Synthetic Oil

[Burla]

@U&A what you say on amsoil saber?

 

[U&A]

What's the difference between Amsoil Dominator and Amsoil Saber? They market Sabre specifically for chainsaw engines.

The actual diff I dont know but Saber created more carbon from what a lot of builders found. How bad? I have no idea. All of them
Create some amount of carbon if they are burning the oil. Lots of guys use it or dominator tho.

 

[HEMIMANN]

It looks like amsoil has a few for power sports like redline, but they also have amsoil saber for "professional" power equipment. They also have an "interceptor" with the dominator. Both of these two push high heat and cold with dominator being the high heat, similar with redline offerings. Redline left some meet on the bone, shame shame. I do need to get me some of that saber.

If I get time I'll compare spec sheets and / or ask them.

The actual diff I dont know but Saber created more carbon from what a lot of builders found. How bad? I have no idea. All of them
Create some amount of carbon if they are burning the oil. Lots of guys use it or dominator tho.

Builders of?

 

[tjfdesmo]

Yupper - that's the point of leaning the mix with synthetic, since syn is resistant to oxidation (combustion). I think guys that were running Stihl Ultra Synthetic 2 cycle oil were mixing rich like it was a mineral oil, so carboned the bejeezus outta everything.

Since I wrote, I opened up my Stihl 026 saw bought in 1989 with hundreds of hours on it. The friggin piston and rings look new! You can see the machining marks on the piston skirt.

The motor has had nothing but Stihl Ultra Synthetic 2 cycle oil since it 1st came out (don't recall when), @ recommended 50:1, non alcohol premium gas only, always with Stabil additive.
The exhaust ports were complete open too, so I replaced the fuel intake filter and am now replacing the little fuel tank breather assembly - I wasn't aware of!

I have been out of the OPE business for nearly 30 years, but at that time we sold pallets of Stihl 2-stroke and Bar & Chain, and NEVER saw stuck rings, clogged ports, etc. I know they are a very different company today, but are they not still family owned? Marketing trickery was not in their play book at that time.

 

[HEMIMANN]

I have been out of the OPE business for nearly 30 years, but at that time we sold pallets of Stihl 2-stroke and Bar & Chain, and NEVER saw stuck rings, clogged ports, etc. I know they are a very different company today, but are they not still family owned? Marketing trickery was not in their play book at that time.

That's just it, isn't it?
Family companies get sucked up by corporations and wrecked. I personally lived that.

 

[crackerjack1957]

Amsoil Saber Professional vs Dominator | CompareMotorOils

Both the contenders are synthetic engine oils specially made for 2-stroke motorcycle engines. And they both provide great performance to engines but Saber is

comparemotoroils.com

 

[tjfdesmo]

That's just it, isn't it?
Family companies get sucked up by corporations and wrecked. I personally lived that.

Claim they are still family owned?? Go figure. Must be the "new regime".

 

[HEMIMANN]

Claim they are still family owned?? Go figure. Must be the "new regime".

Rotten kids? lol

 

[U&A]

Amsoil Saber Professional vs Dominator | CompareMotorOils

Both the contenders are synthetic engine oils specially made for 2-stroke motorcycle engines. And they both provide great performance to engines but Saber is

comparemotoroils.com

Interesting. Ill have to show this to the gang

 

[HEMIMANN]

I read the compare sheet above along with the Amsoil Data Sheets they publish. Leaves me confused.

I also watched a Project Farm test video between Wally World Supertech and Amsoil Sabre.


2 stroke engine oils are more complicated than 4 stroke engine oils, obviously. There's a lot more going on when you have to burn your engine lubricant.

Generally, the big difference between 2 stroke engines and oils is air cooled vs. liquid cooled, because air cooled run hotter. This means they can tolerate more detergent ash than outboards, which would sludge and carbon them.

The conflicting requirements with 2 stroke oils are to have an oil that combusts well but still lubricates. Synthetics don't combust well, but lubricate well. Minerals combust well, but don't lubricate well.

Amsoil Dominator is a very low viscosity synthetic that will combust easier than Amsoil Sabre synthetic. It has a lower flash point. It also has detergents, Sabre doesn't (confirmed by Project Farm VOA report). The only thing Sabre does better is run in very hot weather. Well, anybody cutting trees in 90 degrees F? Not me.

It seems to me Amsoil formulated these 2 stroke air cooled oils backwards - The Dominator doesn't need detergent because it burns easier, but the Sabre does because it doesn't burn as clean - yet they're the opposite.

 

[JHoward]

Lol, I guess I'm gonna have to get an gas powered chainsaw to able to fit in the current conversation ... never thought about fuel/oil ratios much, as I have only a Husqvarna gas/oil mix leaf blower and weed Wacker. I've always used 91octane unethanol gas, never any problems.

 

[HEMIMANN]

I'm sorry, I shouldn't have started this. I really did think it would be simple and clear after all the years of chain saws.

I tell you all, I was shocked to find clean pistons and rings in my small and medium saws.
I'm not gonna inspect my big one, it has fewest hours and hottest constant loads.

 

[U&A]

Dominator actually cleaned the piston top of my 385XP. Not completely but it did reduce the amount

 

[HEMIMANN]

I wrote to Amsoil. I will post their reply.

 

[JHoward]

I'm sorry, I shouldn't have started this. I really did think it would be simple and clear after all the years of chain saws.

I tell you all, I was shocked to find clean pistons and rings in my small and medium saws.
I'm not gonna inspect my big one, it has fewest hours and hottest constant loads.

I'm actually learning something from you and others on the current conversation.

Y'all are some very knowledgeable folks and I feel left out not being able to put any meaningful 2¢ in, lol.

 

[Burla]

Does anyone know of any equipment manufactured in the last ten years that takes 30 to 1 or less?

So about 10-15 years ago the EPA did regulate this. The final pdf here and everything is now phased in. Pretty sure either in nomenclature or the standards the did ban 30 to 1, but I aint reading this document in full. Nothing sadder then reading gov't regulations.

Of course the user can do what they will with their equipment, but the fact you cant get 30 - 1 premix hints at it? I cant find 30 to 1 true fuel anywhere. Anybody have a source just out of curiosity.

 

[Burla]

Here is a good post 2007 arborist site, yeah for sure the reason no more 30 to 1 was wait for it, our EPA. So yes my question was valid. I am surprised none of you guys new as you use 2 strokes more then myself. No hysteria, I was just curious because I had seen 30 - 1 prior. My guess most of you guys dont mess with pre mix'd.

 

[U&A]

Yupper - that's the point of leaning the mix with synthetic, since syn is resistant to oxidation (combustion). I think guys that were running Stihl Ultra Synthetic 2 cycle oil were mixing rich like it was a mineral oil, so carboned the bejeezus outta everything.

Since I wrote, I opened up my Stihl 026 saw bought in 1989 with hundreds of hours on it. The friggin piston and rings look new! You can see the machining marks on the piston skirt.

The motor has had nothing but Stihl Ultra Synthetic 2 cycle oil since it 1st came out (don't recall when), @ recommended 50:1, non alcohol premium gas only, always with Stabil additive.
The exhaust ports were complete open too, so I replaced the fuel intake filter and am now replacing the little fuel tank breather assembly - I wasn't aware of!

026!!

 

[U&A]

Here is a good post 2007 arborist site, yeah for sure the reason no more 30 to 1 was wait for it, our EPA. So yes my question was valid. I am surprised none of you guys new as you use 2 strokes more then myself. No hysteria, I was just curious because I had seen 30 - 1 prior. My guess most of you guys dont mess with pre mix'd.

Yah the EPA was the big push but luckily oils have kept up with it. I would not run 50:1 with a dyno tho.

 

[U&A]

Even though 4 bucks I think I just might pop on this. I have plenty of empty true fuel from last year, maybe just mix a gallon and refill those. Plenty cheaper.

I ran saber for a while. The packs are great man. Keep a few in the truck all the time. Never short on oil if your out and about and need some mix.