Unique build coming

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MANual_puller

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I finally found the unicorn of used truck parts. A G56 6 speed manual transmission from a 3rd gen 2500 with the 5.7L Hemi bell housing and smaller input shaft for the smaller clutch(cummins G56 uses larger input shaft and the bell housing is different). I'm going to pick it up on Sunday. We all know of the 545RFE woes and "stage 3" rebuilds still don't hold. The parts I'm getting from the parts truck are trans, flywheel, clutch(probably going with new at install), hydraulics and pedals. I'll have to get the PCM flashed, do a little minor wiring and find the interior trim pieces(steering column and shifter boot) from a 4th gen cummins truck. All told it should be a finished project for around $2500. If all goes well the transplant will happen in October(before winter), delayed timeline is April(after winter). When I'm done I should have the only 4th gen 2500 with a manual transmission behind the 5.7L Hemi on the planet. I loved my '06 that had the G56 behind the Hemi so this swap makes a lot more sense than throwing money at the 545RFE for a rebuild down the road.

The recipient truck is a 2011 2500 ST crew cab short box 4x4. Just under 104k on the clock right now. I bought it used at 92k which is why my faith in this 545RFE's life expectancy wanes. I'm sure there will be some challenges. Should be a fun swap :happy107:
 

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Mopar_Magic_Man

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In for results! I wanted a 6.4 with a manual 6 speed but NOPE, not an option. :(

*This message was sent from the exhaust of 6.4L Hemi...
 
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MANual_puller

MANual_puller

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You might be in a bit of a pickle until tuning support for the 6.4 comes along. You'll need to calibrate an unlocked PCM or you'll be in limp mode. Side note, manual transmissions do not work with MDS so keep that in mind. MDS reflex time is too slow, you'll be killing it all over the place. MDS was not available in manual transmission Challengers with the Hemi for this reason.

It's going to be fun. I'm going to use the factory gauge cluster along with the factory PCM. B&G Performance in VA(BG Performance) is going to be doing the PCM calibration flash essentially writing the tune on the PCM so that transmission inputs are not needed to stay out of limp mode. They have had success calibrating a couple Hemi powered 3rd gen 1/2 ton trucks to use a T56(viper) transmission. I can use the same wire from the auto trans harness (park/neutral sense) and ground it through the clutch interlock switch so the engine only cranks when the clutch is depressed. I may have to trick the cluster using the clutch interlock switch. If I do it'll show (N) when the clutch is down and (D) when the clutch is up but I'd rather not do that as the lights would be annoying. The reason I might have to do this is because the cluster and the PCM may need to be on the same page or it could throw codes. It's entirely possible that the cluster may get its display inputs from the PCM and I won't have to do any tricking. We'll see how it goes. I'll try to include pictures and connector/pin ID numbers for any wiring that needs done.

Mechanically it'll be a cake walk. The only thing I might have to do is build a cross member but rumor has it the cross member is the same on all HD 3rd gens and I think the frame is the same on my '11 as an '06 would have been. The hole is already stamped in the floor of the cab for the shifter since a manual is still offered behind the CTD. Factory interior trim pieces are available for the same reason.
 

R/T_Fire

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I am so going to pick your brain on this swap once you get into it and get it done as I have been researching a T-56 SRT-10 swap for a little bit.

I want a manual trans and this was the only option I could think of. The one thing that has stuck in my mind as being a issue is striping the auto parameters and replacing them with manual tuning but I didn't know Ram put a G56 behind a 5.7L.

Size may also be an issue for me, I know them G56 units are huge and heavy from when I swapped one into my old 07 cummins. Not sure if I could get one to fit into a 1500 frame depending on engine mount and trans mount being the same relationship frame to cab as a 2500.... But just reading you are doing this swap excites me and gives me hope there is a option for a manual swap. I also need to look into the throw of the shifter and ratio of the G56 and see if it will work with my R/T application
 
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MANual_puller

MANual_puller

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I am so going to pick your brain on this swap once you get into it and get it done as I have been researching a T-56 SRT-10 swap for a little bit.

I want a manual trans and this was the only option I could think of. The one thing that has stuck in my mind as being a issue is striping the auto parameters and replacing them with manual tuning but I didn't know Ram put a G56 behind a 5.7L.

Size may also be an issue for me, I know them G56 units are huge and heavy from when I swapped one into my old 07 cummins. Not sure if I could get one to fit into a 1500 frame depending on engine mount and trans mount being the same relationship frame to cab as a 2500.... But just reading you are doing this swap excites me and gives me hope there is a option for a manual swap. I also need to look into the throw of the shifter and ratio of the G56 and see if it will work with my R/T application

I believe '06, '07 and '09 the G56 was offered behind the Hemi in HD trucks. 1/2 tons never had a manual behind the hemi from the factory. (Edit: I am going to try to use the factory PCM and recalibrate it for a manual tune. The goal with this is to retain the VVT. I do not want to go through the hassle of putting a solid gear on the cam and running an older PCM from an '06-'08 2500. That would require some major wiring.)

The ratios in a G56 are definitely set up more for towing. Basically 1st is a granny low, it's even marked as (L) on the shifter handle. 2,3,4 are your traditional 3 speed transmission gears and 5,6 are both overdrive. My '06 with G56/Hemi and 4.10 axle ratios and factory size 265x70R17 tires would do about 84 in 4th gear before bouncing the factory rev limiter. If you do a 3.92 or 3.55 rear end for 4th gear top speed 2nd is going to get tall for take off. There might be different ratios you could install internally. I've never looked into that since my truck is a moose and towing is priority over fast for my needs.
 
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R/T_Fire

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I'm assuming the 09 was with the old style PCM when it was still "dodge"
This has been my main though on if it would work or not. I'm not sure if the Gen 2 hemi programming is compatible with the Gen 3's. When we did this swap it was with equal year parts and we just took the parameters from a 07 so it was actually pretty easy so to say.

Going back to a previous generation is what worries me the most. from what it looks like most if not all parts will be easy to bolt up for me on a 2006SRT-10 to a 2011 R/T as it would be for you also.

Its that damn programming that is going to be a *****. as for the MDS or VVT I have my MDS turned of anyway so I'm good with that.

I do agree the G56 is more for towing but I think there are some other versions out there I will have to look into gear ratios but I'm still going to focus on using the SRT-10 T56 trans. but the tuning and issues will be the same for both our builds. And if you find someone that figures out the tuning let me know cause they will be doing another truck.
 
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MANual_puller

MANual_puller

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B&G has had success tuning out the TCM from inside the PCM by recalibrating it on 3rd gen hemi trucks even a couple '03 trucks that were the red-headed stepchildren when it came to tuning. The 4th gen PCM has more tunable parameters and should in theory be easier to do. I've emailed them and they said that they think they can get the engine to run without any trans inputs. Worst case scenario I figure out what normal voltage ranges are for the various inputs and get a bunch of little resistors :naughty:
 
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MANual_puller

MANual_puller

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Got it :)
 

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MANual_puller

MANual_puller

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Did some quick measuring and the G56 from an '06 2500 should be a direct fit mechanically in my '11 2500. The cross member is in the right place. The transfer case was placed so that the longer trans(G56) would fit and a 4x4 adapter was used with the 545RFE to fill the gap(7"). I found it interesting that the "transmission cross member" actually bolts to the 4x4 adapter and not to the transmission itself. Learn something new every day :happy107:
 
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MANual_puller

MANual_puller

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Gear ratios on the G56 are as follows:

Application 2005 - 2007 MY

1st 6.29 : 1
2nd 3.48 : 1
3rd 2.10 : 1
4th 1.38 : 1
5th 1.00 : 1
6th 0.79 : 1
R 6.29 : 1

545RFE

1st 3.00:1
2nd 1.67:1
2nd Prime 1.50:1
3rd 1.00:1
4th 0.75:1
5th 0.67:1
Reverse 3.00:1
 

drittal

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Now that's a granny 1st gear

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MANual_puller

MANual_puller

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Now that's a granny 1st gear

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Yes it is. When I had my '06 with hemi/G56 I never touched L(1st) unless I had a trailer. Normal unloaded driving my shift pattern was 2-3-5-6. Downshifting I went 6-4-3-2(for take off if I actually had to stop). I loved it.
 
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MANual_puller

MANual_puller

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Whew! Almost gave myself a heart attack. I crawled under my truck again to do some double checking on measurements and I was coming up 2" off. WTH, right? I measured around dusk the other day and I'm not sure what I did if I read the tape wrong or if I went to the wrong point or what but it's going to take more parts than initially thought. Turns out the front half of the transfer case is different depending on which transmission is used. This to me seems silly since they use a 4x4 adapter with the auto trans. Why wouldn't they be the same, right? This is the reason I completely overlooked the possibility that I'd need the transfer case too. Luckily the guy I bought the trans from still has the t-case AND, by the sheer grace of God, it's also a manual shift like my current one. It'll cost me $350 more initially to get the t-case too but I'll have more good used parts to sell later so it'll work out in the long run.

Live and learn. Even with 20/20 vision do not measure anything in less than desirable light levels. I'm very glad I double checked before I tore into it :favorites13:
 
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MANual_puller

MANual_puller

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Just a quick update, I have the right transfer case lined up, it's the one from the same donor truck as the transmission, I just haven't had the opportunity to retrieve it yet. This project is also going to get postponed probably until spring time unless the current trans craps out and forces the issue. We're in the process of buying a house. No more renting, no more wrenching under a car port without power tools, and I won't have to carry all my tools around in the truck anymore because I'll have a place for them :happy107:

I decided I want out of this apartment more than I want the 545RFE out of my truck :roflsquared:
 

charonblk07

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I know that feeling. I bought my house in the city and it had a 26x32 shop in the back. After 5 years of wrenching in an apartment parking lot it was awesome to be able tear something apart and be able to leave it for when I wanted to go back in and continue. Plus, I no longer have to cart my toolbox from the storage unit to the parking lot or worry about someone stealing all my tools.


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MANual_puller

MANual_puller

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I know that feeling. I bought my house in the city and it had a 26x32 shop in the back. After 5 years of wrenching in an apartment parking lot it was awesome to be able tear something apart and be able to leave it for when I wanted to go back in and continue. Plus, I no longer have to cart my toolbox from the storage unit to the parking lot or worry about someone stealing all my tools.


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I completely ruined the rear springs on my '00 Mitsubishi Montero Sport carting all my tools everywhere before I got the toolbox for the truck :roflsquared: There weren't any storage units close to me and none in town with power so it wasn't worth it. It'll be nice to have the truck 600# lighter :favorites13: The place were getting has a detached 2 stall garage and a lean-to carport off the garage. 3 parking spaces under roof :happy107: I might have to jack the garage up and put cinder blocks all the way around and a new overhead door to get the truck in, basically a weekend project once I get some jacks rounded up. :happy107:
 
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MANual_puller

MANual_puller

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Quick update. Hopefully I can go get the transfer case this weekend. We're still looking at 11-18 as the closing date on the house :happy107:

I haven't decided if I'm going to gut out the cold or wait until spring. I feel like the bank account will make the decision for me.....:favorites13:
 
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MANual_puller

MANual_puller

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Minor hiccup on the sellers' end, haven't closed on the house yet. Everything is okay, we're just waiting for a paper to close. Then I should be able to finish gathering parts and plan the swap :)
 
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MANual_puller

MANual_puller

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Tada! Closing Friday at 9:30 A.M.! I also received notice that we're getting another profit sharing bonus at work, I'll get the clutch/bearings ordered and flywheel cleaned up after that.....getting excited to be rowing through traffic again :favorites13:
 
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MANual_puller

MANual_puller

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Update: I have the transfer case now. I told the seller I needed pedals too shipped with the transfer case, he said no problem. The seller is a junker and a hell of a nice guy because he didn't send me pedals from the '06 donor truck the rest of the parts came from, he sent me OEM 4th gen pedals. That just made things much easier. Now there's no doubt that I won't have to fabricate anything under the dash. Throwout and pilot bearings are ordered, should roll in early-mid next week. As far as I know the parts list remaining stands at: steering column shell, shifter boot, fluids for trans and transfer case, clutch lineup tool, PCM tuning, misc hardware :happy107:

I'm looking at probably April to tackle the swap at this point but if the stars align it might happen in March.
 
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