CTD Flaw: Heater Grid Bolt

[Goose55]

This guy speaks of one of the flaws of the CTD, the "heater grid bolt" that rots, comes loose, goes down the intake into the # 6 cylinder and causes complete engine failure. Sounds like this is something I need to do a preventative intervention on. Looking for others to weigh in on this.....

If the video freezes, just click a few moments back on it, and it should be fine:

Ram 3500 6.7L Cummins Diesel (High Output) *Heavy Diesel Mechanic Review* | 3 Reasons Its the BEST

I Review a Ram 3500 6.7L Cummins HO Diesel engine and explain as a Diesel Mechanic why it is the best Diesel engine compared to 6.7L PowerStroke, 6.6L Durama...

youtu.be

 

[stevenP]

I have read some threads on here concerning this. I dont know that there is recall of any nature on it from FCA, is there? I had the relay recall, done earlier this year.

 

[Billet Bee]

I plan on replacing ours with the banks intake at some point, hopefully before the bolt or nut falls off

 

[Goose55]

I have read some threads on here concerning this. I dont know that there is recall of any nature on it from FCA, is there? I had the relay recall, done earlier this year.

No. No recall. Just something that is a real concern. I have a message out to Geno's Garage to see what they say.

 

[jejb]

I had the relay recall, done earlier this year.

That recall had nothing to do with the subject bolt.

 

[mtnrider]

Completely false info from that guy on what the actual issue is and he has no idea what he is talking about.

No offense but everyone of your posts lately is going down these conspiracy theory rabbit holes. Stop "looking" for issues with the CTD and just drive it....

Yes, the bolt "can" be an issue but the number of actual failures is minuet, the internet has blown this WAAAY out of proportion and looking to panic people, especially those that stand to profit from "solutions" (like deleting it).

The real issue is the bolt can come loose or was not tight from the factory, this in turn causes a poor electrical connection so when the grid heater turns on it will draw excess current and can basically arc or weld the nut until it melts and falls off. Again, Very very rare but it has happened.

The easy solution is to check the cable (wiggle it to see if it is loose) at every oil change. That will give you peace of mind that it is fine.

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[Scottly]

The easy solution is to check the cable (wiggle it to see if it is loose) at every oil change. That will give you peace of mind that it is fine.

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The alternative is to buy a "solution" from Banks, a guy who has made millions selling "solutions" to problems that don't exist. Kinda like that joke known as a Pedal Commander, that substitutes a different variable resistor for a quicker push of the accelerator, all while claiming performance gains that don't exist. If Banks could, he'd blow up the internet about bad valve stem caps and have a "solution" ready for the suckers to buy.

 

[Goose55]

Completely false info from that guy on what the actual issue is and he has no idea what he is talking about.

No offense but everyone of your posts lately is going down these conspiracy theory rabbit holes. Stop "looking" for issues with the CTD and just drive it....

Yes, the bolt "can" be an issue but the number of actual failures is minuet, the internet has blown this WAAAY out of proportion and looking to panic people, especially those that stand to profit from "solutions" (like deleting it).

The real issue is the bolt can come loose or was not tight from the factory, this in turn causes a poor electrical connection so when the grid heater turns on it will draw excess current and can basically arc or weld the nut until it melts and falls off. Again, Very very rare but it has happened.

The easy solution is to check the cable (wiggle it to see if it is loose) at every oil change. That will give you peace of mind that it is fine.

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Well, lets see where this conversation leads. As to whether or not the YouTuber knows what he is talking about, let's give that some time.

 

[JayLeonard]

I actually know of someone who had his engine taken out from that nut. Upstate NY near Potsdam where grid heater use is necessary.

 

[mtnrider]

Well, lets see where this conversation leads. As to whether or not the YouTuber knows what he is talking about, let's give that some time.

This has been beat to death on the Cummins/HD forums. What I said is the ground truth...

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[Goose55]

Sometimes, some people need to be ignored.

I am awaiting word back from Geno's Garage to see what they think of this issue. I will post their response.

 

[mtnrider]

Yeah like the guy in the video. Enjoy living in your paranoia though. The facts have been presented to you..

 

[2003F350]

Something to remember, is that generally speaking MOST people (arguably the vast majority) who are on a forum or in youtube comments for vehicles, have a problem and are either trying to fix it or are complaining about it.

For example, a LOT of people on this website have had their 6.4 and/or 5.7 Hemi MDS lifters fail and needed them replaced. Personally, I went 102k and never had an issue. If you went by this website, I'd be in the minority, BUT for the number of 6.4 and 5.7 Hemis on the road with MDS, the issue likely affects less than 5% of all engines, probably even lower than that (again, I do not know numbers on this).

Same with the 8-speed transmission. There are many on the forum who have had nothing but issues, and I think a couple have had several replaced. But in the real world, they are a minority, and a small one at that.

I'm not saying it isn't an issue, and that it isn't something that shouldn't be watched, BUT the vast majority of CTD's on the road will never experience this kind of failure. They are MUCH more likely to have a turbo issue or clog up the DPF than to fail due to this bolt.

 

[Goose55]

Something to remember, is that generally speaking MOST people (arguably the vast majority) who are on a forum or in youtube comments for vehicles, have a problem and are either trying to fix it or are complaining about it.

For example, a LOT of people on this website have had their 6.4 and/or 5.7 Hemi MDS lifters fail and needed them replaced. Personally, I went 102k and never had an issue. If you went by this website, I'd be in the minority, BUT for the number of 6.4 and 5.7 Hemis on the road with MDS, the issue likely affects less than 5% of all engines, probably even lower than that (again, I do not know numbers on this).

Same with the 8-speed transmission. There are many on the forum who have had nothing but issues, and I think a couple have had several replaced. But in the real world, they are a minority, and a small one at that.

I'm not saying it isn't an issue, and that it isn't something that shouldn't be watched, BUT the vast majority of CTD's on the road will never experience this kind of failure. They are MUCH more likely to have a turbo issue or clog up the DPF than to fail due to this bolt.

True. I always like to err on the side of caution. Kick the ball around a while to see if there is any reason for caution.

 

[G. Mcpherson]

Or if you live in a Mild Climate you can Disconnect the Power lead at the Battery Connection for the Relay. Passenger side.

 

[nlambert182]

This isn't a Powerstroke with glow plugs. If it were I'd say you have a reason for some concern. A couple model year PS had problems with the tips breaking off and falling onto the piston. I've seen firsthand the havoc that causes. But you're not... this is a CTD.

There's little reason for concern, but Gale Banks has made a career (and a fortune) out of convincing people that problems exist where they don't. Geno's is likely going to try to sell you a kit as well. Not that they're a bad vendor, but remember that they're in the business to sell stuff and they wouldn't offer a product that they didn't want to sell to someone.

The failure rate on the grid heater bolt is low enough not to spark a recall because it's not even remotely a common failure point. As many have said... do the wiggle test on occasion if you want to confirm that the wire is still tight.

If you live in a climate where the grid heater is seldom ever cycled (like Arizona) then the chance of it failing is even lower because it won't be used.

If you're always worried about something that could one day be a potential problem you'd have to park the truck. A "problem" can always be found if you're always looking. Drive the truck and keep the money in your pocket.

 

[BossHogg]

Or if you live in a Mild Climate you can Disconnect the Power lead at the Battery Connection for the Relay. Passenger side.

If my memory recall is correct, this will trigger a DTC and DIC light. I've never tried this but read this on the Cummins forum.

The grid heater bolt is something that owners need to be aware of and periodically do the "jiggle test". As mentioned, this issue happens to a very low percentage of Cummins engines and in my opinion, doesn't warrant a Bank solution. But if it happens to you, you are out the cost of an engine replacement. The jiggle test is the simplest solution to detect a pending issue.

The jiggle test;

RAM 2500 Cummins Grid Heater?

For those who are interested in disconnecting the grid heater, watch this. Performing the Jiggle test will ensure grid heater is not failing. See this vide...

www.youtube.com

 

[G. Mcpherson]

I have done this to a couple of trucks. Only once have had any code and was done with a remote start.

 

[Goose55]

Geno's Garage referred me to Black Market Performance and I heard back from them with this. BUT, I don't know what I am looking for. The third one looks good, according to the description. Would any of these be an upgrade to ward off any chance of that bolt deteriorating?......

https://blackmarketperformance.com/...7-cummins-intake-horn-emissions-present-07-18
This kit is our emissions present cast intake horn, option of the grid heater delete plate and the new heating element!


https://blackmarketperformance.com/...-6-7-cummins-intake-air-heater-relocation-kit
This kit is our relocation kit with the option on the grid heater delete plate. This kit is also emissions preset.


https://blackmarketperformance.com/...mp-6-7-cummins-ram-air-open-grid-plenum-plate
This is the ram air kit it is in no emissions and this kit will replace all the factory components from the intake plate, the intake horn and the heating element.

 

[mtnrider]

The bolt does not "deteriorate"

I'm sure they gave you all kinds of options, they want to make money after all..... But let me try and help you anyway.

The 3rd option you would have to tune and delete your truck so unless you want to go down that road you cannot do that one. (warranty will be gone by the way)

The first and second option would work if you add the open manifold to the kits, but again will void your warranty so keep that in mind if that is important to you.

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