Bumper or 5th Wheel

[68PowerWagon]

My wife & I have been looking at campers. I have a 16 2500 with the 6.4 & 3.73 gears. Are the Fifth Wheel Trailers that much more harder to pull due to the aerodynamics? I know the front of those things stick up like a big sail. I like most of the 5vr's better than bumper pulls, but at first, I was leaning towards the bumper pull cause I thought I could get by with my existing ball hitch. Everything that I have been researching states you should have a WD/Anti Sway Hitch when your getting over 4-5,000lbs. no matter if the truck is nowhere near it's pulling capacity. I know most of the WD hitches are a little cheaper than a 5th wheel hitch but now I am thinking that if I have to go out & buy a hitch anyway I might move towards the 5vr.
On a separate note, I am seriously thinking of changing to 4.56 gears for a better pulling experience. Trucks have gone up so much I do not even want to entertain the idea of buying a diesel. I was at a showroom a few weeks ago & seen a Big Horn 1500 for $52,000. That's more than I paid for my 2500 with the Outdoorsman trim!

 

[0rion]

You have it backwards.....5ers tow much nicer than a bumper pull. Much more stable. I own a 5er now and could never go back to a TT. A pretty significant downside is you basically lose the use of your truck bed when traveling. That's about it though. I can fit a few things in the bed but really limited as to what you can put back there. Bikes and things like that travel inside the camper.

 

[GrumpyOleMan]

Ditto on Orion's comments. 5th wheel trailers are easier to tow, more stable, and much much easier to back. Having the hitch weight and pivot point over the rear axle instead feet behind it changes the dynamics significantly.

 

[crash68]

You have it backwards.....5ers tow much nicer than a bumper pull. Much more stable.

^^^^ this
A fiver couples the trailer to the rear axle of the truck, a tag along uses the rear axle as a pivot/leverage point.
A truck's tow capacity has nothing to with needing a WDH. A WDH is to counteract the leverage the trailer tongue weight applies to the truck.
Two of the biggest misconceptions about towing are: "I have a 2500/3500 so I don't need a WDH" and "The truck sits level so a WDH isn't needed"(usually the truck has airbags).

 

[Mountaineer83]

I have a 6.4 with 4.10s and went from a 34' TT to a 42' 5th wheel. Same truck. I find the stability of the 5th wheel to outweigh the added weight over the TT. The only issue I have is chucking from my pin box, so I'd recommend having them throw in a cushioned pin box on the 5th wheel, even just a More-ryde or a Lippert Rota-flex. Otherwise, I recommend the 5th wheel for towing and for room.

 

[0rion]

I have a 6.4 with 4.10s and went from a 34' TT to a 42' 5th wheel. Same truck. I find the stability of the 5th wheel to outweigh the added weight over the TT. The only issue I have is chucking from my pin box, so I'd recommend having them throw in a cushioned pin box on the 5th wheel, even just a More-ryde or a Lippert Rota-flex. Otherwise, I recommend the 5th wheel for towing and for room.

Are you sitting level and where's most of your weight on the 5er in relation to the 5er axle? Can probably fine tune alot of that out? What pin box and what hitch?

 

[Mega-Hemi]

You have it backwards.....5ers tow much nicer than a bumper pull. Much more stable. I own a 5er now and could never go back to a TT. A pretty significant downside is you basically lose the use of your truck bed when traveling. That's about it though. I can fit a few things in the bed but really limited as to what you can put back there. Bikes and things like that travel inside the camper.

Or you can mount them on the front of the truck.

 

[68PowerWagon]

I knew turning, backing up, & weight distribution would be better with a 5th wheel, but I was more worried about the aerodynamics & wind drag.

 

[Mountaineer83]

I didnt notice a lot of drap really with mine. I'm sure there is some, but I don't really notice it much.

As for sitting level, it squats my truck about 1.5" to 2" before I p ut any air in the bags. I just have the standard pin box with the B&W Companion.


This pic is the day I picked it up. I did t have any air bags at the time and hadn't adjusted the hitch any. I did have the junk from my TT loaded though, so it wasn't completely unloaded.

 

[sandawilliams]

Find the trailer you like and buy it. There are many pluses and minuses between 5th wheel and bumper pull. I have pulled both and had no problems either way. Figure out your needs and wants and go from there. My situation is I need an 8' bed to haul my ATV and other things. I've got a 30' bumper pull. Toy haulers are out because of their unload/reload requirements. 5th wheels are out because of how high they are. I've got what I want in my situation but everyone is different.

 

[0rion]

Or you can mount them on the front of the truck.

I've looked at doing that a few times and always end up talking myself out of it because it's just not that big a deal to toss them in the camper. I do like the idea though and at some point will break down and get one.

 

[0rion]

I knew turning, backing up, & weight distribution would be better with a 5th wheel, but I was more worried about the aerodynamics & wind drag.

The drag really isn't an issue. If you read what everyone posts about all the campers you'll see a trend. They all get 10-14mpg and it's almost always more dependent on weight not height or camper style. 5ers tow better so if that's your preference get a 5er....TT open up truck bed. 5ers almost always have higher ceilings which for me is a huge deal and why I love my 5er. I do see some TT's here and there with 7' ceilings which would be desirable for me. At the end of the day like sandawilliams said....find the one that works best for you and your family and enjoy that one. We camp alot and love ours....it's worked out great for us.

 

[mtofell]

I knew turning, backing up, & weight distribution would be better with a 5th wheel, but I was more worried about the aerodynamics & wind drag.

There was a study somewhere I read about (on the net so take it for what it's worth) that said 5th wheels are actually more aerodynamic due to being closer to the truck and the whole unit (truck and 5th) cutting through the wind better than truck and TT. The wind moves around the truck and hangs on the TT.

All I can offer is my experience and that's my MPGs with my 6.4 Hemi and 7500# TT being about .5-1.0 better than with my 11,000# 5th wheel. My main takeaway is that 5th vs. TT, 8,000# vs. 11,000# is really not a major factor with respect to MPG so just get what you want.

The whole 5th vs. TT debate is a tough one and I labored over it for a long time before finally going 5th wheel. I love the floor plan, love the towing once on the road - WAY more stable and no WDH and anti-sway things. Downsides are loss of pickup bed (HUGE), putting an anvil/hitch in my bed every time I want to use my RV and the initial cost of the 5th. Overall, I'm happy with m 5th but there is no silver bullet. You'll find 90% of folks try to convince you their choice is the only way to go but don't believe any one person. Do A LOT of research and decide what works for you.

As much as I love my 5th I sure miss the days of just backing up to my TT, hitching up in 10 minutes and being gone. Once on the road the 5th is a dream to hitch/un-hitch but that initial setup is time consuming (empty the bed, put the hitch in, etc.). And feeding the kids' bikes into the 5th wheel kitchen/living room is no fun either. It's all trade-offs. Marry a blond and you look at brunettes, etc, etc.

 

[Mega-Hemi]

I've looked at doing that a few times and always end up talking myself out of it because it's just not that big a deal to toss them in the camper. I do like the idea though and at some point will break down and get one.

We did that on our old TT. On the new 5’er with the slides in theres not really much room inside for bikes. With losing the bed space the floor space is now taken up with coolers, pop up tents and such. The daughters bike still gets wedged inside, but ours go on the front. I looked into putting them on the back of the camper but like having them where I can keep an eye on them. Plus I have a cargo rack with a large tote on the back. I should probably sift through everything and get rid of what we really don’t need. I know there’s a ton of it.

 

[68PowerWagon]

The drag really isn't an issue. If you read what everyone posts about all the campers you'll see a trend. They all get 10-14mpg and it's almost always more dependent on weight not height or camper style. 5ers tow better so if that's your preference get a 5er....TT open up truck bed. 5ers almost always have higher ceilings which for me is a huge deal and why I love my 5er. I do see some TT's here and there with 7' ceilings which would be desirable for me. At the end of the day like sandawilliams said....find the one that works best for you and your family and enjoy that one. We camp alot and love ours....it's worked out great for us.

Yeah I am 6'2" 190lbs. so I like the taller ceilings as well. A couple of my MUST Have's are a bed long enough that my feet don't hang over & a shower that I can fit into without hitting my elbows. I don't consider myself high maintenance but if I am throwing down that much change for a camper I at least want those items, otherwise I will just stick with a tent! LOL
Thanks for everyone's input. It seems like most people on here are saying, go with the floor plan you like the best. Most of the floor plans I like are in the 5ers so I am really leaning that way. The Keystone Cougars have really caught my eye. Anyone on here had a good or bad experience with Keystone's?

 

[mtofell]

Yeah I am 6'2" 190lbs. so I like the taller ceilings as well. A couple of my MUST Have's are a bed long enough that my feet don't hang over & a shower that I can fit into without hitting my elbows. I don't consider myself high maintenance but if I am throwing down that much change for a camper I at least want those items, otherwise I will just stick with a tent! LOL
Thanks for everyone's input. It seems like most people on here are saying, go with the floor plan you like the best. Most of the floor plans I like are in the 5ers so I am really leaning that way. The Keystone Cougars have really caught my eye. Anyone on here had a good or bad experience with Keystone's?

Very few RVs come with true length beds so I usually just plan to upgrade the mattress (they are usually total crap anyway). This is easy enough but be sure to factor that in when shopping. Walking space at the end of the bed is a necessity and a longer mattress will eat +/- 6" from what you have with the RV shorty mattress. I've also just foam toppers of normal length on the RV shorty and it works out okay for length and does a decent job of improving the low quality stock mattress.

Keystone Cougars are super nice. But Keystone definitely fits the mold of all the RVs everyone complains about. All the horror stories didn't scare me off, though and my Keystone Hideout has been okay. I've also had two buddies buy Keystone's and nothing too crazy has happened to either of them. There's a pretty good Keystone forum that you might take a spin through.

 

[sandawilliams]

I've got a 2017 Keystone Cougar. So far so good but of course replacing screws and other minor maintenance is required. Another big point when buying a trailer of any type with slides. Make sure you have access to the fridge and restroom with slides in. It's a real PITA if you have to run out a slide to use the restroom on the road or load groceries into the fridge. I've seen many an RV with dual slides that restrict the access.

 

[0rion]

We did that on our old TT. On the new 5’er with the slides in theres not really much room inside for bikes. With losing the bed space the floor space is now taken up with coolers, pop up tents and such. The daughters bike still gets wedged inside, but ours go on the front. I looked into putting them on the back of the camper but like having them where I can keep an eye on them. Plus I have a cargo rack with a large tote on the back. I should probably sift through everything and get rid of what we really don’t need. I know there’s a ton of it.

I'm sure you're aware but not all rear bumpers are meant to hold weight. I had to remove our spare off of our bumper because it started tearing the bumper away from the supports....the welds held. It was the actual metal tearing apart. Had to weld it back up. Last year on I-95 we cake across an entire bumper laying in the road with the bikes still attached to it haha. I then looked at welding in a frame hitch to the rear frame on the camper until I talked to a guy that did that to carry his generator on and said it actually bent his frame away from the floor. I know some are designed to carry weight but just too much to risk for me to force it. If I did anything it would be a front hitch like yours.

 

[0rion]

Yeah I am 6'2" 190lbs. so I like the taller ceilings as well. A couple of my MUST Have's are a bed long enough that my feet don't hang over & a shower that I can fit into without hitting my elbows. I don't consider myself high maintenance but if I am throwing down that much change for a camper I at least want those items, otherwise I will just stick with a tent! LOL
Thanks for everyone's input. It seems like most people on here are saying, go with the floor plan you like the best. Most of the floor plans I like are in the 5ers so I am really leaning that way. The Keystone Cougars have really caught my eye. Anyone on here had a good or bad experience with Keystone's?

I have a good friend that's now on his 2nd cougar 5th wheel toy hauler. I've thought both of his have been really nice. I would definitely own one. We have a KZ and I would totally look at them again too. Fit and finish on ours is definitely above average I think.

 

[Mega-Hemi]

I'm sure you're aware but not all rear bumpers are meant to hold weight. I had to remove our spare off of our bumper because it started tearing the bumper away from the supports....the welds held. It was the actual metal tearing apart. Had to weld it back up. Last year on I-95 we cake across an entire bumper laying in the road with the bikes still attached to it haha. I then looked at welding in a frame hitch to the rear frame on the camper until I talked to a guy that did that to carry his generator on and said it actually bent his frame away from the floor. I know some are designed to carry weight but just too much to risk for me to force it. If I did anything it would be a front hitch like yours.

Yeah, I hear about it a lot and it is quite common. I inspect mine pre and post every trip. Seems to be holding up so far. I also looked into welding a hitch to the back of the frame, just haven’t pulled that trigger yet. I’ve also seen other bracket you can bolt right to where the bumper attaches to the frame. But I don’t see how drilling more holes is going to make it any stronger. Like I said, what I really need to do is weed out all the non-essential stuff. If I did that I could probably get rid of the tote all together.