what do these #s mean for oil

Oh brother......sorry I got this thread started!. i got a ways to go before i really need a oil change though. So, Ill let you guys battle it out

It's pretty easy, use recommended oil that meets weight requirement and spec. Unfortunately Penzoil is the only one that meets spec at the moment. I have heard that Amsoil has an oil that has now met the spec but haven't verified personally.

cc rider said:

Oh brother......sorry I got this thread started!. i got a ways to go before i really need a oil change though. So, Ill let you guys battle it out

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Not a battle, just conversation. What would be the fun of a forum if there wasn't differing thoughts on a subject matter. Anyways Pennzoil platinum doesn't seem to be a bad choice of oil. I will be switching to Pennzoil platinum in my wife's car. Apparently it handles fuel dilution of the oil better than mobile 1, according to multiple oil analyses for that engine. Her car has direct injection, so gas in the oil is simply just gonna happen with that motor.


Back to my original comment about them not being able to void the warranty. Basis for my reply: According to my understanding of the Magnusson- Moss warranty act. If Pennzoil platinum/mopar is the only oil that can be used without voiding the warranty, then it must be provided free of charge (they certainly aren't giving away free oil). It also states that they must prove that the aftermarket product you used caused the damage. So therefore they can't void your warranty just because you used a different oil, unless damage was caused and they can prove the oil was the cause.
A lot of times these oil specs change simply to meet government standards/regulations/emissions or even better marketing/money. In my other ride spec calls for a totally different oil spec and weight than the previous year model. Even though it's the exact same engine with no changes other than the oil used.

With that in mind using the wrong weight can sometimes cause issues. Like with the hemi MDS, using different than spec viscosity can sometimes cause it to not function properly.

Also from the limited research I've done, Rams main reason for using Pennzoil (besides marketing), is because they feel it keeps the engine cleaner so as to maintain peak performance.


To sum it up. Use the oil you feel comfortable with. Sticking with the factory recommended oil is certainly the best choice if your worried about warranty concerns. And if the oil is hard to get in your area, there's always the Internet/amazon etc.

Squidbilly said:

Back to my original comment about them not being able to void the warranty. Basis for my reply: According to my understanding of the Magnusson- Moss warranty act. If Pennzoil platinum/mopar is the only oil that can be used without voiding the warranty, then it must be provided free of charge (they certainly aren't giving away free oil). It also states that they must prove that the aftermarket product you used caused the damage. So therefore they can't void your warranty just because you used a different oil, unless damage was caused and they can prove the oil was the cause.

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No, they do not say that the Penzoil or Mopar oil is the only oil that can be used. It says that they recommend the Penzoil/Mopar but whatever oil you use has to meet the Chryler MS-12633 standard. Per the Magnusson-Moss Act, if they tell you to use a specific brand then it has to be free, but they can tell you that whatever you use has to meet a certain spec without having to give it to you for free. This is where they got you because currently only the Penzoil/Mopar oil meets that spec from my understanding.

Also, proving or saying that the wrong spec oil caused the damage is relatively easy for a manufacturer to do since they already have the means to do so and they already have lawyers on the payroll. If you went to court on an internal engine failere and they show that the failure was because you did not use the oil spec they told you to use then you would not have a leg to stand on. In that case you would have spend the money to prove their findings incorrect. Most of the time, the cost of of proving them incorrect is more than the amount you are trying to get warranted so it is pointless to take it that far.

Amsoil AZF also meets the MS-12633 Specification.

tjfdesmo said:

Amsoil AZF also meets the MS-12633 Specification.

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You are correct, the Amsoil AZF 0w40 meets the MS-12633 spec.

AMSOIL Signature Series 0W-40 Synthetic Motor Oil

So is that the only two? Does anyone else know of more?

SouthTexan said:

Per the Magnusson-Moss Act, if they tell you to use a specific brand then it has to be free, but they can tell you that whatever you use has to meet a certain spec without having to give it to you for free. This is where they got you because currently only the Penzoil/Mopar oil meets that spec from my understanding.

Also, proving or saying that the wrong spec oil caused the damage is relatively easy for a manufacturer to do since they already have the means to do so and they already have lawyers on the payroll.

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That's kinda my point though, lol . In essence, if Mopar/Pennzoil is the only oil that meets the specs, then they are in fact telling you that you have to use a certain brand.

Also, just because they have the "means and lawyers" doesn't necessitate as "proof". If that were true, then that basically means big corps can do whatever they want without having to worry about any kind of litigation....... Cuz dey got da powaaaaa.

Like I said earlier, this oil spec is more than likely just marketting fluff and/or an exclusivity agreement between them and Pennzoil. And judging from the direction Ram is now taking concerning aftermarket parts, headlights, foglights, mirrors, etc) which they are trying to prevent them from being made. As well as how much of a pain in the butt it is to add OEM parts, which require you to pay extra money to flash the computer. Just further reinforces my opinion that it's about the Money$$$$$, yeah boyeeee!

Anyways, I'm sure it won't matter very long. There is probably oil already in the market that performs just as good if not better, just gotta wait for them to slap on the spec number.


This is good conversation though. Totally bored right now. Guess I could go cut down some of my bad trees, but dang it feels so hot out today.

Squidbilly said:

That's kinda my point though, lol . In essence, if Mopar/Pennzoil is the only oil that meets the specs, then they are in fact telling you that you have to use a certain brand.

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Even though currently only Pennzoil(and Amsoil) are the only ones meeting that spec, by law they are still not telling the exact oil to use. They are just telling you what spec to use. It is no different than a manufacturer telling you to a certain oil grade or a certain micron of filter to use.

I know when I was at Cummins, we had some people try to sue us over fuel system issues. In almost all cases the customers deviated from the fuel filter micron spec to save money on cheap fuel filters. Where the micron spec was say 3 micron, they were using a filter that was 10 micron because it was cheaper. They tried to come after us even though it was them that made the decision to "save money" by buying filters that did not meet spec. As you can guess they did not win.

Squidbilly said:

Also, just because they have the "means and lawyers" doesn't necessitate as "proof". If that were true, then that basically means big corps can do whatever they want without having to worry about any kind of litigation....... Cuz dey got da powaaaaa.

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What I meant by that is that they do not really have to spend any extra money since they already have the equipment to prove those who use the wrong oil wrong and they already have the lawyers. They don't have to spend any extra money on it versus the consumer. If it goes to court and they use their already owned equipment to show that the wrong spec of oil was the cause then it is now your job to prove them wrong to win your case. To do that you will need to spend money on lawyers and professionals with the proper equipment to prove them wrong. A lot of times this cost exceeds whatever you will win.

Squidbilly said:

Like I said earlier, this oil spec is more than likely just marketting fluff and/or an exclusivity agreement between them and Pennzoil.....

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In some cases it may be marketing fluff and in others it may not be. The main reason why most have these requirements has a lot to do with warranty. When you offer a longer warranty, you want to be sure that whatever the customer puts in or on the engine will not cause it to fail in the warranty peroid. As is shown in this thread, many consumers are all about saving a buck. If they will not follow requirements to save a dollar then you better believe they will try to blame it on the manufacturer if it breaks in the warranty peroid even though it is the consumers fault. All these requirements do is ensure that if the consumer does decide to do something that might harm the engine to save a buck, then the manufacturer has an out and does not have to pay for it. Thank lawyers, consumer demand for longer warranties, consumers that do not want to take responsibility for their actions of not following the written maintenance spec or intervals.

Squidbilly said:

Anyways, I'm sure it won't matter very long. There is probably oil already in the market that performs just as good if not better, just gotta wait for them to slap on the spec number.

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There may very well be other oils that are better or will meet the requirements and I don't disagree there. However, Chryler does not want to go out and test every oil on the market to see. So how it works is that they use a standard, and those in the market can choose to follow that standard or not. Although I do know that the use of the thinner at colder temp grade oils has a lot to do with the MDS and the infamous Hemi tick on the valves and lifters.