Synthetic Motor Oil Poll 2017

[Silver Goose]

I did not provide answers, but I did point out another area to look into, the alignment of the lifters to the cam lobes.

According to the Comp Cam tech I talked with, it seems that the engines with MDS (Mopar) and GM's version of that system suffer from cam/lifter wear. Interesting that both engine designs use plastic lifter guides.

No one has answered one of my question about the lifter guide. I think it would be interesting to measure a new guide as far as the lifter area goes, then measure a used one.

I will try to contact a dealer about that idea, why not? The worst that can happen I will find out that the alignment device is perfect.


If anyone has other ideas I would like to hear about them.

Larry

 

[Fitz-0518]

We have found (see this forum archives for pics) that "some" Hemi rocker arms, which are stamped steel parts, are coming out of assembly with the push rod seat off center. Just think about how that effects/translates to the roller lifter. This is why I am convinced that there is no design defect in our Hemi's. But in fact a failure to check/monitor the quality of the suppliers parts. This is why we see no issue with many and failure with some.

 

[Silver Goose]

I agree with you, Fitz87gn, let's face it any high volume part be it stamped or cast can and will have some tolerance build up. While I am in no position to disregard any possible contributor to this problem, I would point out that many millions of engines have stamped steel rocker arms. The one area that keeps popping up is the lifter alignment. In the old days of flat tappets and positive lifter rotations, I rarely heard of the camshaft, lifter problems. And having roller lifter problems were all but unheard of. I have seen old diesel engines, some nearing 100 years old with roller rockers/lifters still running.

As far as the Hemi engine is concerned I must lean to a lifter misalignment. While I do not have the final say in this matter, it would take video proof of the valve train operating at speed to sway me from this thought.

I am equally sure that FCA could give a damn about my opinion, but it is an area to review.

As I have said before I don't have a dog in the fight, I just like to investigate and ask questions whether wrong or right if we proved a failure mode existed, FCA may thumb their nose at me/us.

Larry

 

[zogg]

Interesting that Mobil 1 is tied for 1st place, and it is not approved by Chrysler....ugh

 

[Fitz-0518]

I agree with you, Fitz87gn, let's face it any high volume part be it stamped or cast can and will have some tolerance build up. While I am in no position to disregard any possible contributor to this problem, I would point out that many millions of engines have stamped steel rocker arms. The one area that keeps popping up is the lifter alignment. In the old days of flat tappets and positive lifter rotations, I rarely heard of the camshaft, lifter problems. And having roller lifter problems were all but unheard of. I have seen old diesel engines, some nearing 100 years old with roller rockers/lifters still running.

As far as the Hemi engine is concerned I must lean to a lifter misalignment. While I do not have the final say in this matter, it would take video proof of the valve train operating at speed to sway me from this thought.

I am equally sure that FCA could give a damn about my opinion, but it is an area to review.

As I have said before I don't have a dog in the fight, I just like to investigate and ask questions whether wrong or right if we proved a failure mode existed, FCA may thumb their nose at me/us.

Larry

I can see your point Larry. Like you, I have a cause and effect mind set. At the end of the day, I believe FCA will eventually have to face the valve train issue. Fitz

 

[R.L.K.]

Interesting that Mobil 1 is tied for 1st place, and it is not approved by Chrysler....ugh

That's because the Chrysler approval is a joke [emoji1303] bottom line is most any name brand oil could easily surpass the minimums of the Chrysler specs and the oil companies know that so they just don't spend their time & money getting the approval .

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[Burla]

FCA behaved badly when they first spec'd their oil, I don't blame m1 for telling them to pound sand. Giving a two year monopoly to the competition because Pennzoil paid for it is shameless and very likely illegal.

 

[zogg]

VALVOLINE??????

I am just wondering why the folks on this forum tend to NOT like Valvoline, but other forums it is very popular. Bob is the Oil Guy forum has very high regards for Valvoline oil. THe new formula Advance Synthetic (replaced Synpower) is supposed to be super!!

My dad used Valvoline for many years, and I use a lot of it because I grew up with it in my dad's garage....never had an issue. Used it in daily drivers, performance cars and race cars...never a failure.

Some folks say that it is/was the sodium in the oil, which was not actually true, but showed up as sodium in an oil analysis.

Anyway, I was just wondering. I am changing oil this weekend in my 2018 Ram Hemi....using 7 quarts of Valvoline Advance Synthetic 5w20 and a Mopar filter.

 

[Silver Goose]

I believe that today's oils are all good, some may be at the minimum of the spec, but it passes. I try to use the best product possible when it comes to my vehicles, I am retired and I can not buy a new vehicle every year.

Years ago Kendall Oil was also highly rated and in fact, sponsored several Indy racers.

Larry

 

[Burla]

Let's be honest, the specs are really to guard against the dog oils you find at dollar general and ****. And if you read PQIA you will see even today many dog brands fail minimum standards in viscosity and additives.

My issue with valvoline is no moly, the more you read the more you will see moly is one of the most important elements added to a hemi specific oil. Thus why when fca designed an hemi oil, they put over 250ppm moly, and when you run valvoline unless you add some moly, you have zero if you believe most uoa's with valvoline. At one point on the board I'm sure the usual's remember this, 6 cam fails in a ROW where no moly oils, valvoline owned two of the 6. Documented somewhere in the syn thread. If I was gonna use valvoline, an otherwise stellar oil, at a minimum I would use 5w30.

 

[Burla]

Again, we have a very specific application when it comes to oil selection, what is a great oil for one vehicle may be a poor choice for ours, and the oil that may be a great choice for a 5.7 mds hemi may be a poor choice for other applications. Yes, you can still have success stories here and there, and yes you can choose to be a brand loyalist and ignore what the engineers at FCA formulated for hemi's, but is that the educated lubrication strategy?

Prior to this very vehicle my favorite oil was m1, god I loved that **** for near 20 years served me perfectly well, thanks m1. Still one of two oils I will run in my other vehicle. But in my specific hemi application my strategy is to accept there are issues facing our cams and try to utilize the science to best protect the metal. Highest quality base oils (yes group 4/5 outperform group 3) and high additives is my choice to protect my metal, and many guys have found out just running that formula makes their engines run much much smoother then random group 3's like m1 or valvoline. It is not a knock on those oils, as stated before if not for owning a hemi I'd likely still be a group 3 brand loyalist, but if my cam is gonna fail early I will know at least I tried everything in my power to stop it. Heartiest oil I can find and going up 10 points in viscosity was my personal strategy for what it's worth.

 

[Hemi395]

Valvoline is a good oil, just not good for Hemi's imo because of the lack of moly like Burla mentioned. But I have several friends that use Valvoline products exclusively for years and their cars go forever.

 

[R.L.K.]

Yep nothing wrong with Vavoline oil I'm [emoji1303]
If it had 400 ppms of Molybdenum I'd recommend it for the Hemi .
I would at least go up to a 30weight though .

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[J-Ram]

I drive 90% stop and go traffic and most of the time in the winter the truck barely gets fully warmed up before i make it to work. I only drive 4-5k miles a year. What would be better in my case? Something like Pennzoil PP 5w-30 and change it annually or Redline 5w-30 and change it annually or maybe even once every 2 years? Does the extra cost of the Redline make it worth it for me?

 

[Burla]

I drive 90% stop and go traffic and most of the time in the winter the truck barely gets fully warmed up before i make it to work. I only drive 4-5k miles a year. What would be better in my case? Something like Pennzoil PP 5w-30 and change it annually or Redline 5w-30 and change it annually or maybe even once every 2 years? Does the extra cost of the Redline make it worth it for me?

Depends if you have a hemi tick, if not maybe stick with what you are doing. If at warm idle you have no tick, I'd say you are in good shape. I will however say people who don't change their oil for a year, really should look at synthetic media filtration. Read my oil filter thread in my sig.

 

[LouM]

Shell Rotella T6 5W-40, 10.5 qts at a time.

 

[Truck Fun]

First oil change will be in about 2-3 months so I stopped by the dealership this week to ask about possibly going synthetic Pennzoil. Dealer stocks it so I wouldn't have to bring it myself; forgot to ask about cost difference; also forgot to ask about possibly brining a fram synthetic filter.

At this point, I'm really going back & forth on whether or not I really need to go synthetic or stay with the conventional mopar/pennzoil. I don't mind paying some more for synthetic; however, I'm going to be staying with 5000 miles or under on my changes so I may not really get the benefits of synthetic.

Also, one individual behind the counter; not the service manager said that I if I go synthetic, then not to ever switch back to conventional; didn't get back to that topic but have never heard that stated before.

 

[Ramnewbie]

I drive 90% stop and go traffic and most of the time in the winter the truck barely gets fully warmed up before i make it to work. I only drive 4-5k miles a year. What would be better in my case? Something like Pennzoil PP 5w-30 and change it annually or Redline 5w-30 and change it annually or maybe even once every 2 years? Does the extra cost of the Redline make it worth it for me?

JMO but my engine made the most noise on PP. Some have had good luck with it but mine sure didnt like it. If I was going to use Pennzoil id go with PUP.

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[H1Chester]

Also, one individual behind the counter; not the service manager said that I if I go synthetic, then not to ever switch back to conventional; didn't get back to that topic but have never heard that stated before.

I've heard that before. I'm not an oil nerd so I'll leave it to them to answer...

I will be combing through this thread and other oil threads to decide on an oil to go with. My last oil change not long ago was the last "free" dealer change.

 

[wespentecost]

I've heard that before. I'm not an oil nerd so I'll leave it to them to answer...

I will be combing through this thread and other oil threads to decide on an oil to go with. My last oil change not long ago was the last "free" dealer change.

I'm very happy with redline 5w-30

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