2013 Rear Ends

[smiley]

Well if you were right and it was switch to ZF then why would older Rams be in the recall? My truck has corp 9.25 and is included in the recall. The title says 2013 Rear end but the recall for pinion nut is on the older style rear end to my knowledge so what you might have is two separate issues and you are blending them together. There is nothing wrong with the axles just the pinion nut unless the nut comes loose or off and destroys the whole assembly.


$miley

 

[loveracing1988]

Well if you were right and it was switch to ZF then why would older Rams be in the recall? My truck has corp 9.25 and is included in the recall. The title says 2013 Rear end but the recall for pinion nut is on the older style rear end to my knowledge so what you might have is two separate issues and you are blending them together. There is nothing wrong with the axles just the pinion nut unless the nut comes loose or off and destroys the whole assembly.


$miley

2011 to 2013 at least are New ZF gears in the same housing that they have had since 2009. The changeover might have happened in 2010 however. Think about it this way, if all it was was just a missing part of adhesive, wouldn't they have a fix to the dealers by now? What is taking so long? How many times in the history of axles has there been a problem with pinion nuts backing off of a stock truck? Maybe one every once in a while, but not near as often as this.

 

[JimE]

Your problem is your suspension, if it weren't for the multi link you would be fine getting a different axle. That and the width. The Ram HDs use a axle from a different manufacturer also that don't have any of these problems.

Nope, the problem was/is not the suspension. It is confirmed by the Dealer's Service Manager to be either the Pinion Gear preset and/or bad pinion bearings. I suspect the latter would be most unusual to occur within 7,000 miles unless there is a machining problem with the Pinion Gear itself or the housing it goes into. On this particular RAM 2500 HD the rear axle was produced by Dana Corporation and most likely the ring and pinion gears, if not the entire axle, were produced in China via Dana's partnership with Dongfeng known as Dongfeng Dana Axle Co. The axle itself is very similar to those supplied to Ford by Dana's Spicer Division.

Our plan is to attempt to adjust the Pinion Gear preset, if that doesn't fix it then the Pinion Bearings will be replaced. Whether either will fix the problem won't be known until the work is done about ten days from now. Why ten days from now, it's not an emergency repair at this point and the Dealership axle tech is going to be in school all next week getting brought on board for the 2014 models.

 

[loveracing1988]

Nope, the problem was/is not the suspension. It is confirmed by the Dealer's Service Manager to be either the Pinion Gear preset and/or bad pinion bearings. I suspect the latter would be most unusual to occur within 7,000 miles unless there is a machining problem with the Pinion Gear itself or the housing it goes into. On this particular RAM 2500 HD the rear axle was produced by Dana Corporation and most likely the ring and pinion gears, if not the entire axle, were produced in China via Dana's partnership with Dongfeng known as Dongfeng Dana Axle Co. The axle itself is very similar to those supplied to Ford by Dana's Spicer Division.

Our plan is to attempt to adjust the Pinion Gear preset, if that doesn't fix it then the Pinion Bearings will be replaced. Whether either will fix the problem won't be known until the work is done about ten days from now. Why ten days from now, it's not an emergency repair at this point and the Dealership axle tech is going to be in school all next week getting brought on board for the 2014 models.

I mean swapping axles your problem will be your suspension. What year is the axle from the 2500 HD? If the preset is off I'm decently sure your bearings are going to be shot anyways. If the nut backed off I would be wanting a new gearset and bearing anyways but that is just me.

 

[JimE]

I mean swapping axles your problem will be your suspension. What year is the axle from the 2500 HD? If the preset is off I'm decently sure your bearings are going to be shot anyways. If the nut backed off I would be wanting a new gearset and bearing anyways but that is just me.

Not going to be even be considering swapping the axles at this point since I now know it is basically the same Dana/Spicer axle used in Fords. Also, suspension is not an issue. I'm going to guess that the real problem may be Pinion Gear machining, but no way of knowing that without doing some measurements with the gear out of the pumpkin to see if that is indeed the problem. It's a warranty issue as far as I'm concerned right now and while I agree there may already be some damage done to the gears I'll let the dealer address the issue pretty much as I would address it and if the fixes don't work, then it's time to go to the next step of new gears and/or a new complete axle should the issue actually be in the machining of the housing itself. I've seen that be the case in years passed where the machining was off 1/64th of an inch which eventually took out the gear set and bearings. Of course the problem could also be with the Pinion shaft being just a hair undersized. Accumulated machining tolerances can be a *****. Things intended to mate, each having the same acceptable tolerance spectrum, might actually not work as intended when both are on the extreme of either end of the allowable tolerance range.

 

[Etroze86]

Even after the gearset is adjusted won't it still whine with small amount of damage it has done?

 

[JimE]

Even after the gearset is adjusted won't it still whine with small amount of damage it has done?

Not necessarily, though the likelihood is it might. One of those things we'll just have to wait and see. It's their nickle so to speak, so if they want to try the hopefully quick and cheap fixes I'm game. If it doesn't workout that way it then we go to my becoming very insistent the whole darn axle be replaced, unless they want to get into checking the tolerances on all parts concerned verses specs.

 

[Etroze86]

I bet they replace the whole axle or the tech will recommend that. It will take to much time to messure tolerances and he will only be getting paid warranty labor.

 

[JimE]

I bet they replace the whole axle or the tech will recommend that. It will take to much time to messure tolerances and he will only be getting paid warranty labor.

You might be right, especially when Chrysler requires that a vehicle repaired under warranty be test driven for 50 minutes. Test drive to be inclusive varying driving circumstances by dealer personnel following the repair. Seems like a bit of an overkill. though being a way to some degree prevent shoddy work and Chrysler having to pay for the same warranty job again.

 

[loveracing1988]

Not going to be even be considering swapping the axles at this point since I now know it is basically the same Dana/Spicer axle used in Fords. Also, suspension is not an issue. I'm going to guess that the real problem may be Pinion Gear machining, but no way of knowing that without doing some measurements with the gear out of the pumpkin to see if that is indeed the problem. It's a warranty issue as far as I'm concerned right now and while I agree there may already be some damage done to the gears I'll let the dealer address the issue pretty much as I would address it and if the fixes don't work, then it's time to go to the next step of new gears and/or a new complete axle should the issue actually be in the machining of the housing itself. I've seen that be the case in years passed where the machining was off 1/64th of an inch which eventually took out the gear set and bearings. Of course the problem could also be with the Pinion shaft being just a hair undersized. Accumulated machining tolerances can be a *****. Things intended to mate, each having the same acceptable tolerance spectrum, might actually not work as intended when both are on the extreme of either end of the allowable tolerance range.

I'm still curious, what year was the 2500 axle you were speaking of?

 

[JimE]

I'm still curious, what year was the 2500 axle you were speaking of?

Thought I had said it is a 2012 2500 HD with the austere SL interior trim. Basically just a serious work truck with the chrome option and optional metallic paint job (aka Pearl finishes). It's a weird special order that someone failed to take. I would have not gone looking for a truck the way this one was ordered, but the deal I got on it was just too good to pass up and for my usage I don't give a flip about all the crap associated with Uconnect. Picked it up for less than a dealer would normally give one bringing it in for a trade-in against a new truck purchase.

As addition axle comments, while I was at the Dealership this morning I looked into the service area and there was a Generation 4 Ram 1500 4X4 sitting in one of the bays with a brand new front axle assembly waiting to replace the original. The truck did not appear to have been used off road much if any at all. Didn't appear to have any mods of any nature. not sure what year it was.

 

[loveracing1988]

Thought I had said it is a 2012 2500 HD with the austere SL interior trim. Basically just a serious work truck with the chrome option and optional metallic paint job (aka Pearl finishes). It's a weird special order that someone failed to take. I would have not gone looking for a truck the way this one was ordered, but the deal I got on it was just too good to pass up and for my usage I don't give a flip about all the crap associated with Uconnect. Picked it up for less than a dealer would normally give one bringing it in for a trade-in against a new truck purchase.

That is definitely not a dana axle then. That is a AAM axle. Assuming it is a hemi that would be a 10.5" ring gear also, not a 9.25".

 

[JimE]

That is definitely not a dana axle then. That is a AAM axle. Assuming it is a hemi that would be a 10.5" ring gear also, not a 9.25".

Who said anything about a 9.25"? It may come as a shock to you but just about everybody and their dog in the axle business makes differentials with 10.5" ring gears, just as several of them produce 4.10:1 gear sets with 10.5" ring gears. AAM does indeed produce after market axles that fit various RAM trucks, whether they were actually a primary vendor to RAM assembly plants for 2012 may be questionable. What is fact is an AAM 11.5" rear axle is scheduled to be in 2014 RAM 2500 and 3500 trucks. In the case of the truck in question the identity of the axle was given by the Service Manager of the Dealership who has a several decades run with Chrysler/RAM dealers. I presume he has some level of expertise and understanding of rear axles used on RAM trucks. For all I know it could be a Ford Sterling or of other manufacture but I personally have not had the inclination to crawl under the truck and look at the tag mainly because I just don't give a rats at this point given the circumstance is a warranty issue.

 

[smiley]

I think he is getting confused because some of us are talking about older 4th gens, some are talking about 1500's and others 2500's because the title is simply 2013 rear ends and the pinion nut recall was brought up. The corp 9.25 is the one with majority of pinion nut issues if not all I am not sure. The ZF one seems to have had other recalls like the fill hole ordeal. I don't know the the 10.5 has had recalls or not since I don't have one can't speak from my experience either.

 

[loveracing1988]

Who said anything about a 9.25"? It may come as a shock to you but just about everybody and their dog in the axle business makes differentials with 10.5" ring gears, just as several of them produce 4.10:1 gear sets with 10.5" ring gears. AAM does indeed produce after market axles that fit various RAM trucks, whether they were actually a primary vendor to RAM assembly plants for 2012 may be questionable. What is fact is an AAM 11.5" rear axle is scheduled to be in 2014 RAM 2500 and 3500 trucks. In the case of the truck in question the identity of the axle was given by the Service Manager of the Dealership who has a several decades run with Chrysler/RAM dealers. I presume he has some level of expertise and understanding of rear axles used on RAM trucks. For all I know it could be a Ford Sterling or of other manufacture but I personally have not had the inclination to crawl under the truck and look at the tag mainly because I just don't give a rats at this point given the circumstance is a warranty issue.

Ok, I must have misunderstood your first comment then, I thought you said you were going to replace the rear axle on a 1500 with a axle from a 2500... Either way, AAM is the only supplier for front and rear axles for the ram HDs from the factory. Dana hasn't supplied axles to dodge in years, maybe in their commercial line above the 3500 but not for the 2500 or 3500.

 

[scott lass 18]

so mine came with 3.1 and change to 9.23 ring and pinon now fail test nut bad at 50 lbs and I m stuck paying bill sucks wasnt 2010 1500 offered 3.55 and 3.92 rear end ! so whats the best cheapest 300.00 ring set ? dont have there 700.00 price dodge !