So This Is What Ill Be Towing From Now On

[danielmid]

Just an update for those that don't mind, I purchased one of these red PTFE lube plates for my hitch.

I trimmed it to fit the pin box with the locking wedge and it is only the width of the pin box to stay within the capture plates of the Demco slider.

Believe it or not, the hitch/pin box is smoother hooking and unhooking, and there is none of the noise and "clunkiness" that I felt before. Much better. I also bought a 5th wheel pin tripod to keep it more stable. I think when I get some money ahead again, I will get the rear hitch stabilizer. I thought about the front jack stabilizers, but they're pretty pricey too.

Also, the last camping trip I went on, I used the auto-lever and it actually raised the camp/passenger side tires off the ground....I've read on one of the other RV forums that it is not good if the auto-leveler raises the tires off the ground. Anyone confirm this? I thought the auto-level it didn't matter?

Extra stress and flex on the frame, and you lose the support of the tires/suspension on the one side for wiggle prevention. Might be okay, but it would be safer to block the low side.

 

[2003F350]

Just an update for those that don't mind, I purchased one of these red PTFE lube plates for my hitch.

I trimmed it to fit the pin box with the locking wedge and it is only the width of the pin box to stay within the capture plates of the Demco slider.

Believe it or not, the hitch/pin box is smoother hooking and unhooking, and there is none of the noise and "clunkiness" that I felt before. Much better. I also bought a 5th wheel pin tripod to keep it more stable. I think when I get some money ahead again, I will get the rear hitch stabilizer. I thought about the front jack stabilizers, but they're pretty pricey too.

Also, the last camping trip I went on, I used the auto-lever and it actually raised the camp/passenger side tires off the ground....I've read on one of the other RV forums that it is not good if the auto-leveler raises the tires off the ground. Anyone confirm this? I thought the auto-level it didn't matter?

You mean the auto-level pulled the passenger side tires of the camper off the ground? For a moment I thought you were talking about the truck, and those systems SPECIFICALLY call out that you MUST be unhooked before attempting to level.

That said, I always carry blocks, even with auto-level, to get the trailer halfway level side-to-side. If the site is so far out of level that it's going to pick a set of tires off the ground, then you should either relocate or put blocks under the tires. These auto-level systems are strong (especially the hydraulic systems), but they aren't really meant to support the full weight of the rig - some of that weight is supposed to stay on the tires.

 

[nlambert182]

Yea autolevel just gets you that last little bit but never let it lift the tires. If necessary, back the low side tires onto some blocking to get it close to level and then let auto level do the rest. It can bend the frame and/or bend the leveling jacks.

The lube plates are fantastic. They get rid of the necessity to grease the hitch.

Those fifth wheel tripods don't really do a whole lot in my opinion but some people swear by them. I tried one once and sold it. I noticed that it didn't really do much for me other than add a tripping hazard when I needed to get to my under nose storage in the dark. The best thing that I found to stabilize our camper that didn't have auto level were JT Strongarms. They made the rig rock solid. The very last one we sold had 6 point auto level and I learned that if I blocked under the leveling jacks to limit their extension the trailer was much more solid. The shorter the jacks, the tighter it felt. I ended up not needing stabilizers on that one.

One more thing.... tires play a part as well. On the one we had with no auto level, we had the stock el cheapo tires on them and they have a lot of bounce to them. The last one I installed Sailun G rated tires on and they had no give. That helped a lot too. When I took off the stock tires you could literally fold them in half.

 

[18CrewDually]

If you don't know, you shouldn't guess and give mis-information.
Like I said, if it us a 6 pt system there is no harm or issue if it lifts a tire to gain level. This is right from Lippert, a leader in providing these systems on the chassis.

 

[2003F350]

If you don't know, you shouldn't guess and give mis-information.
Like I said, if it us a 6 pt system there is no harm or issue if it lifts a tire to gain level. This is right from Lippert, a leader in providing these systems on the chassis.

View attachment 531386

The six point hydraulic systems can get away with it - but it's still not a good idea as you lose some of your contact points with the ground.

 

[2003F350]

Yea autolevel just gets you that last little bit but never let it lift the tires. If necessary, back the low side tires onto some blocking to get it close to level and then let auto level do the rest. It can bend the frame and/or bend the leveling jacks.

The lube plates are fantastic. They get rid of the necessity to grease the hitch.

Those fifth wheel tripods don't really do a whole lot in my opinion but some people swear by them. I tried one once and sold it. I noticed that it didn't really do much for me other than add a tripping hazard when I needed to get to my under nose storage in the dark. The best thing that I found to stabilize our camper that didn't have auto level were JT Strongarms. They made the rig rock solid. The very last one we sold had 6 point auto level and I learned that if I blocked under the leveling jacks to limit their extension the trailer was much more solid. The shorter the jacks, the tighter it felt. I ended up not needing stabilizers on that one.

One more thing.... tires play a part as well. On the one we had with no auto level, we had the stock el cheapo tires on them and they have a lot of bounce to them. The last one I installed Sailun G rated tires on and they had no give. That helped a lot too. When I took off the stock tires you could literally fold them in half.

I've used the tripods, and for what they are they DO work, but they're not going to eliminate all bounce, no question about that. They are an inexpensive aid, but just keep in mind that they are just thin tube mild steel (or aluminum) and aren't designed to take much for weight. Once saw a guy try to lift his front jacks off the ground to adjust them using just one of those and...well thankfully he never actually got the jacks off the ground. He just mangled the tripod.

 

[Tulecreeper]

Also, the last camping trip I went on, I used the auto-lever and it actually raised the camp/passenger side tires off the ground....I've read on one of the other RV forums that it is not good if the auto-leveler raises the tires off the ground. Anyone confirm this? I thought the auto-level it didn't matter?

It depends on if they are "stabilizers", or "levelers". Stabilizers are only mean for "stabilizing", not for lifting the unit off the ground. Levelers are meant for that because sometimes you need to do that on real uneven terrain. If you have both, use your levelers first, then the stabilizers to stop the rocking.

 

[nlambert182]

If you don't know, you shouldn't guess and give mis-information.
Like I said, if it us a 6 pt system there is no harm or issue if it lifts a tire to gain level. This is right from Lippert, a leader in providing these systems on the chassis.

View attachment 531386

I spoke with Lippert in depth about this exact thing when we were discussing that I was still getting movement inside with the 6 point auto level extended. According to the Lippert CSR that I spoke with I was told specifically in writing not to lift the wheels off the ground. The wheels and axles and front landing gear should be carrying the weight of the trailer. The rest of the leveling system are just stabilizers. They are not meant to carry the weight of the trailer.

etrailer seems to agree with what Lippert says as well.

"The tires on your trailer should not come off the ground while leveling"

https://www.etrailer.com/question-366650.html

I might suggest speaking directly with Lippert. That paragraph is speaking to the fact that it's designed not to twist the frame. The way it accomplishes this is by leveling in small increments once the levelers are on the ground. By adjusting in smaller increments (you will hear the trailer creaking as this is happening) it's minimizing the amount of time and the extent that the chassis is flexed.

There are really 2 jacks, and 4 stabilizers. That's it.

 

[nlambert182]

I'll add this as well. Direct from the Lippert-Auto Level manual.

 

[18CrewDually]

I'll add this as well. Direct from the Lippert-Auto Level manual.

View attachment 531409
View attachment 531410
View attachment 531411

That is there warning strictly to cover there butt if you're using it to REMOVE tires or other service work. Reason being, in the event a leak developed internally it could drift down and they don't want you under it.
You took that warning out of context.

 

[18CrewDually]

I spoke with Lippert in depth about this exact thing when we were discussing that I was still getting movement inside with the 6 point auto level extended. According to the Lippert CSR that I spoke with I was told specifically in writing not to lift the wheels off the ground. The wheels and axles and front landing gear should be carrying the weight of the trailer. The rest of the leveling system are just stabilizers. They are not meant to carry the weight of the trailer.

etrailer seems to agree with what Lippert says as well.

"The tires on your trailer should not come off the ground while leveling"

https://www.etrailer.com/question-366650.html

I might suggest speaking directly with Lippert. That paragraph is speaking to the fact that it's designed not to twist the frame. The way it accomplishes this is by leveling in small increments once the levelers are on the ground. By adjusting in smaller increments (you will hear the trailer creaking as this is happening) it's minimizing the amount of time and the extent that the chassis is flexed.

There are really 2 jacks, and 4 stabilizers. That's it.

Where is your proof in writing that the tires on a side cannot come off the ground in a leveling event? All you were told and provided so far is to not rely on the system to remove tires and service underneath the rig.
These systems are not new folks, motorhomes gad them for decades. And guess what, I've seen plenty with the front tires off the ground to level it.
The point of the warning is Don't be a dummy and remove the tires and lay under it. That should be common sense but by reading posts lately it's not so common anymore.

 

[18CrewDually]

And again, right off their website it states the system on unlevel surfaces will NOT stress the chassis.

" Level Up’s patented design won’t put undue stress on the chassis — the six-point leveling system incorporates leveling jacks before the front axle and behind the rear axle maintaining the integrity of the RV at all times. "

 

[nlambert182]

As I said before.... contact Lippert directly. They will tell you, in writing, not to lift the tires off the ground. The rear 4 jacks are STABILIZERS. They are not meant to lift the entire rig off the ground.

If you need more assurance that you're wrong.... see below. You're right though. I'm sticking the proof right in front of you and you're ignoring it for a brochure that explains how their system doesn't flex the chassis. Common sense is indeed not too common anymore.

Where in the snapshot that you posted does it specifically say that the tires can be off the ground when level? I'll wait......

 

[nlambert182]

Here's the conversation DIRECT from Lippert as of this morning:

 

[18CrewDually]

How to: Operate your RV’s Level-Up® Leveling System Like A Pro with OneControl® - Lippert Components

Learn how to operate your Level-Up leveling system with the ease of LCI’s OneControl touch-panel. OneControl’s smart RV technology can help you unhitch, auto...

youtu.be

Here's an educational video for you. It's provided by Lippert. Goto 3:05 and you will see the tires are clearly off the ground.
It is a LEVELING SYSTEM. It has no issue if one side comes off the ground.
ALL 6 hydraulic cylinders are the SAME. The back 4 are not restricted to "stabalizing" like you said. All 6 work in conjunction to LEVEL the rv like the name applies.

Do what you want but to tell people it cannot ever lift a tire is false. Their warning is because they don't want to be held liable for anyone using them for service like tire removal. That is it.

 

[nlambert182]

So..... you're willingly ignoring LIPPERT specifically saying on multiple occasions not to lift the tires off the ground because you saw one with tires off the ground? I never said it wasn't capable of doing it and neither did anyone else. What I and Lippert both said was that you shouldn't do it. Big difference.



Anyhow I digress. We don't need to continue to derail the OPs thread. At the end of the day, follow the recommendations of the company who designed the product and everyone is fine.

 

[18CrewDually]

You are the one that is ignoring published facts and realworld usage. If you have to ask a desk person in a text message, they are going to take the roll as Nanny and tell you what to do so you don't hurt yourself. For all they know you could be trying to take a flat tire off on the side of the road which is why they would tell you not to.
How can you argue when not only it is done in campgrounds all the time , but Lippert themselves demonstrates it and talks about it being safe in written instruction, plus to top it all off demonstrates it in a published video i linked above?
You do you, but a Levelup 6pt LEVELING SYSTEM is just that, to level a camper even if it means to gain that level it lifts a tire(s) off the ground. There is nothing wrong with that. All 6 hydraulic cylinders have the same lift capacity, if you trust the front 2, the other 4 are more than capable.

 

[runamuck]

I have been a little concerned about this too. the parking slab we have in the backyard slopes a little to the rear and from one side to the other. unless I set the front pretty low, when the system is thru leveling, the wheels on one side are barely touching the pad because the rear jacks are well extended. I have thought maybe I would drag a floor jack over there and raise that axle and slide a layer of the orange squares under that side. a layer or even two would not really transfer much weight from the leveling jacks to the tires tho. I have never noticed this situation having any affect on the suspension when towing later.

 

[18CrewDually]

I have been a little concerned about this too. the parking slab we have in the backyard slopes a little to the rear and from one side to the other. unless I set the front pretty low, when the system is thru leveling, the wheels on one side are barely touching the pad because the rear kacks are well extended. I have thought maybe I would drag a floor jack over there and raise that axle and slide a layer of the orange squares under that side. a layer or even two would not really transfer much weight from the leveling jacks to the tires tho. I have never noticed this situation having any affect on the suspension when towing later.

There's NO reason for concern. The system is designed for it. It is a LEVELING SYSTEM.

 

[OC455]

I only have four levelers on my rig (electric). The front landing gear and the levelers right behind the rear tires of the 5'ver. Only reason I asked was because of what I saw on the GD owners forum.

I thought that my site was level until I hit auto level and it lifted only the tires on the one side. The pin stabilizer I do not try to lift anything with it, only to reduce some movement. Going to try the stabilizers from MorRyde (X-Brace stabilizer) and possibly one of their rear hitch ones too.

Maybe ought to steer this thread back to the black tank discussion.....LOL