Lowering rear and getting a better ride.

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Arthurw

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I get it should ride like a truck and it's never bothered me. I got the truck to haul whatever I need. I also pull a 32' camper. It works great for that. But now my wife has had surgery for cancer. Since we pull with the truck we also run around in it. It hurts her to ride in it now. So I was just trying to get a better ride. I'm just going to throw some weight in the back and see what happens. Thanks for all the information.
 

rzr6-4

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I agree with above, adding the weight has never, ever made an appreciable difference in mileage on a 2500 and I have driven one since 1999, over 300k miles in hills and flat. But if one drives off the line like it is a Ferrari, then yes it probably would.


Its really going to depends on what kind of miles you are driving. The major factors for energy consumption are wind resistance, rolling resistance, and the energy needed to get up to speed (equivalent to your kinetic energy at your top speed). So lets assume you put a 500lb plate in your bed:

That will do absolutely nothing in terms of aerodynamics so we can eliminate that.

Rolling resistance is already a fairly small portion, only about 15% of your energy use so adding 500lb to a 6000lb vehicle will be a single digit percent increase in total fuel consumption.

Kinetic energy is going to be the issue. If you are getting on the highway, you only have to accelerate once so its not really an issue, but if you are in the city and are having to accelerate over and over, that's going to be the killer. We all know that accelerating from a stop is the worst possible thing for your mileage, so when you make it 8.33% (500/6000) worse every time you do it, it will add up.

Like I said, interstate/highway won't be bad, but if you live where I do and every light is red all the time and it takes 20min to get across a relatively small town, with all of those stop and go's you will have a noticeable mpg drop. Certainly not 50% or anything, but over 50k miles it will add up.
 

A child of God

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Not starting an argument or "defending myself."

I admit my mistake regarding my response to rzr6-4. However, when he mentioned "airing down" and my knowing the OP admitted he didnt have bags, I felt the comment was directed at me. So I replied. Honest mistake, we are all human.
As for Dean2's lovely display of aggression. There was no need to post publically your thoughts. Especially since my comment was not directed at you.
Regarding you saying, "brand new to forum, have contributed didiley squat so far, and then running tude on other members is pretty much quaranteed to get you zero help." Ive contributed didley squat because I am new to the forum; so your redundancy is comical. Its obvious that you have much experience in the Ram/diesel world and this forum and I look forward to learning. But your tone directed at me was unwarranted. I feel safe saying you were a bully in school, werent you?
As for your opinion of an apology, its just that, your opinion. If rzr6-4 wants an apology, then he alone is to contact me. If you were new to any gathering, virtual or otherwise, wouldnt you spout off if you felt insulted or attacked? Yes you would; you too are human.

Arthurw, thank you for the original post. Lot to learn just from this one thread. My sincerest apologies to you and anyone else that felt I was trying to hijack his thread. Not my intention, but it still has all the makings. So I understand.

My 2 cents. No disrespect directed at anyone.
 

Dean2

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Not starting an argument or "defending myself."

I admit my mistake regarding my response to rzr6-4. However, when he mentioned "airing down" and my knowing the OP admitted he didnt have bags, I felt the comment was directed at me. So I replied. Honest mistake, we are all human.
As for Dean2's lovely display of aggression. There was no need to post publically your thoughts. Especially since my comment was not directed at you.
Regarding you saying, "brand new to forum, have contributed didiley squat so far, and then running tude on other members is pretty much quaranteed to get you zero help." Ive contributed didley squat because I am new to the forum; so your redundancy is comical. Its obvious that you have much experience in the Ram/diesel world and this forum and I look forward to learning. But your tone directed at me was unwarranted. I feel safe saying you were a bully in school, werent you?
As for your opinion of an apology, its just that, your opinion. If rzr6-4 wants an apology, then he alone is to contact me. If you were new to any gathering, virtual or otherwise, wouldnt you spout off if you felt insulted or attacked? Yes you would; you too are human.

Arthurw, thank you for the original post. Lot to learn just from this one thread. My sincerest apologies to you and anyone else that felt I was trying to hijack his thread. Not my intention, but it still has all the makings. So I understand.

My 2 cents. No disrespect directed at anyone.
Just so you know I was the Sheep Dog in school, just like I am now. If you don't understand the reference, look it up.

Also, saying no disrespect does not mean none was displayed. Finally if you don't understand that air down refers to the tires, and is extensively referred to as such in offroading and you took that as you being attacked and that justifies you lashing out, I and the rest on here are not responsible for your insecurities and ignorance of what is being discussed.

As far as posting my comments publicly, why would I not respond publicly to your public display of aggression, or do you expect you deserve a level of consideration you yourself failed to display.

What part of, you were no part of the conversation continues to escape you. You were responding to an imagined/made up slight in a post that had zero to do with you. When you see the straw hats QUIT digging, you have reached China.
 
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62Blazer

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Adding aftermarket springs to soften ride will reduce payload capacity. Airbags will return zero percent of that capacity.

Adding aftermarket springs to soften ride will reduce payload capacity. Airbags will return zero percent of that capacity.

I agree with above, adding the weight has never, ever made an appreciable difference in mileage on a 2500 and I have driven one since 1999, over 300k miles in hills and flat. But if one drives off the line like it is a Ferrari, then yes it probably would.
Maybe I am misunderstanding your comment about airbags? If you put softer coil springs on they do reduce the payload capacity, in the means of you will get more squat. Air bags compensate for that. Add more air and they increase the overall spring rate. So you can have softer springs that are better suited to no loads, and then when you add weight you can start adding pressure to the bags to make up for that. Again, maybe I am misunderstanding what you are saying.
A common conversation about airbags is that they do not "legally" increase the factory rated payload capacity (the numbers stated on the door sticker). So if the truck is factory rated for let's say 10,000 GVW which equates to 2,500 lbs. payload, then adding airbags does not "legally" raise that number. But if you replace the factory springs with a softer version you can "lose" payload capacity because it will squat too much. So for example maybe the truck can only handle 1,500 lbs. payload for bottoming out the rear suspension. Adding airbags to these softer springs and pumping them up allows you to get back to that 2,500 lb. payload.
 

Dean2

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Maybe I am misunderstanding your comment about airbags? If you put softer coil springs on they do reduce the payload capacity, in the means of you will get more squat. Air bags compensate for that. Add more air and they increase the overall spring rate. So you can have softer springs that are better suited to no loads, and then when you add weight you can start adding pressure to the bags to make up for that. Again, maybe I am misunderstanding what you are saying.
A common conversation about airbags is that they do not "legally" increase the factory rated payload capacity (the numbers stated on the door sticker). So if the truck is factory rated for let's say 10,000 GVW which equates to 2,500 lbs. payload, then adding airbags does not "legally" raise that number. But if you replace the factory springs with a softer version you can "lose" payload capacity because it will squat too much. So for example maybe the truck can only handle 1,500 lbs. payload for bottoming out the rear suspension. Adding airbags to these softer springs and pumping them up allows you to get back to that 2,500 lb. payload.
Spot on. If air bags couldn't carry weight most semi-trucks would be out of luck as that is 100% of their suspension and gvw, as would a great many luxury cars who's only suspension is air struts.
 

14ramdjh

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if you lower the rear don't forget to re-aim your head lights. i would get a truck tire tube and fill it with water for weight place it over or rear of the rear axile. when carrying a load just empty the tube.
 

Tunaman

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I can't see where you said what you're running for air pressure. I Made the mistake (maybe) of going from RAM 1500 (last one 2018) to a 2020 new Ford F-250 as I need a 3/4 to haul our 1300lb + 36' fifth wheel. I liked the sound of the new technology Ford used in their new 7.3 Gasser, new in 2020. I say new tech it actually is going back to old tech for towing. I.E. big bore, long stroke. Push rod engine. No eco-boost!! As far as the engine goes it's a beast, 10 speed tranny is awesome but that truck rides harder than any 3/4 or 1 ton truck I've ever been in. @ 75 yrs old I've been in many!! The truck had load range E, max A.P. 80 lbs. I NEVER ran 80 but hauling 5th wheel at 70 A.P. the tires do not show any squat at all, and truck only squats 2 1/2 to 3" over the rear axel. This is with 2500-3000lb pin weight! I know I've scaled it. This is with trailer fully loaded for the trip to Maine, 3200 miles round trip. I now am running 55/lb cold A.P. all the way around, not towing. I got a low tire pressure a few times for a while but not now. They have over 3000 miles empty, no load, no squat, no wear and truck rides MUCH better!! IF you have Load Range E tires, max or close to max air, your wife has reason to be in pain !! Hope this helps!
 

Gr8bawana

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if you lower the rear don't forget to re-aim your head lights. i would get a truck tire tube and fill it with water for weight place it over or rear of the rear axile. when carrying a load just empty the tube.
Nobody is going to re-aim their headlight every time they change the tire psi, that is ridiculous. Those 10-15 lbs is not going to make any difference at the headlights.
 
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Dean2

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Agree, it is not all tractors or trailers, that is why I said "most" and that is an accurate statement, at least for on pavement. Off road like log haul, oil patch etc is still predomimantely spring suspension. .
 

Nick@GotExhaust

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I would start with checking your tire pressure and lowering, then raising the pressure when needed when you tow. Also how many miles are on your shocks? Have they even been replaced? You may be due for shocks. Shorter coils aren't necessarily the answer, lower spring rate might be but it then reduces your capacity which I advise against since you do tow.

Message me if you would like a quote on anything.
 

Dean2

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Nobody is going to re-aim their headlight every time they change the tire psi, that is ridiculous. Those 10-15 lbs is not going to make any difference at the headlights.
He was talking about lowering the rear by putting on shorter coils NOT the minor difference caused by air pressure changes. Lift, level or lower, realigning headlights is germaine and his advice is spot on.
 

Hardracer

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Man,if your tires are actually/literally bouncing off the ground...I'd do the lower air pressure thing and look into some shocks...I don't have a 2500 but it makes sense to me...these guys are usually spot on diagnosing an issue.
 

Diesel Nut

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Like posted, good shocks and proper tire pressure can help with ride. Softer springs will ride better but suffer when loaded.
On my dually (leaf sprung) I swapped the whole rear suspension out to Kelderman air suspension. And lowered the rear a bit to match the front (reverse level). Night and day difference in ride and didn't lose anything on payload ability. In fact, payload is better because the truck doesn't squat at all, no matter what.
It's nice being able to dump the air out and lower the tailgate 5 or 6" too. Makes hooking up trailers easier.
 

Edward Hands

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Check out Thuren Fabrication or Carli Suspension for some options. You can also call and chat with them to get recommendations. Going to a shorter/lower spring doesn't necessarily mean it will ride softer. But as mentioned already you sacrifice load carrying ability to get a softer ride....the softer the ride the less weight you can carry without squatting the rear suspension. There are options to get around this such as adding airbags or other load carrying supplements (like Timbrens).
Tires are part of the equation also. For example if you are running E load rated tires pumped up to 80 PSI they will ride like rocks. I have always adjusted my rear tire pressure pending on the conditions. If running empty I run them pretty low and increase air pressure as the load or towing weight increases. Most 1/2 ton trucks come with much softer C load rated tires running in the 40 PSI range. The difference between a C rated tire at 40 PSI and an E rated tire at 80 PSI makes a big difference in ride quality.
The quote above is good advise and probably the best post here, as there are many poor suggestions. Do not add a 500 pound iron plate for traction. While this may improve the ride while empty, it is not good advise.
The first thing to do is determine the condition of what you now have.
How many miles have been spent "hauling one heck of a load" in the past 10 years?
Is everything factory stock type? Is anything still original in the rear?
What tires? What pressures? What shocks?
The very first thing to look at as far as springs is: How far are you from the bump stops when unloaded? How about with a load?
It sounds to me like you are running out of travel and you lack dampening.
 

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