Froe0105
Junior Member
First I want to say thanks to everyone’s contribution to similar issues in this forum and many others as it has helped me through the troubleshooting process (just over 3 months). Below is the conditions, symptoms, and steps/actions taken to correct the dreaded random stalling issue. I did all the work except the two trips to the dealership. Hopefully this write-up might save someone else time and money.
Bottom Line Up Front (BLUF): I believe that my issue was a faulty/malfunctioning/damaged PCM which might have been caused by a badly corroded engine to heat shield grounding strap. Once PCM and grounding strap was replaced I have had zero stalling issues. Continue reading for full write up.
Physical conditions in which the stall would occur: Summer & Fall Nebraska, Ohio, & Florida weather conditions. It usually happened from a warm start (after a short drive to get engine warm) but also occurred from a cold start in the morning though not as common. Always under 30 mph.
Observed symptoms: Truck would stall at random times and at lower speeds (under 30 mph). When the stall would occur the radio would stay on and the engine would just die and I would lose power steering and blinkers. I would pull over, place in park, and the truck would start right up every time. There was a couple of times the engine would shudder and all the lights in the cluster to include the red lightning bolt, engine, and ABS would light up, but not all the time or one dependent on the other. Additionally, if I pulled over from a stall and just sat for a minute or two in park (without turning the key to off) the cluster would reset itself as if I just turned the key to the on position. There was a single code stored from time to time P0884 – TCM Intermittent Power. Though this may have been stored as I started the engine from the neutral position while still rolling down the road once or twice. During this time I also had the battery drain. I then observed a charging system voltage drop (14.3v to 11.9v) in step 10 below.
Troubleshooting steps: This was the order in which I addressed the issue (not ideal). But it was what I could do based on knowledge of the issue, endless search for answers, and traveling across many states with limited tools. The steps were recommended from online sources/forums, part store techs, and other shade tree mechanics. At each step the engine still stalled either the same day or the next. I own a mid level Bosch code reader with recording function (2-3 min at a time) and it was crucial during the final steps of resolving the issue. I would often drive trying to record but it wouldn’t always be recording the conditions of the stall as I have to manually start the recording at the end of each cycle while driving.
Steps Taken:
1 – Used higher octane gas, fuel injector cleaner, visual inspection of known grounds (3 total)
2 – Wiggled engine wires to TIPM, PCM, and other exposed wires. Also lightly tapped on PCM with hammer to see if a jarring of the PCM might cause the stall (it did not)
3 – Replaced battery (I never replaced since purchase so when it died I didn’t bother to jump)
4 – Replaced MAP, CAM, Crankshaft sensors
5 – Cleaned throttle body (little dirty but not overly covered in deposits)
6 – Replaced PCM and ASD relays
7 – Tested 2 of 3 grounds with multi meter (all within voltage/resistance tolerance). The cables I had would not reach engine block to test the heat shield ground.
8 – Replaced TIPM - Brought to dealership (ouch). Their MOPAR reader didn’t not pull any additional information. Mechanic was able to recreate the stall from a cold start. Replacing the TIPM was their best guess so I authorized it.
9 – Tested Alternator voltage/resistance (within tolerance), also had load test conducted at auto part store (no issues discovered)
10 – Finally was able to record the stall with the code reader. Voltage of charging system went from 14.3v to 11.9v in anbout 20 seconds with a stall (see pdf attachment, frames 9-12).
11 – Replaced Alternator. My mindset here was to make sure the charging system was 100% since I observed the drop in voltage (even with the good load test) I opted into a new alternator. At this time I also performed a tune up (plugs and boots).
12 – Inspection of engine to heat shield ground. Previously I did just a surface visual inspection of the engine to heat shield ground but while I had it in the air at the shop for the alternator (step 11) I figured to check one more time. From under the truck the grounding cable looked intact and when I moved it with my hand to check and see if it was brittle. The cable had been resting right on top of the exhaust and was almost completely corroded through. Something that couldn’t be seen from above or below unless it was moved. While the engine was running under idle/stationary conditions the voltage read correctly on the code reader (I was unable to test with separate multi-meter)
13 – Replaced engine to heat shield ground strap. Ensured strap would not rest on exhaust.
14 – Replaced PCM. I was nearly at the end of the easy parts to hot swap, so ... back to the dealer it goes. You could buy one from a 3d party online but when it comes to the electronics like the TIPM and PCM I grudgingly will only go to the dealer. I didn't bother with them going through more troubleshooting. I just told them to replace the PCM as they already had their best guess and this was mine.
It has been well over a week on and not a single issue. I believe it is fixed.
If it does stall again with the new TIPM, PCM, and verified charging system my mindset will take me to what the PCM has limited abilities to monitor. Such as fuel pressure (maybe dying pump), fuel injectors, ignition assembly, oil pump, and perhaps the wiring itself as there could be a short somewhere in the bundle that runs behind engine block to the PCM and TPM.
Happy Troubleshooting.
Bottom Line Up Front (BLUF): I believe that my issue was a faulty/malfunctioning/damaged PCM which might have been caused by a badly corroded engine to heat shield grounding strap. Once PCM and grounding strap was replaced I have had zero stalling issues. Continue reading for full write up.
Physical conditions in which the stall would occur: Summer & Fall Nebraska, Ohio, & Florida weather conditions. It usually happened from a warm start (after a short drive to get engine warm) but also occurred from a cold start in the morning though not as common. Always under 30 mph.
Observed symptoms: Truck would stall at random times and at lower speeds (under 30 mph). When the stall would occur the radio would stay on and the engine would just die and I would lose power steering and blinkers. I would pull over, place in park, and the truck would start right up every time. There was a couple of times the engine would shudder and all the lights in the cluster to include the red lightning bolt, engine, and ABS would light up, but not all the time or one dependent on the other. Additionally, if I pulled over from a stall and just sat for a minute or two in park (without turning the key to off) the cluster would reset itself as if I just turned the key to the on position. There was a single code stored from time to time P0884 – TCM Intermittent Power. Though this may have been stored as I started the engine from the neutral position while still rolling down the road once or twice. During this time I also had the battery drain. I then observed a charging system voltage drop (14.3v to 11.9v) in step 10 below.
Troubleshooting steps: This was the order in which I addressed the issue (not ideal). But it was what I could do based on knowledge of the issue, endless search for answers, and traveling across many states with limited tools. The steps were recommended from online sources/forums, part store techs, and other shade tree mechanics. At each step the engine still stalled either the same day or the next. I own a mid level Bosch code reader with recording function (2-3 min at a time) and it was crucial during the final steps of resolving the issue. I would often drive trying to record but it wouldn’t always be recording the conditions of the stall as I have to manually start the recording at the end of each cycle while driving.
Steps Taken:
1 – Used higher octane gas, fuel injector cleaner, visual inspection of known grounds (3 total)
2 – Wiggled engine wires to TIPM, PCM, and other exposed wires. Also lightly tapped on PCM with hammer to see if a jarring of the PCM might cause the stall (it did not)
3 – Replaced battery (I never replaced since purchase so when it died I didn’t bother to jump)
4 – Replaced MAP, CAM, Crankshaft sensors
5 – Cleaned throttle body (little dirty but not overly covered in deposits)
6 – Replaced PCM and ASD relays
7 – Tested 2 of 3 grounds with multi meter (all within voltage/resistance tolerance). The cables I had would not reach engine block to test the heat shield ground.
8 – Replaced TIPM - Brought to dealership (ouch). Their MOPAR reader didn’t not pull any additional information. Mechanic was able to recreate the stall from a cold start. Replacing the TIPM was their best guess so I authorized it.
9 – Tested Alternator voltage/resistance (within tolerance), also had load test conducted at auto part store (no issues discovered)
10 – Finally was able to record the stall with the code reader. Voltage of charging system went from 14.3v to 11.9v in anbout 20 seconds with a stall (see pdf attachment, frames 9-12).
11 – Replaced Alternator. My mindset here was to make sure the charging system was 100% since I observed the drop in voltage (even with the good load test) I opted into a new alternator. At this time I also performed a tune up (plugs and boots).
12 – Inspection of engine to heat shield ground. Previously I did just a surface visual inspection of the engine to heat shield ground but while I had it in the air at the shop for the alternator (step 11) I figured to check one more time. From under the truck the grounding cable looked intact and when I moved it with my hand to check and see if it was brittle. The cable had been resting right on top of the exhaust and was almost completely corroded through. Something that couldn’t be seen from above or below unless it was moved. While the engine was running under idle/stationary conditions the voltage read correctly on the code reader (I was unable to test with separate multi-meter)
13 – Replaced engine to heat shield ground strap. Ensured strap would not rest on exhaust.
14 – Replaced PCM. I was nearly at the end of the easy parts to hot swap, so ... back to the dealer it goes. You could buy one from a 3d party online but when it comes to the electronics like the TIPM and PCM I grudgingly will only go to the dealer. I didn't bother with them going through more troubleshooting. I just told them to replace the PCM as they already had their best guess and this was mine.
It has been well over a week on and not a single issue. I believe it is fixed.
If it does stall again with the new TIPM, PCM, and verified charging system my mindset will take me to what the PCM has limited abilities to monitor. Such as fuel pressure (maybe dying pump), fuel injectors, ignition assembly, oil pump, and perhaps the wiring itself as there could be a short somewhere in the bundle that runs behind engine block to the PCM and TPM.
Happy Troubleshooting.
