Brake Controller

BossHogg said:

I don't know anyone that has a 2016 yet, when the weather turns to spring, I'll head to a dealership and test the 2016s to see if there is a change.

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Thanks - is a static voltmeter test adequate? I can hit up a dealer here who has a few 16's with the factory controller - the weather is fine. truck running, squeeze the manual control to max - should see ~~12+v on the brake pin to ground?

Guess I also have to stick my head under the dash to find the part number...

Or even make a compatible controller that fits in the center stack where the OEM goes. That would be sweet, may be a letter to Tekonsha would make it happen.

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Yeah - with the lack of extra leg room, and the increase in "integrated" controllers, seems like Tekonsha should add a modular to it's lineup - add the factory-location control (and/or display), and hide the more universal module away under the dash. Add a (few) generic display/control's to the lineup for alternative integration.... But more expense on their end to build more and more physical interfaces. :/


Of course, optionally being able to add more truck integration - ie brake pedal pressure - could go a long way. Did see someone with an obd2 interface - but those suck due to plug placement...


Ah well, ordered another p2 since I can't remember since it since I sold my second gen, maybe I let it go with it. I'll need it for another project truck in the future, and it'll get me by until we can confirm the factory module works right!


thanks.


..david

Cpylot said:

He is a fellow named Ken Gregory up in Indiana. You may have seen him over on the Cummins forum.

"I was told last night that the new part number supersedes the old one for new trucks and any truck they put a new part in. The factory says the issue is fixed with the new part. We haven't had any issues with a controller that was replaced....

Ken Gregory <[email protected]>;

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Duh, I never though about engaging Ken on this issue, my bad. I figured since I couldn't find any dealers with any knowledge of the issue, and there are a couple threads on the ITBM issue on the Cummins forum, he would have chimed it.

When I pull my truck out of winter storage, I will take it in and tell this story and see what happens.

Thank you for this information. If the 2016 part fixes the issue, then I'll still be mad at Chrysler for not being notified of not only the loss of trailer braking but also of not being notified of a fix.

keen said:

Thanks - is a static voltmeter test adequate? I can hit up a dealer here who has a few 16's with the factory controller - the weather is fine. truck running, squeeze the manual control to max - should see ~~12+v on the brake pin to ground?

Click to expand...

Yes, but the ITBM will need to think a trailer with brakes is connected to it before it will provide power on the trailer brake wire. It wants to see an inductive load like that supplied by a trailer brake electromagnet. I built a brake simulator out of a 6 ohm 5watt resister and the armature of a windshield wiper motor as the inductor.

BossHogg said:

Duh, I never though about engaging Ken on this issue, my bad. I figured since I couldn't find any dealers with any knowledge of the issue, and there are a couple threads on the ITBM issue on the Cummins forum, he would have chimed it.

When I pull my truck out of winter storage, I will take it in and tell this story and see what happens.

Thank you for this information. If the 2016 part fixes the issue, then I'll still be mad at Chrysler for not being notified of not only the loss of trailer braking but also of not being notified of a fix.



Yes, but the ITBM will need to think a trailer with brakes is connected to it before it will provide power on the trailer brake wire. It wants to see an inductive load like that supplied by a trailer brake electromagnet. I built a brake simulator out of a 6 ohm 5watt resister and the armature of a windshield wiper motor as the inductor.

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I have a 2014 Big Horn with the same problem. Was told by dealers it was trailer issue so replaced everything in trailer . No improvement. When I got home took 4 magnets made a test system and using a Fluke 77 meter measured the following

6.6 Volts at 10.6 amps. Also it is a pulsed voltage at 250 hertz with a 30 percent duty cycle

If I apply basic electronics comparing old system where you got 12 volts and 3.25 amps per magnet or 13 amps for 2 axles or 156 watts of power to stop trailer.

According to my math and measurements ( volts times amps times duty cycle)I have 69.96 watts with a 30 percent duty cycle or 20.988 watts delivered to stop the trailer. Am I missing something or is this dangerous
Hence my handle if I cant dodge it I will have to ram it cause the trailer brake system sucks!!!!!

Hopefully I have it wrong

Cant Dodge it so Ram it said:

6.6 Volts at 10.6 amps. Also it is a pulsed voltage at 250 hertz with a 30 percent duty cycle

If I apply basic electronics comparing old system where you got 12 volts and 3.25 amps per magnet or 13 amps for 2 axles or 156 watts of power to stop trailer.

Click to expand...

This is a bit tricky because you need to know that your test setup is capable of pulling 12 volts if provided by the brake controller. How did you measure the duty cycle?

Cpylot said:

Has anyone had any recent contact with the RAMCARES rep?
Im starting to wonder if this is either going nowhere and or everyone is just giving up and going with the aftermarket controllers.

I have a deal worked out on an order for a new 3500 and would like to pull the trigger but am still trying to figure out if this is a problem in the 16s or not. Seems that it is a some do, some don't situation.

Had one dealer rep tell me that they were familiar with the issue in the 15s but when the new part # is installed the problem is solved.
Don't know if that is a dealer trying to make a sale or ???

Any real world experiences would certainly be helpful, if it is still an issue in the 16s I may as well just order it without the integrated controller and plan on putting in the aftermarket one when I take delivery.

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I contacted ramcares a couple of weeks ago by using the assist button on the rear view mirror. The lady was very pleasant even though when she told me that map upgrades for the gps is $149.00 I wasn't very happy.

sandawilliams said:

I contacted ramcares a couple of weeks ago by using the assist button on the rear view mirror. The lady was very pleasant even though when she told me that map upgrades for the gps is $149.00 I wasn't very happy.

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They mean the ramcares member on this forum, not ram customer care in general.

BossHogg said:

Duh, I never though about engaging Ken on this issue, my bad. I figured since I couldn't find any dealers with any knowledge of the issue, and there are a couple threads on the ITBM issue on the Cummins forum, he would have chimed it.

When I pull my truck out of winter storage, I will take it in and tell this story and see what happens.

Thank you for this information. If the 2016 part fixes the issue, then I'll still be mad at Chrysler for not being notified of not only the loss of trailer braking but also of not being notified of a fix.



Yes, but the ITBM will need to think a trailer with brakes is connected to it before it will provide power on the trailer brake wire. It wants to see an inductive load like that supplied by a trailer brake electromagnet. I built a brake simulator out of a 6 ohm 5watt resister and the armature of a windshield wiper motor as the inductor.

Click to expand...

Sounds like i need to call the dealer and have the new 2016 part put in my 2015

BossHogg said:

This is a bit tricky because you need to know that your test setup is capable of pulling 12 volts if provided by the brake controller. How did you measure the duty cycle?

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After a couple trips to the Dodge service center and them telling me the truck was working I had the complete back plates including magnets replaced and then they said it was wiring. I then had the complete wiring harness replaced from truck to wheels and of course same problem. So when we got home I made my test jig which is a complete braking system that was installed on my trailer. 4 Dexter magnets ( 12 volt at 3.25 amp each) connected in parallel through the wiring harness all mounted on a board. Identical to what was on my trailer originally.

I made measurements using a Fluke 77 meter which has the frequency selection and duty cycle selection.
Heavy Duty setting. Truck running, 13.6 volts measured on controller module. I also noted 1.2 volt drop from controller output to bumper but if I use the use the voltage drop calculator on line it is what is expected for 25 feet of 16 gage wire.

On my old truck with an older controller installed I use to run the same trailer at a setting of 3 that would lock wheels on a gravel road. So that would also add some logict that I am getting alot less than 30% as now I cant lock wheels on a setting of 10.

Im still hoping I got it wrong

Most importantly to make any sort of impact on ram is to email them or chat with someone on their staff and make sure they are aware of this issue! Copy the URL link of this thread and give it to them. They wont do anything till a number of us complain and verify there is an issue.

Cant Dodge it so Ram it said:

After a couple trips to the Dodge service center and them telling me the truck was working I had the complete back plates including magnets replaced and then they said it was wiring. I then had the complete wiring harness replaced from truck to wheels and of course same problem. So when we got home I made my test jig which is a complete braking system that was installed on my trailer. 4 Dexter magnets ( 12 volt at 3.25 amp each) connected in parallel through the wiring harness all mounted on a board. Identical to what was on my trailer originally.

I made measurements using a Fluke 77 meter which has the frequency selection and duty cycle selection.
Heavy Duty setting. Truck running, 13.6 volts measured on controller module. I also noted 1.2 volt drop from controller output to bumper but if I use the use the voltage drop calculator on line it is what is expected for 25 feet of 16 gage wire.

On my old truck with an older controller installed I use to run the same trailer at a setting of 3 that would lock wheels on a gravel road. So that would also add some logict that I am getting alot less than 30% as now I cant lock wheels on a setting of 10.

Im still hoping I got it wrong

Click to expand...

Correction the meter using to measure duty cycle is a Fluke 85 III . The fuke 77 was the meter measuring the voltage.

Cant Dodge it so Ram it said:

6.6 Volts at 10.6 amps. Also it is a pulsed voltage at 250 hertz with a 30 percent duty cycle

Click to expand...

Cant Dodge it so Ram it said:

4 Dexter magnets ( 12 volt at 3.25 amp each) connected in parallel through the wiring harness all mounted on a board. Identical to what was on my trailer originally.

I made measurements using a Fluke 77 meter which has the frequency selection and duty cycle selection.

Click to expand...

I looks to me you have everything correct but the duty cycle, at 30% you would measure around four volts on the trailer brake line. I took a look at the Fluke 77 owners' manual and I saw it measures frequency (the PWM period of 250 ms.) but I didn't see anything that suggested it could measure the duty cycle of a time period.

If the issue on your 2014 is consistence with the issue on the 2015's, I would expect to see a duty cycle around 70%, your voltage reading is about where I would expect it.

I didn't realize this issue was also in the 2014 model year, I never had an opportunity to measure a 2014. The 2013 ITBM puts out full power regardless. Looks like Chrysler may have introduced this flaw in 2014s.

If the 2016 ITBM fixed the issue, and it looks to be backwards compatible with the 2015s there is a fix for the 2015s. The same part will not work in a 2014 because of the electrical interface, it was redesigned beginning with 2015s.

Looks like Ram may be finally taking notice perhaps? Hoping they do not treat this like a common TSB where they are only repaired if there is a complaint from customer. I could easily see this happening though to sweep a potential recall under the rug. I have been watching this thread closer now as more action seems to be happening. Fingers crossed for Ram to proclaim a solution for this. Should we be contacting local dealers to see if there is a potential TSB out there for these trucks? Mine will be going in soon for its first oil change. I may bring it up again when I am there.

BossHogg said:

I looks to me you have everything correct but the duty cycle, at 30% you would measure around four volts on the trailer brake line. I took a look at the Fluke 77 owners' manual and I saw it measures frequency (the PWM period of 250 ms.) but I didn't see anything that suggested it could measure the duty cycle of a time period.

If the issue on your 2014 is consistence with the issue on the 2015's, I would expect to see a duty cycle around 70%, your voltage reading is about where I would expect it.

I didn't realize this issue was also in the 2014 model year, I never had an opportunity to measure a 2014. The 2013 ITBM puts out full power regardless. Looks like Chrysler may have introduced this flaw in 2014s.

If the 2016 ITBM fixed the issue, and it looks to be backwards compatible with the 2015s there is a fix for the 2015s. The same part will not work in a 2014 because of the electrical interface, it was redesigned beginning with 2015s.

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Woops, I have 2 meters. The Fluke 77 was measuring the voltage and the Fluke 85 III was measuring the freq and duty cycle.

I purchased in Dec 2014 so maybe they put the same unit in the last of the 2014 models produced.
They replaced the module once to try and fix but same results. Part # 68092732AF

Cant Dodge it so Ram it said:

Woops, I have 2 meters. The Fluke 77 was measuring the voltage and the Fluke 85 III was measuring the freq and duty cycle.

I purchased in Dec 2014 so maybe they put the same unit in the last of the 2014 models produced.
They replaced the module once to try and fix but same results. Part # 68092732AF

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Take the truck out for a spin with your trailer brake simulator connected. Set the ITBM gain to 10, get the truck over 30 MPH, slide the manual brake slider all the way and measure the voltage. If the voltage goes up to 12 volts at speeds above 30 MPH and less than 7 volts under 30 MPH, you have the same issue as we 2015 owners.

I'm very interested to know the results of this test.

The2014 i had worked perfect, huge change when i bought thhe 2015

Kwhite said:

The2014 i had worked perfect, huge change when i bought thhe 2015

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Model year 2013/2014 part # = 82213474 (works good, last long time)

MY15 # = 82214492 (not so much)

MY16 # = 82215040 (unknown)

If RamCares doesn't have any feedback yet maybe as least she could ask what the change was from MY15 to MY16.

Praying for firmware change.

ramcares works for ford

It appears that Erica the ramcares rep has abandoned the subject.
My sig 2014 controller works correctly, so I guess I'll keep it for awhile.
I have 3 build sheets from competing dealers complete, but was just waiting to see if Ram would come up with an acceptable response.

$$$ is the only thing that they truly respond to and I guess I won't be buying the 16 from them.
When I do get rid of the 14 (hopefully before costly EPA DEF DPF stuff starts giving me trouble) maybe it will be time to downsize some of my toys and buy a built in the USA Toyota

nasaland said:

Model year 2013/2014 part # = 82213474 (works good, last long time)

MY15 # = 82214492 (not so much)

MY16 # = 82215040 (unknown)

If RamCares doesn't have any feedback yet maybe as least she could ask what the change was from MY15 to MY16.

Praying for firmware change.

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My 2014 2500 controller has the same problems as the 15's and 16's.

sandawilliams said:

My 2014 2500 controller has the same problems as the 15's and 16's.

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I do not doubt that you have a problem.

However, I truly doubt it is the same problem as the MY15 (& maybe 16)

It was the major change going from the 13/14 to the 15 that caused the problems.

(see earlier technical details in thread)