AC Problems

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Sherman Bird

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MY early build 19 5th Gen, does so so, even with the TSB done. The only way I can get better temps is to clamp off water pump to core line, or put in the valve I still have not put in.
Yeah, that's galactically stupid for FCA or anyone NOT to valve off the heater core on MAX A/C. My 2004 Ford Ranger does, but my other 2 do not. The Ranger gets colder faster. Gee! I wonder why! Who needs a heater when the heat index is 116 degrees?
 

crash68

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Yeah, that's galactically stupid for FCA or anyone NOT to valve off the heater core on MAX A/C.
I know the early model years of the Gen4 trucks with the 8spd have a 3-way valve to redirect coolant between the heater core and trans TMU. I'm not sure of all of the functionality but it did redirect the coolant to the TMU when cabin heat was not required.
 

Burton Shriber

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have them check the output from the evaporator core sensor.
Mine went out slowly then failed. Of course the inexperienced tech replaced everything but that, I mean everything, pump, condenser, lines, then the old guy in the shop checked the sensors output, bingo.
Now cold as hades
 

kdoublep

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Pinching off the heater core line or installing a valve. Search Muzzy's AC hack. Very simple. Many have great results. I personally have not done it. My AC is ok. Blows 50 degres at vents. Some say they get it down to 44ish with the mod.
 

Power Wagon Chief

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Similar issue with my 2021 PW

Org. Post Aug 29, 2021. Power Wagon with marginal AC cooling. Took it to dealership and they performed a performance test which passed barely, again no margin.

Additional detail (R-134A System): Ram Dealer is using FCA Tech Connect performance criteria. I believe they only took temperature at the center vent during the performance test, no gauge hook-up values were discussed. The day I dropped off at dealership unfortunately was fairly cool outside 76F (30% humidity) vs. the 90F, when I checked. The Dealer said my temp was 48F, which was satisfactory for an ambient temp of 80F per the Tech Connect performance criteria.

As for when I checked at 90F (70% humidity) outside, it was 55F on max cooling & recirc at same center vent test location. This reading was fairly constant as I drove 60mi/hr for over ½ hr and the cab seemed to stay fairly humid. Using another chart for R134A, 90F should produce a range of 44-50F at center vent where as FCA only lists a single temp of 55F for this outside temp reading.

As of Aug. 2023, I plan another visit to dealership prior to warranty running out.
 

Sherman Bird

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THE secret to COLD HVAC is that there is not one thing involved. A black vehicle in Houston? Crazy. A Crew cab truck? LOADS of air volume to remove heat from.

Try this... Run the truck, put the A/C on high and shut the doors. Take a garden hose and observe how much cooler the cabin gets when you spray the condenser.
 

cj5orion

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Issue a bag of dry ice and a personal fan! ;)
:33:
Thread Hijack
Thread Hijackj

Every spring I have to get a can of freon and top off system,slow leak somewhere! Couldn't find it,even with a smoke test,good to go till next year,
This year...lil different...when I attached can to "refill port",it just sprayed out.(clutch was spinning jus fine).Over the years Ive had numerous vacuum issues so I figured freon was full,another vacuum leak,,,aaaargh! (Check valves,1 or 2 years old)
With the system spitting like that and the clutch engaging...most probably another vacuum leak,,,yes?
Ironically...too hot to work on it !!!

Adios Amigos
 
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turkeybird56

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Pinching off the heater core line or installing a valve. Search Muzzy's AC hack. Very simple. Many have great results. I personally have not done it. My AC is ok. Blows 50 degres at vents. Some say they get it down to 44ish with the mod.
My AC, with the TSB done, where they added sensors, worked on evaporator, and such, got my temps down to 48 ish, as long as under 95 F degrees out may hit 46. If I clamp off the inlet line from the water pump to the core, I get down to 40-41 degrees, and that is even sitting still, not pushing air. But I have not clamped off the line this year. I do have a valve and all the parts necessary to put in a manual valve, I am just lucky not drive much. But temps been sometimes at 110 F and more, which is at least 15 degrees above normal, just miserable.
 

turkeybird56

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THE secret to COLD HVAC is that there is not one thing involved. A black vehicle in Houston? Crazy. A Crew cab truck? LOADS of air volume to remove heat from.

Try this... Run the truck, put the A/C on high and shut the doors. Take a garden hose and observe how much cooler the cabin gets when you spray the condenser.
Kinda sounds like my Home AC. In morning and late late afternoon out of the sun, be OK. Late morning till late late in afternoon, my Home temp output goes from 51/52 to 58 ish, and that system is working hard. But we have had so many fires here and dust and such, I quite literally rinse out the AC coils every 2 weeks, and that also drops temps till coils dry out. Sherman: U in Houston, is your RAM Black in color, hee hee, as U see I got Flame Coat Red. I also keep a heat shield in the front windshield which helps immensely at startup. Not burn my hands on the steering wheel.

But mine is an early build MY 19 (April '18), and FCA just screwed up with the redesign in the 5th Gens Blend Door BS and taking out the HCV from the equation.
 

turkeybird56

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Similar issue with my 2021 PW

Org. Post Aug 29, 2021. Power Wagon with marginal AC cooling. Took it to dealership and they performed a performance test which passed barely, again no margin.

Additional detail (R-134A System): Ram Dealer is using FCA Tech Connect performance criteria. I believe they only took temperature at the center vent during the performance test, no gauge hook-up values were discussed. The day I dropped off at dealership unfortunately was fairly cool outside 76F (30% humidity) vs. the 90F, when I checked. The Dealer said my temp was 48F, which was satisfactory for an ambient temp of 80F per the Tech Connect performance criteria.

As for when I checked at 90F (70% humidity) outside, it was 55F on max cooling & recirc at same center vent test location. This reading was fairly constant as I drove 60mi/hr for over ½ hr and the cab seemed to stay fairly humid. Using another chart for R134A, 90F should produce a range of 44-50F at center vent where as FCA only lists a single temp of 55F for this outside temp reading.

As of Aug. 2023, I plan another visit to dealership prior to warranty running out.
See my post #50. Also, PW Chief, you could check the TSB and see if your vehicle falls under it and decide if U want it done or not. I will post here the Original TSB number which I had my work done and also understand there was a modified TSB number. But beware, if they do the TSB, they Pull Out Everything: Dash, Vents, Blower Motor assembly, etc.

ADDED: Also check your AC drain, and make sure not clogged. Since it drains off the firewall now and not down under, it can get clogged, so I did a lil hack to assist with that, and yes when I checked mine, it was clogged.

PIC 1: AC Drain Location. PIC 2: Pic of hack done using valve (not mine). PIC 3: My lil Drain Hack. PIC 4: My Clamp Hack on My truck last year.
PIC 5: Vent Temp with Hack installed. PIC 6: Dealership mechanics working on my TSB.

Original TSB: TSB 24-OO1-19: Pic: MY 19 truck having the TSB done: Note the entire vent channels out, to the right HVAC motors and system: What U not see is the steering wheel pulled down and the other parts of the dash and lower box areas apart in truck.

AC DRAIN 2019 DT RAM.jpg1595941929687.pngDrain hack.JPGhack AC largea.jpgtemp ac hack while driving.jpg


IMG_1848.JPG
 
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Sherman Bird

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Kinda sounds like my Home AC. In morning and late late afternoon out of the sun, be OK. Late morning till late late in afternoon, my Home temp output goes from 51/52 to 58 ish, and that system is working hard. But we have had so many fires here and dust and such, I quite literally rinse out the AC coils every 2 weeks, and that also drops temps till coils dry out. Sherman: U in Houston, is your RAM Black in color, hee hee, as U see I got Flame Coat Red. I also keep a heat shield in the front windshield which helps immensely at startup. Not burn my hands on the steering wheel.

But mine is an early build MY 19 (April '18), and FCA just screwed up with the redesign in the 5th Gens Blend Door BS and taking out the HCV from the equation.
My Ram is green.
 

turkeybird56

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Sherman Bird

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:33:
Thread Hijack
Thread Hijackj

Every spring I have to get a can of freon and top off system,slow leak somewhere! Couldn't find it,even with a smoke test,good to go till next year,
This year...lil different...when I attached can to "refill port",it just sprayed out.(clutch was spinning jus fine).Over the years Ive had numerous vacuum issues so I figured freon was full,another vacuum leak,,,aaaargh! (Check valves,1 or 2 years old)
With the system spitting like that and the clutch engaging...most probably another vacuum leak,,,yes?
Ironically...too hot to work on it !!!

Adios Amigos
Continually letting a leaky A/C refrigerant system go low, the oil WILL migrate to the evaporator, starve the compressor, thus allowing debris to circulate into the system, thus exacerbating the problem to the point that a complete system replacement is necessary. MOST folks do it until the A/C, among other problems, motivate them to get rid of their vehicle(s).

This scenario is one where I get vehicles really cheap because there is such a laundry list of problems, which summed up, equals "it ain't worth fixing"!

My 2002 S/T Blazer is such a vehicle. It sat over 5 years under a tree and turned from white to green. So many things were wrong, that the owner threw up his hands and bought another car and sold me the Blazer for chump change. I spent 6 months fixing all these problems in my spare time.

Interestingly, the A/C high side service valve leaked and had for a long time. After repairing said valve and getting cold A/C again after a long time, the compressor sounded like a moose in heat! I nipped it in the bud and replaced the compressor. Now, the system is both quiet and it blows cold on these extremely hot days.
 

kdoublep

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After this Florida Summer, I may consider hack. A few extra degrees may be worth it.
 

Sherman Bird

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After this Florida Summer, I may consider hack. A few extra degrees may be worth it.
It's less a "hack" than doing what should have been done in the first place. The manufacturers are SO greedy, that they will leave out an item such as a heater core flow valve due to it's costs. One one truck, it is miniscule; multiply that by, say, a million trucks, and you get the point.

I had a GMC Sonoma pick up truck came into the dealer where I worked in about 1998-ish. it was an extended cab with the then "new" Vortec 4 cylinder engine. It was summertime, and like this year, an exceptionally hot summer. This customer had just bought the truck several weeks prior and had about 3000 miles on it.
The complaint was that the transmission would disengage the torque converter clutch and default out of overdrive whilst driving down the highway.

During diagnosis, I found the trans fluid to be black, and the scanner showed the TOT (transmission oil temperature) to be a scorching 250 degrees! Doing a visual inspection, I noticed that the upper radiator hose was routed to the side of the radiator where the transmission cooler was. This meant that hot coolant was being dumped on top of hot trans fluid, both of which which had yet to cool.

The only practical solution I could think of was to install an auxiliary cooler. Well, GM doesn't (or didn't at that time) allow for installation of an accessory to fix a warranty issue. To make matters worse, there was never an external cooler offered for the S/T truck series at that time. What to do?

I had our Service Manager contact the occupants of the ivory tower and get authorization for me to field engineer this problem.

Glory be, and miracle of miracles, he got the rubber stamp for me to retrofit an auxiliary cooler for a 1/2 Ton Sierra onto this S-truck. This meant I had to drill holes in the radiator core support and modify the rear face of the plastic grill for clearance, and I had to fabricate mounting brackets.

Afterwards, I drove the truck, and on that 100+ degree day, got into Houston's quagmire stop and go traffic with a scanner. The TOT never exceeded 175 degrees!

I flushed the burnt fluid out (GM didn't pay for that, our Service department ate it for CSI) and the truck was delivered. Happy ending to the story, and Happy customer, and problem was fixed.
 

turkeybird56

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It's less a "hack" than doing what should have been done in the first place. The manufacturers are SO greedy, that they will leave out an item such as a heater core flow valve due to it's costs. One one truck, it is miniscule; multiply that by, say, a million trucks, and you get the point.

I had a GMC Sonoma pick up truck came into the dealer where I worked in about 1998-ish. it was an extended cab with the then "new" Vortec 4 cylinder engine. It was summertime, and like this year, an exceptionally hot summer. This customer had just bought the truck several weeks prior and had about 3000 miles on it.
The complaint was that the transmission would disengage the torque converter clutch and default out of overdrive whilst driving down the highway.

During diagnosis, I found the trans fluid to be black, and the scanner showed the TOT (transmission oil temperature) to be a scorching 250 degrees! Doing a visual inspection, I noticed that the upper radiator hose was routed to the side of the radiator where the transmission cooler was. This meant that hot coolant was being dumped on top of hot trans fluid, both of which which had yet to cool.

The only practical solution I could think of was to install an auxiliary cooler. Well, GM doesn't (or didn't at that time) allow for installation of an accessory to fix a warranty issue. To make matters worse, there was never an external cooler offered for the S/T truck series at that time. What to do?

I had our Service Manager contact the occupants of the ivory tower and get authorization for me to field engineer this problem.

Glory be, and miracle of miracles, he got the rubber stamp for me to retrofit an auxiliary cooler for a 1/2 Ton Sierra onto this S-truck. This meant I had to drill holes in the radiator core support and modify the rear face of the plastic grill for clearance, and I had to fabricate mounting brackets.

Afterwards, I drove the truck, and on that 100+ degree day, got into Houston's quagmire stop and go traffic with a scanner. The TOT never exceeded 175 degrees!

I flushed the burnt fluid out (GM didn't pay for that, our Service department ate it for CSI) and the truck was delivered. Happy ending to the story, and Happy customer, and problem was fixed.
Way back when, previous wife, had a 67 Dart with the slant 6. It was always easy to just slide the temp gauge from hot to cold, and see the wire move the HCV and block off the core from the radiator. Such a simple thing, and Dodge had to have some idjut reinvent the wheel, do the blend BS and now we have all these systems working against themselves and working poorly, IMHO... Not surprising AC works poor since motor dumping 200 +++ degree coolant through the HVAC box while trying to cool, Not take a Rocket Scientist. All IMHO.
 

Sherman Bird

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Way back when, previous wife, had a 67 Dart with the slant 6. It was always easy to just slide the temp gauge from hot to cold, and see the wire move the HCV and block off the core from the radiator. Such a simple thing, and Dodge had to have some idjut reinvent the wheel, do the blend BS and now we have all these systems working against themselves and working poorly, IMHO... Not surprising AC works poor since motor dumping 200 +++ degree coolant through the HVAC box while trying to cool, Not take a Rocket Scientist. All IMHO.
Especially since the thermal dynamic law of entropy states that temperature flows from hot to cold ALWAYS. In addition, our brains tell us that an A/C unit "puts out cold air" when, in fact, the evaporator core is absorbing heat into itself and thence to the low pressure gas (refrigerant), which, literally is boiling and evaporating and in a state of heat absorption transfer. From there, the heated gas is pumped into the compressor and pressurized up and sent a compressed hot gas to the "condenser"... which literally cools off the hot gas, thus putting the heat into the atmosphere, and turns it back into hot, high pressure liquid. Said liquid goes to an orifice, where, a new law comes into play.... Pascal's law. This is where the hot, high pressure liquid is lowered in pressure, and allowed to go back into the evaporator core to boil and evaporate. (At sea level, refrigerant boils and evaporates at -21 degrees F. Remember, for every pound you pressurize a liquid, you raise it's boiling point 3 degrees F. That's why A/C units have 30-40 PSI... because it is under pressure.

Next time you or your wife boils a pot of something on the stove where a lid is used, hold the lid about 18 inches above the pot for a moment and observe the condensed liquid in the lid. Touch it and surprisingly, it is MUCH cooler than the 212 degree water in the pot.... you are experiencing how an evaporator core works, albeit crudely. That gaseous water (steam) is transferring the heat.
 

Tulecreeper

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THE secret to COLD HVAC is that there is not one thing involved. A black vehicle in Houston? Crazy. A Crew cab truck? LOADS of air volume to remove heat from.

Try this... Run the truck, put the A/C on high and shut the doors. Take a garden hose and observe how much cooler the cabin gets when you spray the condenser.
If you have no access to a hose, I've also found that leaving my window cracked about 1/2" for the first 5 - 10 minutes with the A/C on high (not recric) allows the system to push the warm/hot air out faster and replace it with cold air. Then roll the window up.
 
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