Tranny/engine issues when pulling a trailer

[Hatchet Man]

I'm hoping someone can help me sort this out and I'll try to be brief. We bought a 2015 RAM 2500 Outdoorsman (6.4 L Hemi) a little over a month ago. Since then, we've hooked up to our 26' travel trailer (bumper) and headed to the same spot in the mountains about an hour and a half away. Total load is guestimated at 7,500 lbs or less. Some hills are huge and steep (the Hemi screams up these, but can do the posted speed limit), others just normal and windy. About 45 minutes into the trip, the truck sounds like it goes into Limp Mode and stays in 4th gear and won't shift with the +/-, or if you shift into nuetral and back to drive. Doesn't matter if you lift your foot off the gas and mash the pedal back down or gently increase pedal pressure, stays around 2,500 rpm whether going uphill, downhill, or flat roadway. The sound from the engine sounds like a huge internal fan on the driver's side of the truck. The first time it did this, it lasted for about 5 minutes then somehow corrected itself as we went into a long straightaway.

The 2nd trip, we were not so lucky. It did the same thing on the same hill (and it isn't even the worst hill) and stayed that way until I made it to the next town. So it lasted about 20 minutes, finally had a shoulder to pull off safely and park. I let the truck rest for about 15 minutes then started it up and it was fine again.

So now the truck is at the same Dodge dealership we bought it from. The guy in the morning says that they replaced a solenoid in the transmission about a month before we bought it (note - the dealership did not give this info to CarFax and they never told us about it during the purchase process). He also says that the tranny fluid is now brown. He added that it is just under the 5-year drive terrain warranty and should be covered. The guy in the afternoon calls my wife and tells her that they ran a diagnostic check and everything is fine, but they recommend changing the tranny fluid and the total cost for the tranny fluid change and diagnostic check will be $400+. So the wife calls me, yells, and I call the afternoon guy. The afternoon guy tells me that the morning guy didn't say much, so he just recommends a fluid change. I asked him how a fluid change could correct what is happening and he didn't have an answer. I asked him if he knew about the recent solenoid replacement and he said yes, it was done right before we sold the truck to you guys. The afternoon guy hears my story about the 2 trips and says that he'll talk to his tech and call me back.

Any of you RAM veterans have an idea as to what is going on with the truck?

 

[csuder99]

It's too late now after the fact but if it happens again pull up the screen that shows all the different temperatures. The noise makes me think the fan is running full tilt and the transmission goes into over temp mode. Should throw a message though.

 

[RamCares]

I'm hoping someone can help me sort this out and I'll try to be brief. We bought a 2015 RAM 2500 Outdoorsman (6.4 L Hemi) a little over a month ago. Since then, we've hooked up to our 26' travel trailer (bumper) and headed to the same spot in the mountains about an hour and a half away. Total load is guestimated at 7,500 lbs or less. Some hills are huge and steep (the Hemi screams up these, but can do the posted speed limit), others just normal and windy. About 45 minutes into the trip, the truck sounds like it goes into Limp Mode and stays in 4th gear and won't shift with the +/-, or if you shift into nuetral and back to drive. Doesn't matter if you lift your foot off the gas and mash the pedal back down or gently increase pedal pressure, stays around 2,500 rpm whether going uphill, downhill, or flat roadway. The sound from the engine sounds like a huge internal fan on the driver's side of the truck. The first time it did this, it lasted for about 5 minutes then somehow corrected itself as we went into a long straightaway.

The 2nd trip, we were not so lucky. It did the same thing on the same hill (and it isn't even the worst hill) and stayed that way until I made it to the next town. So it lasted about 20 minutes, finally had a shoulder to pull off safely and park. I let the truck rest for about 15 minutes then started it up and it was fine again.

So now the truck is at the same Dodge dealership we bought it from. The guy in the morning says that they replaced a solenoid in the transmission about a month before we bought it (note - the dealership did not give this info to CarFax and they never told us about it during the purchase process). He also says that the tranny fluid is now brown. He added that it is just under the 5-year drive terrain warranty and should be covered. The guy in the afternoon calls my wife and tells her that they ran a diagnostic check and everything is fine, but they recommend changing the tranny fluid and the total cost for the tranny fluid change and diagnostic check will be $400+. So the wife calls me, yells, and I call the afternoon guy. The afternoon guy tells me that the morning guy didn't say much, so he just recommends a fluid change. I asked him how a fluid change could correct what is happening and he didn't have an answer. I asked him if he knew about the recent solenoid replacement and he said yes, it was done right before we sold the truck to you guys. The afternoon guy hears my story about the 2 trips and says that he'll talk to his tech and call me back.

Any of you RAM veterans have an idea as to what is going on with the truck?

I apologize for the trouble, @Hatchet Man. Please do not hesitate to follow up with our customer care team for further support in addressing the concerns that you are experiencing. You may call in at 866-726-4636 or submit your info here to receive an email follow up. https://bit.ly/3fy5Kfo

Mark
RamCares

 

[jejb]

Hopefully it's nothing seriously wrong on your new truck. But I think you need to find a different way to drive the truck. Don't let it scream the motor on long, steep hills. It's a gasser at altitude, so you need to adjust your expectations to what it can do. Try to hold a higher gear at lower revs and don't worry about keeping the speed limit. Or lower revs in the same gear. But keeping it pegged like that is going to be tough on the entire drive train.

 

[Hatchet Man]

Thanks for the replies. And I really appreciate the advice from @jejb -duly noted and I will put that logic to use as I am new to towing TTs.

Just wanted to follow-up this thread with what ended up happening.

The dealership eventually rebuilt the transmission and blamed the failure on the torque converter. Everything was covered by the original warranty that expires in a little over a month.

 

[gofishn]

They pretty much cit
Change fluid
slow down on hills
Do not overwork the truck. It ain't a Locomotive and even they slow down on hills.


Only thing I could aid is see about seperate oil and tranny fluid coolers, in addition to radiator, if not equipped.

 

[mtofell]

Any of you RAM veterans have an idea as to what is going on with the truck?

I'm not only a veteran of a Ram truck but a veteran of a failing tranny in my Ram truck. It's happened twice since I purchased (new in 2014). First time just failed for no reason under no load. Sitting on the freeway in stop/go traffic. I hit the gas, tack went up, I barely moved. This was at 38K and it was rebuilt under warranty.

Second time at 93K (now under extended warranty) I started to get a few hard shifts then into limp mode it goes. Just as your describe - 4th gear only. To the dealer for another rebuild. Get the truck back and 2 weeks later it fails again. Apparently, they didn't replace the valve body with the 2nd rebuild. So, they do that and I'm now at 100K and it is okay. Through the whole thing I never got the air noise you are describing, though.

The fact that the fluid is brown is a HUGE concern. Change the fluid and slow down? Ah, no.... that's not a "fix". These trucks are meant to run as hard as you can push them without burning the fluid in the tranny. If you notice, your tach has no redline.... that's because it's built-in. Basically, the truck won't let you hurt it. I'd be documenting everything at this point in preparation of getting warranty coverage after the time or miles go over since obviously the problem exists within the warranty period.

Unfortunately, Ram is horrible at repairing things under warranty. My previous two trucks were Ford and Chevy/GMC and it was night and day. Although I'm generally happy with my dealer through the whole thing, I've had to stay on them at times and fight a bit to keep from getting dicked around. I swear the service writer training manual states that if the truck moves and isn't on fire everything is, "operating as intended." (a favorite phrase of theirs).

 

[Firetruck41]

I guess my experience is different than some advice above. In previous trucks, if the trans temp is high, it has been better to run the engine at higher RPMs in a lower gear, it keeps the fan and water pump working at a high speed and cools the engine/trans, also you can keep the trans in that gear, so it isn't continually shifting up and down. These engines are meant to run at high RPM.

With brown trans fluid, I would definitely change it.

I haven't had any overheating or high trans temp in my Ram, so I don't have direct experience with the issue on the hemi.

 

[Hatchet Man]

I'm not only a veteran of a Ram truck but a veteran of a failing tranny in my Ram truck. It's happened twice since I purchased (new in 2014). Unfortunately, Ram is horrible at repairing things under warranty.

Glad to know I'm not alone on this.

Here are the GORY DETAILS -

They replaced all clutches, front pump assembly, valve body, torque converter, transmission oil cooler, cooler lines, and fresh fluid. They had the truck for 2 weeks and left it in their back lot where small exterior parts were stolen off my truck, but of course they said they don't know what happened (sigh). My wife and I used our lunch hour to transport the truck home, then rushed back to work.

I get home after work and immediately notice a big puddle of tranny fluid running down my driveway (slight incline). Looked underneath and saw it coming out of the pan fairly steady. It was leaking soo much fluid I jumped in and drove it right back to the dealership, got there 10 minutes before they closed. I was pretty furious and talked to the same service advisor who apologized and said they would take care of it first thing in the AM. Eventually got a ride back home and worked on cleaning the fluid stain off of my driveway for 3 hours with concrete cleaner and a power washer until it got dark out.

Next day, I get a call saying it's ready (right before they close). I get there right away and look underneath in my dress clothes before I take possession and see that black RTV is smeared everywhere, not kidding, it was all over everything. There was still ATF all over the undercarriage, so I told the service advisor they needed to clean it up because I can't tell if it's still leaking or not. I expected him to say come back tomorrow, but no - a guy runs out of the garage, takes the truck in for 5 minutes and returns it back. I creep under it again and it looks like he just shot brake cleaner around the pan and that was it. Service advisor swears I should have no more worries. We take it home.

The next day I get home from work and see some red drips on the ground near the front, but I had to go to work. At lunch I change clothes and crawl under there. Saw ATF fluid all over the area near the trans cooler and radiator, but the top access and bottom access have plastic covers and I didn't have time to get into that.

Finally got to my days off and take off the covers. Clean up all of the fluid and notice that the tech didn't even come close to tightening the top right bolt to the trans cooler, also, 2 lines coming out the bottom were not tight where the rubber meets the metal, so I clamped those on good and tightened the trans cooler bolt which made it fit flush with the radiator again. Removed all of the black silicon that was smeared "everywhere" that it didn't need to be. Gave the entire engine and undercarriage a good thorough detail and yes, I took plenty of before and after pics. While in the engine bay I find a rubber part laying on the cowl. I run the part number on the back through Google and it is the rubber insert that covers the little cubby on the dash, WTF? Sure enough, I look inside the truck and the insert is missing, so I put the insert back in.

Keeping my fingers crossed as I told my wife I don't want that dealership to touch the truck ever again, so hopefully no more leaks or issues. One more interesting thing. There is a sticker in the engine bay that says front driveshaft must be greased at each oil change. Took me a while to find the divot with the grease point because it was caked with dirt so the divot was flush with the rest of it. It was obvious that the dealership is not greasing this as required because the oil was (reportedly) changed a month before we bought the truck and that part looked as if it had NEVER been greased since it was new.

Pretty pathetic that dealerships want you to think that they are the pros when it comes to caring for your vehicle. I'm sure some dealerships have very good service departments, but not this particular one. I'm very disappointed in this whole experience, but thankful it was under the warranty dime instead of mine. I am by no means a mechanic, but I plan on doing all preventative maintenance and small repairs on this vehicle and my others from this point forward. It might take me 3x longer to do than them, but at least I will be able to sleep at night knowing that it's done correctly. Sorry for the Rant.

 

[Burla]

Most of those rtv sealants require a specific procedure, but it is hard for dealers to follow. The truck is in an engine bay, once you drop the pan you can't move the truck easily. And they do not want to button the truck up but leave no fluid in like you are supposed to do for 24 hours. If you do this 100 times many of those times some idiot would get in the truck and move it w/o fluid. So they put the fluid back early like some dumb *****. If done correctly the rtv should hold the pan and the liquid, and if a bolt or two isn't torqued you would never know.

I'm not even sure the black sealant is the correct sealant, the correct tranny sealant is orange in most cases. I would go to dealer and have them show you the tube. The bad news there is if they had it everywhere outside the pan, how confident are you non is inside the pan? If it's the wrong sealant, it might end up in the transmision if there is some. What a mess, those guys are incompetent.

 

[Burla]

I see they do have a black one for engine oil pans, but I think the orange is more correct for transmissions, whatever.

 

[Hatchet Man]

Last follow-up.

Well, the tranny rebuild did not fix the issue. We pulled the TT over a mountain pass a few weeks ago to camp with friends and the same thing happened, stuck in 4th gear (limp mode). After pulling over to stop and restart I decided not to use the tow/haul mode switch as I believe it may be defective. I used the manual buttons to downshift on our way down the pass so I didn't have to use the brakes too much and then in 3rd gear it sounded like clutch fan started up and that sucker is very LOUD (just another issue). Anyway, made it to our destination. On the way back I was determined not to use tow/haul, but there was still something definitely wrong with the engine/trans combo as climbing the pass it would shift from 1st (about 5500 rpm) to 2nd (about 2000 rpm) and stay at 2000 rpm no matter how much throttle given. I got passed up by everyone and everything including several big rigs.

Got back home, made an appt. with the dealer and discussed the issues and told them that I believe the tow/haul mode was faulty. They had the truck for a few days and said there was nothing wrong with it. I had enough of the BS. Traded the Outdoorsman for a 2020 2500 Hemi, dealer gave me the same price I paid for the Outdoorsman a few months prior so I was happy.

Moving on to 5th Gen. Thanks for the advice from the 4th Gen crowd and see you around.

 

[JohnnyMac]

Last follow-up.

Well, the tranny rebuild did not fix the issue. We pulled the TT over a mountain pass a few weeks ago to camp with friends and the same thing happened, stuck in 4th gear (limp mode). After pulling over to stop and restart I decided not to use the tow/haul mode switch as I believe it may be defective. I used the manual buttons to downshift on our way down the pass so I didn't have to use the brakes too much and then in 3rd gear it sounded like clutch fan started up and that sucker is very LOUD (just another issue). Anyway, made it to our destination. On the way back I was determined not to use tow/haul, but there was still something definitely wrong with the engine/trans combo as climbing the pass it would shift from 1st (about 5500 rpm) to 2nd (about 2000 rpm) and stay at 2000 rpm no matter how much throttle given. I got passed up by everyone and everything including several big rigs.

Got back home, made an appt. with the dealer and discussed the issues and told them that I believe the tow/haul mode was faulty. They had the truck for a few days and said there was nothing wrong with it. I had enough of the BS. Traded the Outdoorsman for a 2020 2500 Hemi, dealer gave me the same price I paid for the Outdoorsman a few months prior so I was happy.

Moving on to 5th Gen. Thanks for the advice from the 4th Gen crowd and see you around.

There's more than one way to skin a cat eh'. Congrats on the new rig. Make sure to post some pics. We like pics.

 

[Hatchet Man]

 

[jejb]

I'm a little surprised you didn't step up to the Cummins being you're towing often at altitude, but I sure hope the new truck works out for you.

 

[Hatchet Man]

I'm a little surprised you didn't step up to the Cummins being you're towing often at altitude, but I sure hope the new truck works out for you.

If I had $9K more, I definitely would have

 

[oldguy2]

I worked for a Chrysler dealership for 20 years and most dealerships really do try to do a good job. You must remember their prices have to reflect their high over head. When I first started out as a mechanic most dealerships were small and family owned but they were forced by the factory to either expand or sell out. Now the owner has little contact with the service dept. He depends on the service manager to keep it running smoothly. I'm sorry to say he is more interested in making money (his bonus) so he must get the cars out the door. If they come back he can try to charge you again. most techs are paid flat rate which means they get paid a set amount for each job no matter if it takes them an hour or 5 hours. There is no incentive to put everything back as long as the car runs. I worked as mechanic. parts manager and service manager and every body was rushed and speed was more important than doing the job right. Bringing back the small dealership would help because everyone knew you. Won't happen I know. One thing that really does help is tipping your mechanic when he does a good job. But wait until you know it was a good job. Even bringing in a bunch of cookies for the guys in the shop makes a big difference. You will be remembered.