Stroke or not to stroke that is the question

OK I'm tired of this 5.9l/360 burning oil, it has gotten so bad that I'm using 3qts every 250 miles. I have done the intake already (M1) and I have tried 6 different pcv valves, so I finally did a cylinder leak down test and I have between 80-85% leak down so I'm pulling my engine and rebuilding it. I'm trying to figure out whether or not to do a stroker or just a regular rebuild. I am looking to make more power and torque, I will be putting a set of EQ heads and I'm going to do the Harland sharp 1.7 rockers, just not sure what cam or Throttle body to run. budget is kinda not a problem but I don't have Kenny bell super charger installation budget. so I am asking the fellow truck community for advice and your opinion.

If budget isn't a problem and you wanna make some power, I saw stroke it. You'll definitely stand out, and pair it with some good supporting mods and i'm sure the truck will be a monster.

Plus, you're pulling and rebuilding the motor anyways...

As far as mods go I'm also looking for opinions for them also

2bbl or 4bbl m1?

If you look at my sig on here you'll see the general overview of my build so far. 250-260whp and around 340ish-wtq. Bolt-ons only and it's very very comparable to early hemis but more fun.

If you're tearing it all the way down anyways, +1 stroker. Going to a 408 opens up much more power potential. Airgap or 2bbl m1 would be better suited for full-size ram applications being as they build tq lower in the powerband and better than the 4bbl. If you can have the manifold and heads gasket matched don't hesitate, do it. Porting them a bit to really get the potential out of it would be a great idea as well. Or buy them predone through hipotek, top top notch quality through Richard.

Exhaust you'd be stupid to run something like shorties. I've seen Pacesetter longtubes used on the 02 trucks but i don't know anything about clearance. "Should" be fine. Or you can run Spintech Mid-Lengths for better clearance. Either set uses 1-3/4" primary tubes. I actually have a set sitting in my storage unit, debating swapping to them in November and utilizing the dual 2.5" system i have for a dakota to redo my exhaust for like the 10th time.

Harland rockers are good but if you decide to get head work done you might as well have them drill and tap the heads for a 3/8" stud instead of the 5/16" they have. Set of adjustable 1.6 or 1.7 rockers to match whatever cam you decide to go with.

Lastly you'll need tuning. FlyinRyan out of Katy, Texas is the absolute best there is. However, you have to go to him for a dyno tune or fly him to a local one. Another option if Texas isn't TOO far but still far enough, Marty Fletcher will do it through email. Cost more in the long run but you could have him tune it that way and you'll at least be able to drive and use the truck and maybe make a trip to Texas later. I wouldn't try to go and really abuse it with his tuning but that's my opinion. I would completely refrain from even considering Sean at Hemifever or Chris at P.I.E. because they will kill it

I guess your gonna call it the 2bbl M1 intake, it has the same cut out for the throttle body as the keg had.

Earlier I had contacted flyin Ryan and he had said he could send me a tuner and a couple of different programs as long as I sent him all the info for the truck.

As far as the cylinder heads go I sorta decided on going with the engine quest heads, all of the threads I looked at everybody seems to like them. I will be using the stud and plate kit for 3/8 studs.

I guess one of the big things is that I'm wondering what camshaft people think and is there anybody who has done a stroker and what do they think of it.

Nobody active on here has done a stroker kit. I would eventually do one if i wasn't going the boost route in the future. 6000rpm with a 3.58" stroke vs 6000rpm with a 4" stroke is a big difference in piston speed that i don't wanna deal with under boost lol. I do know several people with strokers and they all love em. I'm told it's reminiscent of old school muscle with that really torquey feeling. I get the same feeling from my factory stroke bolt-on setup and over-gearing. I love how mine drives now, can't imagine how different it would be eith a stroker lol

Camshaft profile is vastly going to depend on your intended use for the truck. A tighter 108LSA for example will make the highest NA power numbers but at the cost of regular drivability. 114lsa will behave similarly to factory cam but with more power though it won't make as much as a comparable 108.

this is my biggest wonder, I am defiantly not boosting or adding squeeze to the motor, I'm just looking for a real good strong motor that moves pretty good but can also tow. I looked at the hughes cams and I'm trying figure out do I get one from them and keep the standard rocker ratio or keep the stock grind and add the 1.7 rockers. I was gonna call them and discuses engine plans but I feel bad bothering them as they have to make money to and didn't want to tie up a tech guy for a half hour or so.

i was debating either stroker, or turbo for my truck. I was originally all for the stroker because I was sure it would be more reliable, but reading up on it that seems to be the opposite. Depending on the amount of stroke I have read on several forums that they only generally last 75k-50k miles.


The reasons i have read is the rings wear out very fast due to a lack of piston skirt height, The more stroke you get the shorter the piston gets. Also the angles of the connecting rod are more severe due to the longer crank accelerating wear on the bearings.

Now I take everything with a grain of salt, but I have yet to see several people with 200k miles 408 strokers. . . . That and I already know turbos But that's when the truck retires from DD activities.

If you wanted to keep it dead nuts reliable I would look at the EQ heads with bigger valves and maybe a port job, better intake, and a cam that fits your needs and works well with your heads and intake. Then just do a slight bore with new pistons and keep the stock crank. Then get it all tuned up.

Standard 408s that aren't being mud raced or things like that are essentially as reliable and last almost as long as your standard 360s or 318s

I am curious as to why a turbocharger or supercharger is not being considered? I understand the engine is getting rebuilt. The only draw back I see is the tuning side of it which there are options other than the factory pcm. Every OEM is now using a turbocharger or supercharger in one or more of their platforms, reliability is not an issue.

Well I would love to have a supercharger but the wallet cant afford that, I'm looking at around $4000 max to do everything as I will be doing all the work myself ( I am a Master Tech certified both ASE and MB/AMG ). I do have access to a machine shop so that stuff isn't a issue buy I'm really looking for more power and this is also going to be my daily driver so I do need it to last.

For $4k a simple turbo setup would be perfect!

Reliability is going to be related to components used regardless if a stroker or adding atmospheres. I understand the dollar side of it. Just thought I'd ask. The turbo or super will add more power than the stroker kit any day of the week.

Well the motor rebuild in parts alone is going to be about $4,000. the motor I have is junk I'm using 3qts of oil in 250 miles, you don't want to be behind me when I have to put the truck into passing gear. the motor has 126 lbs of compression and 85% leakdown, using my borescope and looking into the cylinders I can see tons of carbon build up on the pistons and valves but the weird thing is I still see the cross hatching on the cylinder walls. so as far as turbo or a supercharger on this engine its just not feasible.

Do you have a plennum leak?

I wonder if that is where you started loosing oil, then all that oil could have started gumming up the rings giving you a bad seal now.

If you think the motor is toast now I would say, get a garden weed sprayer, (misting kind), fill it with water and carefully spray it into the throttlebody to remove all that carbon in the cylinders and see where that puts you.

People love to use seafoam but I find it take a LOT to make a dent in the carbon and it makes a lot of unnecessary smoke as the product burns off. But at-least you are less likely to hydro lock your motor.

I have used the water method on all my vehicles and have yet to kill any.

No worries as I said I understand the engine needs a rebuild. I am just a huge fan of forced induction and was curious why it was not being considered. I am kind of surprised your compression test showed that high with the leak down being at 85%.

Believe me I was surprised to see high compression until I bore scoped the cylinders and found a ton of carbon on top of the piston and cylinder head. I have done the water misting trick before on other engines and I did consider doing that, also transmission fluid is the best for top engine cleaner but man does that make a ton off smoke. back in the day when I worked for a Pontiac dealer, we used to use what they called a "top engine cleaner" for carbon knocking on the 4 cylinder engines and you really should have seen the smoke that created. I'm sure if a tree hugger drove by when we where doing that to the cars they probably had a stroke.

I actually did the M1 intake about 4 years ago when I was having oil consumption issues and found out that was my leak by reading around. the oil consumption really got bad again about a year ago.


I don't want to sound like I'm giving this motor the death hammer and not giving it a chance but I have owned this truck since brand new and I have always wanted to find more power the day after the 7 year warranty ran out. I have always wanted to supercharge this thing since the day I bought it, I guess now that there is so many issues with the oil consumption I am ready to pull the trigger and build a monster.

dragracefan said:

Well the motor rebuild in parts alone is going to be about $4,000. the motor I have is junk I'm using 3qts of oil in 250 miles, you don't want to be behind me when I have to put the truck into passing gear. the motor has 126 lbs of compression and 85% leakdown, using my borescope and looking into the cylinders I can see tons of carbon build up on the pistons and valves but the weird thing is I still see the cross hatching on the cylinder walls. so as far as turbo or a supercharger on this engine its just not feasible.

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Oh common... What's a little bit of blow by ever hurt anyone?

Shadow_Death said:

Oh common... What's a little bit of blow by ever hurt anyone?

Click to expand...

Just more room for boost.

Speaking of stroking, what kind of torque do you suppose a 408 with factory heads/intake manifold make? I know that it wouldn't have squat for mid-high-end power but the low-end torque I believe would be frigging awesome. With some other basic bolt-ons and a tune, I would think it would easily pass the 400 mark at circa 3,000 RPM. Increasing power by increasing displacement, doesn't get more old school than that. Well, except maybe adding more cylinders (same thing I guess), so a V10 swap could be something to consider...