20 synthetic and it is silent. My drive to work is 80 miles RT with almost no city driving. Also for some reason not all of them tick and some model years are more prone to the problem.

 

[seabrook]

So the tick is the lifter sliding in the bore?

 

[buddy guy]

Suzuki built and sold a lot of Boulevard (C50 & C90) bikes that had a flawed power system & a flawed oil delivery system. For some reason they chose to address this in a limited recall that did NOT address the problem in all bikes affected. Both were easily fixable. The power system with a more direct wiring solution & as quite often was necessary, a better quality generator or relocation of the current generator where it could get better airflow. The flawed oil delivery system & not enough power to actually charge the battery at idle were fixed by a 100 rpm increase to idle.

There is no doubt Suzuki knew about the issues. Money was likely the big issue in the case of the power system (Suzuki would end up phasing out the bikes for a number of years) and something as simply as effecting the sound of that big twin on a Suzuki C90 when everyone wanted an engine that loped like a Harley, affected the 2nd issue. Hell, guys were playing with tweaking down the idle from stock making charging & lube issues worse!

As has been said before, its cheaper for FCA to fix the number of hemis that are reported as having issues than to do a recall of course, coupled with the idea of the 5.7 being an end of generation engine. I just don't expect FCA to put any money into refining the old beast any further or a minimal amount. My questions are:

-I wonder how many hemis are not reported as they are repurposed to a 2nd, 3rd owner then rebuilt down the road or just become an end of service vehicle overall. Or people simply don't pay much attention to the engine sound? I do believe being on a Ram enthusiasts forum we live in somewhat of a bubble where every issue is amplified.

-my bigger question is: what would it take to trigger an actual recall? I assume safety issues is the best bet & this wouldn't qualify. I would never assume that because our cost to fix this is extraordinary, that that would be a trigger for FCA!

Sent from my SM-N960W using Tapatalk

 

[buddy guy]

I run 5-20 synthetic and it is silent. My drive to work is 80 miles RT with almost no city driving. Also for some reason not all of them tick and some model years are more prone to the problem.

I would love to see a tracking on this forum of truck idle hours for those who have the tick & don't if that indeed is an issue. (I believe it is). You would expect at the very least those who have 4-6 months of winter per year would have more issues.

Sent from my SM-N960W using Tapatalk

 

[chrisbh17]

I would love to see a tracking on this forum of truck idle hours for those who have the tick & don't if that indeed is an issue. (I believe it is). You would expect at the very least those who have 4-6 months of winter per year would have more issues.

Sent from my SM-N960W using Tapatalk

It seems to happen much more in fleet vehicles like construction, police, etc. They spend a TON of time idling, vs the average joe who just drives it daily. Still, some daily drivers are having issues as well.

I see the flaws but have to wonder....why are the older engines more affected? Is it a combination of the design flaws and cheaper materials? Did they manage to tighten tolerances enough that "lubrication by luck" occurs more now?

And my own personal question - would I have bought a Hemi if I had seen this before purchase? Starting to wonder!

 

[buddy guy]

It seems to happen much more in fleet vehicles like construction, police, etc. They spend a TON of time idling, vs the average joe who just drives it daily. Still, some daily drivers are having issues as well.

I see the flaws but have to wonder....why are the older engines more affected? Is it a combination of the design flaws and cheaper materials? Did they manage to tighten tolerances enough that "lubrication by luck" occurs more now?

And my own personal question - would I have bought a Hemi if I had seen this before purchase? Starting to wonder!

Your last question is a valid one. I had never heard of this possible issue with Hemi 5.7s until after I bought my truck. To have to consider the possibility of having to spend 1/3 again of what I paid for my truck to fix a known issue is discouraging for sure. So I remind myself:

Aside from a Tundra..and maybe a Tacoma, no other truck excited me like my Ram (except a Raptor & thats a whole other story)

I couldn't afford any other new truck when I bought this one. (33k canadian vs 40k plus for an f150 or a tacoma. 45+ for a raptor. Not a gm fan at all)

So the only other possibility to consider was..a car? So maybe I would have taken my chances on the Ram anyway.

Sent from my SM-N960W using Tapatalk

 

[chrisbh17]

Your last question is a valid one. I had never heard of this possible issue with Hemi 5.7s until after I bought my truck. To have to consider the possibility of having to spend 1/3 again of what I paid for my truck to fix a known issue is discouraging for sure. So I remind myself:

Aside from a Tundra..and maybe a Tacoma, no other truck excited me like my Ram (except a Raptor & thats a whole other story)

I couldn't afford any other new truck when I bought this one. (33k canadian vs 40k plus for an f150 or a tacoma. 45+ for a raptor. Not a gm fan at all)

So the only other possibility to consider was..a car? So maybe I would have taken my chances on the Ram anyway.

Sent from my SM-N960W using Tapatalk

To be fair, you could get the RAM with a V6 instead

I have MaxCare Lifetime coverage on my truck.....if I ever get bitten by the cam/lifter problem, I just have to have faith that Chrysler will honor their end of the bargain. RedLine will probably prolong the problem, but will my dealer go to bat for me if Im not paying them for oil changes?

 

[buddy guy]

Or the 4.7 litre, if still available? But one thing I knew when it came to Ram resale in Alberta anyway is most pple who buy a truck want a 4x4 hemi. I never planned to keep this truck past about 6 yrs. A number of circumstances could affect that plan one way or the other[emoji1]

Sent from my SM-N960W using Tapatalk

 

[chrisbh17]

Yeah I never even entertained the V6. MPG would be the only negative, to me, but I was coming from a V6 truck that got 14 mpg so the Hemi was actually BETTER lol

I keep my stuff for a very long time, so the MaxCare was a good fit. I dont drive a lot (even before quarantine), so 100K miles (which seems to be the common cam/lifter failure mileage) would probably take me about 15 years (!!!)

 

[ZookaTx]

I have a '19 with the 6.4, got it new in February. Just over 5k miles on it. One thing that still startles me a bit is that on startup it goes to 2000 rpms idle for a fair amount of time. Perhaps that is one way Chrysler addressed the issue; make sure the vehicle throws a lot of oil on the cam at startup.

Perhaps a fix could be to add oil slingers to the crankshaft? Throw more oil around in there? That could be done by simply redoing the crank casting, or even the lower part of the connecting rod casting, couldn't it?

 

[KC5TGQ]

Dang. Now I wish I had not bought my 2019 Laramie (which I love). The thought of engine failure is not something I want to contemplate on my $54,000 truck. I am disappointed in Chrysler engineers. This should have been rectified years ago. I own a GMC Sierra work truck and it has 230k miles on the engine and it runs great.

 

[Alex38]

This is one of the best posts I've ever seen. Thank you for sharing. I have a 2012 Ram with the Hemi with about 135k miles. I've had the tick for awhile, and my truck has seen everything from 0w20 Mobil 1 to various 5w30 synthetics like Pennzoil Platinum. I'm currently running 5w20 Mobil 1 EP High Mileage, and this is the quietest the truck has been for awhile. I'm not sure how much longer I'll own it, but I'll be running 5w30 from here on out.

 

[Killerbee4649]

Time for an LS Swap. lol jk but hopefully they’ll do something to help fix this, as far fetched as that might be.

 

[Burla]

What is the failure rate of these engines using 5w-20 and not red line or other additive oil? I’m curious the failure rate and the average miles it failed at and per which type of driving habit.

I can’t imagine the failure rate of these engines being pass 10 percent or there would be a class action lawsuit against fca.

I have no idea, I know most of us who have congregated in syn thread have killed our ticks for many years and uoa's show clean and none of us have had fails. Mine started ticking 9 years ago and since redline still hasn't failed and been quiet. There have been two total fails on redline, one of those was after a mechanic already told the driver he needed a new cam, forum member Kap, I can't remember the details on the other fail, it wasn't someone in the syn thread group, but I do believe he also had a mis fire code prior to redline. Once you get a mis fire, it's too late. Seams like every mechanic on earth knows about this, most have had these hemi's in their garage and many of them have two or three hemi engines torn apart at this minute. Maybe as far as numbers the fail rate is low, but the thing you should consider is how early in the trucks life this hemi tick is happening. My truck started ticking 3500 miles NEW. Been quiet since I found redline.

 

[atxmike53]

Thanks for sharing. Several days back, I was listening to the tick and trying to figure it out and by chance ran the rpm up to about 2500 for a few seconds. I could swear that when I got back out and listened, the tick was gone!!! If what Tony says is true about rpm relative to the oil the cam gets...maybe the increased rpm moved oil to the the parts that were making noise! Next time out, I think I will try it again. Anyway, I thought it was a good video.

 

[16RamHemi]

Thanks for sharing. Several days back, I was listening to the tick and trying to figure it out and by chance ran the rpm up to about 2500 for a few seconds. I could swear that when I got back out and listened, the tick was gone!!! If what Tony says is true about rpm relative to the oil the cam gets...maybe the increased rpm moved oil to the the parts that were making noise! Next time out, I think I will try it again. Anyway, I thought it was a good video.

thats what i got out of it. the older small block engines would splash oil all around as rpms increased. these hemis have that channel down in the valley that blocks oil from running down. Raised rpms is needed to splash what it can around. It speaks volumes where tuners recommend bumping the idle rpm up jsut for this reason.