Until the end of this year, Top Tier Gasoline may not meet Top Tier Standard due to "... navigating through unprecedented times."

[HEMIMANN]

Outdated for single direct injection engines.

 

[spacex]

I guess if you're Alanis Morissette? They cuts costs to increase their profits, then saw an increase in profit.

Appreciate the information not trying to argue with you.

 

[Tim7139]

Appreciate the information not trying to argue with you.

I'm just trying to make fun of the term ironic.

Alanis released a hit song ‘Ironic’ devoid of irony in any of the illustrations she offers. Which, in and of itself, is ironic, and she maintains to be her point.

 

[Burla]

Look what happened late last year compared to the first 3 quarters. Just maybe the entire reason for the war and our policy was to give cover for an industry in peril? Since the virus, small gas companies are just dying on the vine. Big picture, it is here for people who want to see it.

Oil and Gas Drilling Profit Margin​

In Q4 2021, the average net margin for oil and gas production was 31.3% according to CSIMarket. That was up from 3.2% in Q3, -1.4% in Q2 and -22% in Q1, for a 12-month trailing average of 4.7%.

 

[KoboldTaco]

I think Gas threads now are the new ‘what oil do I use’ threads. You shouldn’t start them. LOL

Gas is gas (for the most part). Change your oil, honor the maintenance schedule and just put the proper octane as your owners manual requires. If you are a Diesel truck, well then buy Diesel.

Add detergents carefully, but clean engines and do things by actually doing a procedure. Don’t count on the gas you buy to do anything but what it is designed to d…. BURN to get you down the road.

I suppose I am the guy who never counts on the cleaning effects of a detonation product. I always believe if you want to clean the engine, buy the cleaners, follow the procedure and rinse, repeat on other engine systems.

Nothing is better then simply changing oil, always on schedule. That simple task there will never be beat by the fuel you used.

 

[HEMIMANN]

Never understood what the lure was to be a huge corporation - it's like a slow death. I guess they all think they're gonna rule the world and THEN charge 100% margins, but few make it. Even Standard Oil Trust was broken up.

I liked smaller companies. Our margins were in the mid-20% range - then we got gobbled up by a large corporation and milked for our profits. Sales fell by half when they let me go.

 

[Jeepwalker]

Never understood what the lure was to be a huge corporation - it's like a slow death. I guess they all think they're gonna rule the world and THEN charge 100% margins, but few make it. Even Standard Oil Trust was broken up.

Not all corporations are evil, lol (I know you didn't claim that). Everyone wants cheap gas..

I started out many yrs ago working at a couple small/med sized companies, but most of my career was at large corporations (Fortune 75). They both have their place. Some products/services are nearly impossible for small companies to invest and produce ...and can require millions (even billions) of investment before a penny is earned. And it works the other way around too ...small companies can be very innovative and responsive ...quick to put out new products/services.

Kind of like designing/developing a new Ram pick-up model that contains 15,000+ parts an enormous amount of resources to pull together. Then constructing/testing prototypes, designing/building a new plant to building it in, staffing, salaries, etc. Selling and servicing problems.

I personally enjoyed working in both environments.

 

[tron67j]

I think Gas threads now are the new ‘what oil do I use’ threads. You shouldn’t start them. LOL

Gas is gas (for the most part). Change your oil, honor the maintenance schedule and just put the proper octane as your owners manual requires. If you are a Diesel truck, well then buy Diesel.

Add detergents carefully, but clean engines and do things by actually doing a procedure. Don’t count on the gas you buy to do anything but what it is designed to d…. BURN to get you down the road.

I suppose I am the guy who never counts on the cleaning effects of a detonation product. I always believe if you want to clean the engine, buy the cleaners, follow the procedure and rinse, repeat on other engine systems.

Nothing is better then simply changing oil, always on schedule. That simple task there will never be beat by the fuel you used.

Good maintenance and the right octane, pure and simple. Using the highest octane won't actually help anything more than it burns your money faster in the trucks that require mid level octane. The control system will just adjust to run the same way it does with 89, and is why we can run 87 in there as well. If you think high octane is better and swear the truck runs better, piece of mind is always money well spent. But if filling with it because you are just hoping it is better, save your money.

 

[indept]

Top Tier started back in the 80's when the 1st port injectors came out. Moving the sole throttle body injector downstream to individual intake runners left less time for gas evaporation, impinging directly on the back of the intake valve, creating deposits an disrupting intake air flow pattern. Low detergent gas also clogged injector nozzles fairly quickly since gasoline is so volatile compared to diesel fuel.

Direct injection removes the intake valve deposit issue, unless & until engine makers do the right thing and have dual injectors.
Direct injectors are subject to combustion deposits in addition to gasoline deposits.

Port injection cleans the valves. Direct injection is what allows those deposits to form creating the issue. That's one of the reasons why some manufacturers use both port and direct injection, the port injectors clean the deposits off of the intake valves.

 

[Burla]

I'm not sure why changing the oil will help the combustion chamber, this area needs its own maintenance. I was looking forward to @Hemi395's result, what's up Corey? You can opt for cheap gas and still do a piston soak once in a while. Use the vac lines, easy peasy.

 

[Burla]

Port Injection allows the firing to happen with spark, so deposit formation will not harm engine. Of course. direct injection put the fuel in the chamber before the spark, so if there is a hot deposit it can cause an off stroke firing. I didnt read the reason why this matters to any of us, maybe next years ram it will. Any system you have will form deposits, thus the reason they add PEA or nitrogen to every single gas, just more with top tier supposedly.

copy and paste..

Since the 1990s, the Environmental Protection Agency has required a minimum level of detergent for all gas sold in the United States

from way back..

Investigation: Best brands of gas for your car

Investigation: Best brands of gas for your car

youtu.be

 

[U&A]

I was very certain last time I filled up that when I paid for mid grade that I was not getting mid grade.. stop the pump and switch to premium to check out the smell of the gas. Not sure if everyone else is aware but you can definitely smell the difference between premium and regular. premium is a much sweeter smelling fuel.

Sweet enough that bees are somewhat attracted to it sometimes

I could tell when I was pumping the mid grade and premium that it definitely did not smell as sweet as it should. . Was very obvious

 

[tidefan1967]

I was very certain last time I filled up that when I paid for mid grade that I was not getting mid grade.. stop the pump and switch to premium to check out the smell of the gas. Not sure if everyone else is aware but you can definitely smell the difference between premium and regular. premium is a much sweeter smelling fuel.

Sweet enough that bees are somewhat attracted to it sometimes

I could tell when I was pumping the mid grade and premium that it definitely did not smell as sweet as it should. . Was very obvious

D-a-m-n straight! That being said you can definitely tell by the smell coming from the exhaust as well. You can tell the difference between E0 and gas with ethanol too, or at least I can.

 

[U&A]

D-a-m-n straight! That being said you can definitely tell by the smell coming from the exhaust as well. You can tell the difference between E0 and gas with ethanol too, or at least I can.

Exactly

The exhaust smell is VERY noticeable

 

[U&A]

Just be easy on the PEA

I did my own test. It will thicken your oil if you use it to often. I “micro dosed it” you could say and the oil definitely got a tad thicker in the UOA. Even Bill Nye the science guy that did my use oil analysis pointed it out.

Do what the bottle say or there abouts.

 

[Burla]

Yes. you don't need redline si-1 every tank, but when an oil change is coming up is a great time to dump an entire bottle in. Maybe the last 5-600 miles do 2 bottles. It will make your oil smell funny, and PEA has been reported to thicken oil. The other thing it will do, clean the piston tops and combustion chamber.

 

[farout75]

What hype?

My 17 has 106,600 miles I started from the first tank of gas with top tier gas. I have never had even one small fuel issue. When I had the plugs changes the dealer said look at these plugs they are worn but clean. My throttle body needed nothing, which they said was unusual. Top tier gas is no more expensive where I live and Shell has a program where you get five cents off a gallon, it's not a credit card. So for me I will stay with what has worked for 106,600 miles. I don't down anyone who thinks its hipe, but I think it works.

 

[Doug Ram]

…is this even a thing? Never heard of “top tier” gas.

Yep, it's really a thing and it was the auto and oil industry's reaction to what was happening to "new" fuel injection systems in the 1990s. I learned about how important detergent in gas was in 1994 when my much beloved 1988 Mustang's fuel injection system clogged (at only 77,000 miles). Two cylinders ran lean and hot and burned thru the pistons as we drove along I-81 at 75 MPH up a long hill outside Scranton PA. I was smart (or just lucky) because I stopped the car as soon as it started running rough. Nothing else was damaged and my garage was able to replace the trashed pistons within two days for less than $500. From that moment my fuel injected gas cars got a bottle of something in a red bottle (that I bought by the case) with every fill-up, unless it was with Costco gas. Still, 30 years later our 2008 Solara still gets Costco gas as often as I can get to Costco, which is the only place that I know (for certain) that is selling TopTier gas.

 

[Regcabguy]

I never really bought into that hype.

I spoke to a tanker driver delivering to Costco. At our tank farm he said he pulls up and the operator adds the manufacturer's proprietary additives. This is from a 24 yr veteran. This was 10 yrs ago easy so who knows? I run some Techron additive to our Honda Pilot every 10K. I don't know if it helps or not? 225K and it purrs. 80% Costco top tiered gas.

 

[HEMIMANN]

Port Injection allows the firing to happen with spark, so deposit formation will not harm engine. Of course. direct injection put the fuel in the chamber before the spark, so if there is a hot deposit it can cause an off stroke firing. I didnt read the reason why this matters to any of us, maybe next years ram it will. Any system you have will form deposits, thus the reason they add PEA or nitrogen to every single gas, just more with top tier supposedly.

copy and paste..

Since the 1990s, the Environmental Protection Agency has required a minimum level of detergent for all gas sold in the United States

from way back..

Investigation: Best brands of gas for your car

Investigation: Best brands of gas for your car

youtu.be

???

Both Direct and Port fuel injection inject fuel before the spark. There is less vaporization time with direct injection, and high pressure injection is unsafe with gasoline, unlike diesel fuel. Hence, incomplete combustion with direct injection when in rich burn mode, and hence a port injector is still needed along with the direct injector.

Anyway, gasoline terminals are still saying the can't get enough detergent additive to spike the raw gas with to get to Top Tier minimum Level. Strange - I thought these chemical additives were made in the U.S. Don't know what the raw material feedstock is.