catch can or tuner which one will give best performance

[hemipower95 2.0]

A catch can doesn't add any power. A catch can will ensure your truck run as best as possible by having your intake cleaner. Just purely numbers a tuner will give you more performance.

 

[ExpressRules]

A catch can doesn't add any power. .

Do you actually believe a tuner gives a better HP gain than a catch can ?

 

[MANual_puller]

Do you actually believe a tuner gives a better HP gain than a catch can ?

Neither are good without the stickers. You have to put the dsp sticker on to activate the power. Same with the catch can especially the moroso one

 

[jljbtm]

Some of you guys should wise up before you spend or waste all your money on useless stuff. Why does everyone want to re-engineer these nice trucks? If the catch can was really needed on your truck some engineer with brains would have put it there. Now if you take your truck to a drag strip every day or just like mashing the pedal to the floor of your DD then you might want one. Do you really know what it's for? Or what system it's even connected too?

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[hemipower95 2.0]

Some of you guys should wise up before you spend or waste all your money on useless stuff. Why does everyone want to re-engineer these nice trucks? If the catch can was really needed on your truck some engineer with brains would have put it there. Now if you take your truck to a drag strip every day or just like mashing the pedal to the floor of your DD then you might want one. Do you really know what it's for? Or what system it's even connected too?

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He called a catch can useless

 

[MANual_puller]

Some of you guys should wise up before you spend or waste all your money on useless stuff. Why does everyone want to re-engineer these nice trucks? If the catch can was really needed on your truck some engineer with brains would have put it there. Now if you take your truck to a drag strip every day or just like mashing the pedal to the floor of your DD then you might want one. Do you really know what it's for? Or what system it's even connected too?

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Answer pcv system. The engineers took a shortcut and dumped the crankcase vapors into the intake without an oil separator. Venting to atmosphere isn't allowed per the epa any more so the solution engineers deemed acceptable is to gum up and ruin many a throttle body, gum up intake manifolds and force gunk through the combustion chamber.

It'll separate the oil perfect without it but the key to unlocking the horsepower is all in the stickers.

 

[jljbtm]

Right the catch can is a drop out or sump used on engines with alot of WOT use. Normal DD use its not needed. 25hp gains LMAO

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[ExpressRules]

. 25hp gains LMAO

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Actually closer to 32 or 33 HP gain.

 

[jljbtm]

Give me some more stickers LOL

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[MANual_puller]

Give me some more stickers LOL

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The secret is in the adhesive. It really locks in the mod for maximum performance

 

[jljbtm]

Sure, it won't peel of at 140MPH

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[jcarden10]

Anyone watch street outlaws? On the last episode Chuckie in the deathtrap mustang which this season is fast ass car, lost a race and said the reason was he forgot to empty his catch can.... Haha

Pretty sure he was serious about it...

Just saw that episode. He said the catch can lost him the race because it overflowed and spilled oil on the lane causing his tires to spin.


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[MANual_puller]

Just saw that episode. He said the catch can lost him the race because it overflowed and spilled oil on the lane causing his tires to spin.


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That's bogus because they are sealed lol

 

[Casper]

Some of you guys should wise up before you spend or waste all your money on useless stuff. Why does everyone want to re-engineer these nice trucks? If the catch can was really needed on your truck some engineer with brains would have put it there. Now if you take your truck to a drag strip every day or just like mashing the pedal to the floor of your DD then you might want one. Do you really know what it's for? Or what system it's even connected too?

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You ASSume Chrysler (FCA) was interested in selling the best engine and truck, rather than a good engine and truck for the most profit. Even $50 more in parts adds up to big money over a 100K vehicles.

Chrysler engineers, knowing the Hemi has a blow-by issue decided to pump the PCV waste into the intake. Lots of mfgrs do that, but the Hemi has a higher level of blow-by. No extra parts to install (i.e. catch can), just bump up the required octane to avoid detonation--and that bill is on the owner.
Same with the stock intake. Its O.K., sucks an adequate amount of relatively cooler air through fender, but that articulated intake hose is turbulent. Better flow, better supply of O2 for combustion. Filter from factor is crap too. They also went with a narrow throttle body, adequate for a quiet stock truck with stock air box and stock exhaust.
The common element here is it is all about what is cheapest to Chrysler and easiest to assemble, with no extra parts required--and that saves FCA a lot of money. Its not like its safety issue like Ferd's Pinto, its just a corporate choice to SUB-OPTIMIZE performance in favor of reduced build cost.

So if you're going to treat it like a lease vehicle with a low mileage turn-in limit, then stock is fine.

But your RAM has a Hemi and you might as well enjoy ALL it can deliver.

 

[dRAMbuie]

You ASSume Chrysler (FCA) was interested in selling the best engine and truck, rather than a good engine and truck for the most profit. Even $50 more in parts adds up to big money over a 100K vehicles.

Chrysler engineers, knowing the Hemi has a blow-by issue decided to pump the PCV waste into the intake. Lots of mfgrs do that, but the Hemi has a higher level of blow-by. No extra parts to install (i.e. catch can), just bump up the required octane to avoid detonation--and that bill is on the owner.
Same with the stock intake. Its O.K., sucks an adequate amount of relatively cooler air through fender, but that articulated intake hose is turbulent. Better flow, better supply of O2 for combustion. Filter from factor is crap too. They also went with a narrow throttle body, adequate for a quiet stock truck with stock air box and stock exhaust.
The common element here is it is all about what is cheapest to Chrysler and easiest to assemble, with no extra parts required--and that saves FCA a lot of money. Its not like its safety issue like Ferd's Pinto, its just a corporate choice to SUB-OPTIMIZE performance in favor of reduced build cost.

So if you're going to treat it like a lease vehicle with a low mileage turn-in limit, then stock is fine.

But your RAM has a Hemi and you might as well enjoy ALL it can deliver.

First off, let me say that I don’t claim to be any more knowledgeable than anyone else on this subject. I'm no stranger to performance modifications, but I'm certainly not a performance expert, nor have I done any significant mod's to my Ram.

I've read many a debate about the use of catch cans on many different vehicle forums, and you can pretty much fill in the following blank;

“… The (BLANK) engines in these vehicles have a known issue with oil blow by”.

Honestly. Look around and you see people making that claim everywhere.
You also see the same general statement about all "direct injection engines".

Again, I’m not commenting on whether or not that’s true. I’m just saying it’s not a claim that’s specific to Ram trucks or Hemi engines, by any stretch of the imagination.

Speaking specifically about daily drivers (highly modified performance engines are a different matter entirely) I've come to the conclusion that claims about catch cans are somewhat equivalent to the claims people made about throttle body spacers years ago.
Another day, a different fad.

I found the following exchange on a Corvette forum.
It claims to be an email exchange between a guy by the name of Mike Criswell, and an engineer on the Stingray development team at GM.
What he says makes a lot of sense to me, but take a read through and decide for yourself.

Mike: "I was the one that contacted someone from the Stingray Consultant team from GM...Here comes is what he wrote back on this matter."

"The Stingray was evaluated with over one million development miles on 200 captured test fleet cars. There are tens of thousands of direct injection vehicles on the road from General Motors alone. During the evaluation hundreds of engines were literally torn down in to part piles and evaluated. There are hundreds of thousands of LSx family of motors (where part of this catch can hype started) on the roads and the many of these motors are running well past 250,000 miles without a catch can.

The cars have a 100,000 mile powertrain warranty and that includes mechanical failure of the engine. Trust me when I tell you that there are not reams of data (not even pages of data) on cars coming up lame because of oil at the MAF. It just isn't the problem that the "internet" makes it out to be. When you ask a GM Powertrain engineer about a catch can the reply is that the only thing you get is added weight.

In looking at the extra effort and added cost that went in to the Stingray, do you really believe for one second that if a $20.00 part attached to the engine would improve reliability, limit warranty claims and replacement costs, that GM wouldn't have put it on if it was necessary as part of their evaluation?

Every single GM engineer that I have spoken with told me in one form or another that a catch can is predominately a "gimmick" device created by tuners looking to make a few extra bucks on their engine modifications.

As a by-product of the PCV system, excess oil vapor is recycled to prevent it from leaching out in to the environment. It will condense back in to liquid if the temperature and environmental conditions are right. A catch can is an oil separator device. It allows the heavier oil in liquid to condense in the bottom of the can and only pass the air (gases) back. This is basically the same thing that is happening at the front of the MAF where most of the oil can be found.

The theory is that this oil in the intake system will collect on the valves and in the cylinders and cause excess carbon deposits. The catch can will reduce (not eliminate) oil pooling in the MAF.

Where the plan breaks down is that there aren't thousands of cars detonating because of the oil. As I told you on the phone, This isn't new. The engines are designed to deal with a quantity of oil mist presented via the intake.

You asked what I should tell the customer, my answer is I'm not sure because I don't know what his question is. If the question is is this normal? The answer is yes. If the question is should I put a catch can on? The answer is what ever makes you feel better. If the question is do I need a catch can? The answer is a resounding no. If the reply is that they saw it on the internet, apologize politely and tell them virtually every thread about it has started with a vendor selling a product or a consumer that was fooled by the hype and trying to make themselves feel better about their purchase by getting others to agree with them.

If he has concerns about his condition he should take the car to his dealer for evaluation.

Here is my standard response to the dozens of emails I get each year with a link to a thread like you posted (and often, that very same thread).

Simply stated, absolutely not on the catch can. It simply isn’t warranted for any street driven car. We can talk in more detail about it tomorrow and Dan will appreciate it as I’ve all ready had this conversation with him as well. Since the advent of the PCV system, cars have released some oil in places where it wouldn’t normally have gone in a fully sealed system. It ends up in vapor which condenses back in to liquid form in the intake path. As a result of that, the system is designed to ingest and subsequently digest some extra oil. Higher revving produces more oil and repeated higher revving (drag racer, track duty car, etc.) would be in the realm of uses that I might consider adding the can. Daily driving, occasional back road romp or stop light to stop light burst, not so much.

With all of that said, they won’t hurt anything. For those that don’t want to take my word for it, can feel comfortable adding it but it won’t make an appreciable difference in the life of the motor or the efficiency of the system.
If you dig deep enough in to forum information about catch cans, all roads generally lead back to a performance tuner, aftermarket part supplier or fabricator who has a vested interest in selling catch cans." Stingray Consultant

Thoughts?

 

[Ram Night]

You must be using a billet CC and braided lines !!!!!

You mean something like this one I had on the Challenger, Before I put on the new Ram?

 

[adrianp89]

Thoughts are he is spot on - and everyone is wasting there money. Of course I said that in the last thread and everyone was quick to defend it in one form or another. To each their own - but at the end of the day it does not benefit anything or anyone except the people selling them.

 

[Casper]

First off, let me say that I don’t claim to be any more knowledgeable than anyone else on this subject. I'm no stranger to performance modifications, but I'm certainly not a performance expert, nor have I done any significant mod's to my Ram.

I've read many a debate about the use of catch cans on many different vehicle forums, and you can pretty much fill in the following blank;

“… The (BLANK) engines in these vehicles have a known issue with oil blow by”.

Honestly. Look around and you see people making that claim everywhere.
You also see the same general statement about all "direct injection engines".

Again, I’m not commenting on whether or not that’s true. I’m just saying it’s not a claim that’s specific to Ram trucks or Hemi engines, by any stretch of the imagination.

Speaking specifically about daily drivers (highly modified performance engines are a different matter entirely) I've come to the conclusion that claims about catch cans are somewhat equivalent to the claims people made about throttle body spacers years ago.
Another day, a different fad.

I found the following exchange on a Corvette forum.
It claims to be an email exchange between a guy by the name of Mike Criswell, and an engineer on the Stingray development team at GM.
What he says makes a lot of sense to me, but take a read through and decide for yourself.



Thoughts?

Maybe because you said Corvette I'll cut you some slack, but I have no respect for Chevy otherwise.

I'm fairly certain that the oily waste from the PCV causes the Hemi PCM to pull timing to avoid detonation. That along with modestly higher than average compression in the Hemi is what causes FCA to recommend 89 Octane.

I run 87 Octane saving about 40-50 cents per gallon where I live, with no noticeable drop off in performance as a daily driver. If the catch can is responsible, then it paid for itself year one, and I've had it for almost four years. And even the Corvette wankers admit is does no harm.

 

[VB712]

A catch can may be a waste of money but let's be honest here. Modifications period are a waste of money as a vehicle is suppose to be for transportation use only. But then there are people like us that just can't keep from modifying anything. Haha

 

[Gamester]

Jeez Louise people, I'm really getting sick of this mindless topic that keeps coming up over and over, CATCH CANS ARE NOT A PERFORMANCE PART! All it takes a one quick google search to find that out. I find it utterly amazing that with all the helpful technology in the world today with a mass sea of instant information that there are still so many dumb idiots out there that don't even spend the 5 seconds it takes to find an answer to a question like this nor have any what used to be known as "common sense"