New to Dodge, thinking about buying an older one.

[Area 51]

Hi, everyone. I'm the current owner of a 2002 GMC 2500HD Duramax. The engine needs work and I'm thinking about selling it and buying a Dodge Cummins, mainly for the simple engine - probably a 12-valve.
I'm currently looking at a 1995 2500 4WD, with the Cummins. What I'm wondering about is everything but the engine, mainly the chassis, suspension, brakes, transmission. The interior isn't my concern. I want something simple, reliable, but with more power than the stock 1995 Cummins. So, I'm thinking about a built engine, not a lot more powerful but more than stock.
Is the chassis adequate? When people add a lot more power, or even moderately more, do they stiffen the chassis? How? Who does that?
I suppose there are brake upgrades, maybe discs on the back, etc.
How much power can the transmission take, and the rear end?
Anything else you want to add or recommend would be appreciated.
Just trying to get informed here. I would be open to buying an early 2000's too, but want to stay away from smog equipment.

 

[rzr6-4]

Lol, you will need to drop 50k into the motor before stiffening the chassis even needs to cross your mind. But 12 valves are known for cheap and reliable power, you should be able to do some basic mods and not have any other concerns. Depending on how much power you add the first thing you kill will be the trans, so that my need an upgrade as well.

Brakes can be a good upgrade, depending on what you plan to do with it. If you want to build a fast vehicle and need to slow that speed, or plan to pull exceptionally heavy and need to stop that weight, then yes bigger brakes or a disk conversion could be good. If you plan to keep it 90% stock, just with a few extra hp for a little extra pep in it's step, brakes probly aren't a concern.

Buy one, make sure the steering is tight, the suspension rides good, and the brakes stop you as they should. If everything checks out and nothing pops up in the first 6 months then you start throwing fun money at whatever you think needs it most.

 

[Magfan2]

Buying an old truck is good fun bought a '79 near 20 years ago. When I sold it to a friend a few weeks ago, the maintenance and repair folder was more than an inch and a half thick. Served me wall, and good fun. Didn't have the heart to add up the bills - probably a wash with something much newer I'd have paid more for. Just bought a '14 Ram currently working through the dollars I got for the truck and a car I sold getting it the way I want it. So far, so good! Good luck with your "new" truck!

 

[Area 51]

Lol, you will need to drop 50k into the motor before stiffening the chassis even needs to cross your mind. But 12 valves are known for cheap and reliable power, you should be able to do some basic mods and not have any other concerns. Depending on how much power you add the first thing you kill will be the trans, so that my need an upgrade as well.

Brakes can be a good upgrade, depending on what you plan to do with it. If you want to build a fast vehicle and need to slow that speed, or plan to pull exceptionally heavy and need to stop that weight, then yes bigger brakes or a disk conversion could be good. If you plan to keep it 90% stock, just with a few extra hp for a little extra pep in it's step, brakes probly aren't a concern.

Buy one, make sure the steering is tight, the suspension rides good, and the brakes stop you as they should. If everything checks out and nothing pops up in the first 6 months then you start throwing fun money at whatever you think needs it most.

Yeah, LOL. That's what I was wondering. What you say about the transmission doesn't surprise me. I was thinking that was probably the most sure thing to change. From what I've read, another would be the steering/suspension. It's important to me that it drives as well as possible.
That's a relief about the chassis. Thanks. I didn't want to get a pickup that was a flimsy platform. I probably won't tow more than 12,000 pounds (and rarely), so I should be okay, right?

 

[rzr6-4]

I probably won't tow more than 12,000 pounds (and rarely), so I should be okay, right?

I won't say yes as it will depend on the exact payload of your truck and your trailer set up but it's "doable".

 

[Dean2]

I have a 1996 2500 with the V10; it puts out 300 HP at 4100 rpm and 450 FT LBS of torque at 2400 rpm. Far more than the Cummins of the same year and a lot better motor for towing than the old Cummins was. They are however hard on fuel. It also has the same transmission as the Cummins and so far, no issues with the transmission and I have 260,000 Klms on it. Further, the 3500 and 2500 have the same chassis and most everything else, only difference was the rear springs if I remember right.

We used the V10s in a lot of hotshot trucks in the patch. It was nothing to see them still running fine with 800,000 klms on them (500,000 miles). Most had no engine work, maybe one transmission and 3 or 4 front end rebuilds in those miles. The front ends were definitely the weak spot on vehicles that did a lot of rough road 2 lane paved, and gravel roads. I rebuilt my full front end at 235,000 klms.

Picture from this summer. It has original factory paint and no lifts or engine modifications.



A few Hunting seasons ago.

 

[Area 51]

I've narrowed down my main question. I've decided this is the truck I want, the 1995 in the OP.
I have one sticking point though, the transmission. I definitely will be upping the power of the engine, probably in the range of 350 to 450 HP. It currently has a 47RH auto.
So, since there is no ECU and the current transmission is hydraulicly controlled, what are my transmission options for a swap? Am I correct that all the later transmissions, the electronically controlled ones, will not work in this truck? Like, for example, an Allison 1000 can't be converted to run in a non-electronic truck of the 1995 vintage?
If that's correct, my only options would be a built 47RH or a conversion to manual, is that correct? If I can't have a six-speed auto, I'd rather have a 6-speed manual than a 4-speed auto.
If I have all of that correct, I'd be smart to buy a truck from this year that already has a manual stock. But this truck has everything I want, including being red, regular cab, long bed, and it's in good condition. I'm stuck on this transmission issue. Help.
I spent a lot of time searching Allison swaps, and other swaps, but no one I've found has any kit for a newer electronic transmission into these older gen two trucks.

 

[Grams]

Keep it original. It’ll be worth more in the long run.

 

[Area 51]

It's too slow. A few hundred, or even thousand, dollars loss in value years from now due to a non-stock transmission isn't a concern of mine. I'm tempted to up the power but just keep the transmission it has and cross my fingers it lasts, but what if I drive to Alaska? I want this thing to be reliable. And I don't want to spend big bucks on a built 47HE because it would still be just four speeds, with the gap.

Now I found this, the NV5000, a redesigned NV4500. This would be good but while the HP rating is 500, the torque rating is only 500 lb-ft, and I'm sure I will be well over that with planned engine mods.

NV5000 Transmission, Direct Replacement for Dodge NV4500

Upgrade your Dodge NV4500 transmission with the new NV5000. This is a direct replacement for the Dodge Ram 2500, 3500, 4X4, 1994 to 2004.

spprecision.com

What I really need is a modern automatic that can handle 800 lb-ft but will work without electronics. Is this a pipe dream?

 

[Area 51]

Man, I just can't win. Found this in another forum.

 

[Area 51]

The G56 has a torque rating of 600 lb-ft. Maybe I could live with that. The NV5600 appears to be rated at 700 ft-lb, but I have no idea how hard the conversion would be for either of those. The bigger issue with these transmissions appears to be the clutch. That would need an upgrade. Shaft size too, sometimes.
Chime in if you have something to say.

 

[Dean2]

I've narrowed down my main question. I've decided this is the truck I want, the 1995 in the OP.
I have one sticking point though, the transmission. I definitely will be upping the power of the engine, probably in the range of 350 to 450 HP. It currently has a 47RH auto.
So, since there is no ECU and the current transmission is hydraulicly controlled, what are my transmission options for a swap? Am I correct that all the later transmissions, the electronically controlled ones, will not work in this truck? Like, for example, an Allison 1000 can't be converted to run in a non-electronic truck of the 1995 vintage?
If that's correct, my only options would be a built 47RH or a conversion to manual, is that correct? If I can't have a six-speed auto, I'd rather have a 6-speed manual than a 4-speed auto.
If I have all of that correct, I'd be smart to buy a truck from this year that already has a manual stock. But this truck has everything I want, including being red, regular cab, long bed, and it's in good condition. I'm stuck on this transmission issue. Help.
I spent a lot of time searching Allison swaps, and other swaps, but no one I've found has any kit for a newer electronic transmission into these older gen two trucks.

Did you read what I wrote. The V10 used the same 4 speed automatic transmission and put out the power and torque you are targeting. Rebuilding a transmission every 200,000 miles should not be a big deal. Small potatoes in the overall scheme of things. The standard transmission and clutch on the diesel needed work more often than the automatics did.

 

[Grams]

I believe it was in the late-70s/early-80’s that automatic transmissions over-took manuals as the most durable transmissions for towing purposes. It was about that time-frame that “Towing” packages included automatics and manuals were not offered with tow-pkgs. (I was a Ford owner at that time…but that’s the way I remember it.)

 

[alohapili]

I bought an older diesel 2nd gen 2 years ago and haven't regretted it yet. It's big, slow and has 6 seats.

I had to give up the 4wd for one that had 55k miles, and paid more than I should have for a 1997 vehicle. The electronics have been the most problematic, with the original radio and power window buttons being the biggest repair yet.

I have a history of driving my vehicles 20+ years each and never expect or want the latest tech in them. I work on software all day long... the last thing I want to do in my free time is deal with automotive software and tech. Ironic, I know...

 

[Yardbird]

I've had my '94 2500 V-10 with the 45RH for 18 years. Used it to pull a car trailer when I owned a car lot.

Problems I found. Dash cracks. I still have a new in box factory dash I bought many years ago to replace what's left of the original.

The steering box will wear out the bushing where the shaft exits the box to the pittman arm, causing play in the steering. I bought a kit off Ebay that runs a steel beam frame to frame, with a pillow block bearing that locks the shaft in place to stop the play.

I am having a problem with loading up at idle when hot. I haven't really went deep trying to fix it yet. I figure it's either the fuel pump regulator putting out too much pressure, or upper intake gaskets.

I really like this truck. Don't drive it much though since I bought the 2018 1500.

 

[Area 51]

Did you read what I wrote. The V10 used the same 4 speed automatic transmission and put out the power and torque you are targeting. Rebuilding a transmission every 200,000 miles should not be a big deal. Small potatoes in the overall scheme of things. The standard transmission and clutch on the diesel needed work more often than the automatics did.

Yes, I did. I'm going to leave the drivetrain alone, for now. After digging into a plan/prices, etc. I'm focused on the steering and interior. The engine runs great and no blowby or smoke. I think the P-pump may be altered too because it goes surprisingly well.
I did discover, however, that CA Conversions can put an Allison into this truck. If I ever rob a bank, I may do that.
The truck wanders around on anything but perfect pavement. I ordered all the rods, joints, and one of those heavy duty PSC steering boxes. Crawling under it, it was obvious the steering box was loosie goosie. Thanks for you help. Happy hunting.

 

[Area 51]

I believe it was in the late-70s/early-80’s that automatic transmissions over-took manuals as the most durable transmissions for towing purposes. It was about that time-frame that “Towing” packages included automatics and manuals were not offered with tow-pkgs. (I was a Ford owner at that time…but that’s the way I remember it.)

Listening to the guys at Power Driven Diesel, I gleaned the same info. Stock autos hold up better than the stock manuals, unless you go to something newer, such as the G56. I'm not exactly happy about having only four speeds though.

 

[Dean2]

Check out the Borgeson steering shaft. I replaced that shaft on my 96 and it made a huge difference in getting rid on play in the steering. Also, before you replace the steering box, check and see if it just needs the nut tightened up.

This is a 2012 but they are nearly the same. You can probably find yt for your year if you search. The 1996 boxes are actually easier to adjust and you can get at them from underneath quite easily.

tighten ram 2500 steering box at DuckDuckGo

DuckDuckGo. Privacy, Simplified.

duckduckgo.com

 

[Area 51]

I bought an older diesel 2nd gen 2 years ago and haven't regretted it yet. It's big, slow and has 6 seats.

I had to give up the 4wd for one that had 55k miles, and paid more than I should have for a 1997 vehicle. The electronics have been the most problematic, with the original radio and power window buttons being the biggest repair yet.

I have a history of driving my vehicles 20+ years each and never expect or want the latest tech in them. I work on software all day long... the last thing I want to do in my free time is deal with automotive software and tech. Ironic, I know...

These old Cummins RAMs are a visceral experience, for sure. This truck isn't a daily driver, so I can put up with all the racket. If I ever figure out how to get pics from my phone to my computer, I'll post a couple.

I have to say though, since I also have a '02 GMC Duramax, that truck is better than this Dodge in every way...except for changing those damned LB7 injectors and the possibility of sheering a crank pin. Nowadays, when you get a rebuilt older Duramax, you get a keyway machined into the crank and camshaft, so your gears don't spin.
The steering, brakes and interior of the Dodge suck. But hey, I love it still.

 

[Area 51]

Check out the Borgeson steering shaft. I replaced that shaft on my 96 and it made a huge difference in getting rid on play in the steering. Also, before you replace the steering box, check and see if it just needs the nut tightened up.

This is a 2012 but they are nearly the same. You can probably find yt for your year if you search.

tighten ram 2500 steering box at DuckDuckGo

DuckDuckGo. Privacy, Simplified.

duckduckgo.com

I already ordered the box. I want something better than the stock box.
I also have a Borgeson shaft coming. Synergy rods. Thurin anti-roll bar. Someday I may go for Carli springs too, because it rides like a rock. I'm spending all of my retirement money on this truck.

Here's a question for you experts:
Is it possible to tell if the killer dowl pin has been secured without removing the front cover? I thought maybe they could use a bore scope to peer inside.