Is this a lemon?

[Mkarban]

Reaching out for thoughts.
Originally was looking for a TRX 1.5yrs ago. Nothing available, so I purchased a 2022 blacked out Limited 1500 etorq. Loved it for the 1st year.
At year one mark, engine failed, never told why but was left stranded in the worst MN snowstorm in yrs. Was left stranded on way to be airport missing international flight. Took 4 days for Ram Care to even get it towed!
They had my truck in the shop for 30 days, finally returned it with new engine after much frustration. By this time my warranty is up by mileage, but luckily I bought a 150,000 mile warranty. Shortly after this engine replacement I get warnings on app stating engine malfunction, however dealer can’t help me for a month. I’m at about 40,000 miles on odometer at this point. Finally get in and need another month for a part. They keep my truck for this past full week, no loaner and tell me they need to replace PCM, seems electrical, but they swap PCM and still not helping. They finally say it was simply a loose wire somewhere, no explanation?
While truck is in the shop I ask sales to consider a trade in for a TRX they have on the lot but dealer has no interest in taking my truck for a trade in, they won’t even return calls for a trade in offer and then threw out a number of $40,000!!!! Granted, sticker was $82,000 just 1.5yrs ago???? To add, once I get the truck back yesterday, I now have the dreaded hard downshift issue that others talk about. It’s borderline unsafe to drive as it has jerky hard downshifts from 3-2-1. I won’t even let my kids drive it because it feels unsafe, can’t imagine how fun that will be in icy conditions.
I contacted Ram Care and they haven’t returned a call from a specialist in a week. I’ve asked them to consider a buy back, at least at fair market value to get me out of this truck. I clearly can’t sell it outright with its history. I have no recourse other than keep it for the 150,000 warranty I have. I just feel Ram should help me out in some form. I’ll happily get into the TRX they have on the lot. I just think I’m stuck with a dreaded COVID production lemon.
My question is: when do I contact a lawyer and what other options do I have? Ram Care is clearly not concerned.
It’s unfortunate because I really liked the truck for the first year.

 

[DanAR]

I’m not sure it’s time quite yet to go full blown legal on them but it might be getting close to time to do a initial consultation with a lawyer and let them advise you how to prepare at this point. In other words, plan the battlefield if RAM doesn’t step up and take care of the unresolved issues in a reasonable manner and timeframe. Many attorneys will do an initial consultation for nothing or a small fee and advise you on how best to organize and prepare your case in the event it becomes necessary. But, I’m not a lawyer.

 

[stevenP]

Yours is one those stories I read that makes me cringe. Luckily I have never been faced with a situation like yours. I am surprised you would consider buying yet another FCA truck.

 

[chri5k]

MN Lemmon Law https://www.ag.state.mn.us/consumer/handbooks/mncarlaws/CH1.asp

Before seeing an attorney, I would organize all the information into a timeline. Supply only relevant facts. Dates, times, repair orders or any other written material pertinent to the repairs. You don't want to pay an attorney or para-legal to try to organize all that material.

 

[jejb]

Yes, it's a lemon.

I went through this process while I lived in MN. You will most likely have to go through a mediation process first. I thought that would be a waste of time, but was legally bound to do it. Worked well. They found in my favor and I got all my money back, including tax/plates, minus a small deductible for miles. The truck was a year old with about 12K on it.

If I were in your shoes, I'd for sure go for mediation and then LL if mediation does not go your way. My problems were not nearly as severe as yours. Get all your service records and any correspondence.

 

[aces-n-eights]

I agree with chri5k - document everything. If it's not working properly take it to the dealership and have them fix it... and document their efforts.

 

[Scottly]

My question is: when do I contact a lawyer and what other options do I have?

Call one now and ignore the advice you get on the interwebs. MN is a very consumer-friendly state.

 

[pacofortacos]

I don't know if yours will qualify under the lemon law - unless the 30 days part keeps you in.

The shifting should improve with driving time or take it in and have them do the trans relearn procedure and test drive it.

 

[chopperman1]

Way too much "filler" in your statement, let's boil it down.

1. @ 36k+ miles engine issues, engine replaced under extended warranty.
2. @ 40k miles, computer/wiring issue, fixed under extended warranty.
3. Transmission shift issues, undiagnosed.

You are not going to get lemon law for any of that. MN lemon law is "under original mfr's warranty". None of which you are.

 

[Sherman Bird]

Reaching out for thoughts.
Originally was looking for a TRX 1.5yrs ago. Nothing available, so I purchased a 2022 blacked out Limited 1500 etorq. Loved it for the 1st year.
At year one mark, engine failed, never told why but was left stranded in the worst MN snowstorm in yrs. Was left stranded on way to be airport missing international flight. Took 4 days for Ram Care to even get it towed!
They had my truck in the shop for 30 days, finally returned it with new engine after much frustration. By this time my warranty is up by mileage, but luckily I bought a 150,000 mile warranty. Shortly after this engine replacement I get warnings on app stating engine malfunction, however dealer can’t help me for a month. I’m at about 40,000 miles on odometer at this point. Finally get in and need another month for a part. They keep my truck for this past full week, no loaner and tell me they need to replace PCM, seems electrical, but they swap PCM and still not helping. They finally say it was simply a loose wire somewhere, no explanation?
While truck is in the shop I ask sales to consider a trade in for a TRX they have on the lot but dealer has no interest in taking my truck for a trade in, they won’t even return calls for a trade in offer and then threw out a number of $40,000!!!! Granted, sticker was $82,000 just 1.5yrs ago???? To add, once I get the truck back yesterday, I now have the dreaded hard downshift issue that others talk about. It’s borderline unsafe to drive as it has jerky hard downshifts from 3-2-1. I won’t even let my kids drive it because it feels unsafe, can’t imagine how fun that will be in icy conditions.
I contacted Ram Care and they haven’t returned a call from a specialist in a week. I’ve asked them to consider a buy back, at least at fair market value to get me out of this truck. I clearly can’t sell it outright with its history. I have no recourse other than keep it for the 150,000 warranty I have. I just feel Ram should help me out in some form. I’ll happily get into the TRX they have on the lot. I just think I’m stuck with a dreaded COVID production lemon.
My question is: when do I contact a lawyer and what other options do I have? Ram Care is clearly not concerned.
It’s unfortunate because I really liked the truck for the first year.

Keep returning it for repairs pursuant to your complaint. Document EVERYTHING!!!!! Let them know in a friendly, but matter-of-fact businesslike tone that you wish to obtain a resolve, and that it would be a shame to pursue Lemon Law recourse. 4 attempts at repairing the vehicle unsuccessfully for the same problem was grounds for legal Lemon Law claim last I knew of.

My dealer experience was that they would move heaven and earth to prevent the Lemon Law claim, since that claim is against the manufacturer, thus, your power is in the fact that "Big Daddy" Detroit home offices of the manufacturer get involved, like it or not. And, in that stuff rolls down hill.... well, you know!

 

[Mkarban]

Way too much "filler" in your statement, let's boil it down.

1. @ 36k+ miles engine issues, engine replaced under extended warranty.
2. @ 40k miles, computer/wiring issue, fixed under extended warranty.
3. Transmission shift issues, undiagnosed.

You are not going to get lemon law for any of that. MN lemon law is "under original mfr's warranty". None of which you are.

Engine replacement was under 36,000 miles and they had truck for 30 days. I feel latest engine malfunction issue is due to original problem despite it showing up just after 36,0000.

 

[huntergreen]

I would start using another dealer, and contact a lemon law attorney to find out what options you have, if any.

 

[chopperman1]

Engine replacement was under 36,000 miles and they had truck for 30 days. I feel latest engine malfunction issue is due to original problem despite it showing up just after 36,0000.

OK, so 1 problem of the 3 during the mfr warranty. No, you cannot get lemon law. IMHO of course.

 

[tron67j]

MN Lemmon Law https://www.ag.state.mn.us/consumer/handbooks/mncarlaws/CH1.asp

Before seeing an attorney, I would organize all the information into a timeline. Supply only relevant facts. Dates, times, repair orders or any other written material pertinent to the repairs. You don't want to pay an attorney or para-legal to try to organize all that material.

This is exactly first step. Save the expense and do some organizing.

Second, don't ask us if you have a case for anything legal and if you should consult an attorney. Only a licensed attorney can tell you what your exact situation is and what the path forward should be. So if you want to know, do some research on attorneys in your area and find one with background that matches your situation.

Third, if you are going to go route of consulting an attorney do it soon. My two cents is to stop using Ram dealers and get a qualified, highly regarded (probably means expensive, but not necessarily) mechanic who specializes in engine rebuild and electrical diagnostics to do a complete review of your history and vehicle. But ask attorney first about this if you are consulting one to ensure you don't run a foul of anything that could prejudice your rights. I think an independent specialist is the way to go to really find out what the full situation is.

Sorry to hear all the issues, can only imagine how hard it has been. Good luck.

 

[KKBB]

OK, so 1 problem of the 3 during the mfr warranty. No, you cannot get lemon law. IMHO of course.

Pretty sure the drive train is 5 year or 60,000 miles on gas engines...maybe it is 3 year and 60,000 miles. I know it is 60,000 miles though. Either way, most of it should be under the normal manufactures warranty.

 

[Bigskyroadglide]

Find a TRX that is close. Granger in Iowa has several on the lot. Drive down and trade. Drive home happy.

End of story. Or keep wining... your choice

 

[Mkarban]

Find a TRX that is close. Granger in Iowa has several on the lot. Drive down and trade. Drive home happy.

End of story. Or keep wining... your choice

That’s what I’d like to do but dealer doesn’t want this truck and certainly no private party would buy it. This is the reason, I’d like Ram to at least buy back at a fair or better than fair market value, because it’s otherwise impossible to get rid of it with its history.
I’m trapped with a truck that according to my dealer lost 52% of its value in 1.5yrs and 40,000miles. Seems a bit much to me.
I guess the good thing is that I got 0% financing/4yrs

 

[Units]

That’s what I’d like to do but dealer doesn’t want this truck and certainly no private party would buy it. This is the reason, I’d like Ram to at least buy back at a fair or better than fair market value, because it’s otherwise impossible to get rid of it with its history.
I’m trapped with a truck that according to my dealer lost 52% of its value in 1.5yrs and 40,000miles. Seems a bit much to me.
I guess the good thing is that I got 0% financing/4yrs

As mentioned earlier, documentation of dates, times and who you spoke with is key. Keep taking the truck back. Not 100% sure what the lemon law is in your state. I recently went through a similar situation with my 2500 and 30 days out of service due to the non conformity qualified me for the lemon law. Contact a lawyer that has experience with lemon law, give them all the documented information, let them review it to see if you have a case, there is a law, the magnasson act, that requires the manufacturer to pay for atty fees, don’t sign anything and keep them waiting in the wings. I was taken care of and had my vehicle repurchased, without the help of an atty. I have a few questions though:
1) did you finance any negative equity from a trade in or did you purchase any extra add on products (warranties) when purchased the truck?
2) have you established a case # w/ @RamCares?

Stay persistent and read up on what your state laws are in regards to lemon law. I would pursue a buyback, you’ll at least get back most of the money you have put into it. You’ll lose out on a trade. A replacement, you’ll have to take what’s available with similar features and value to your current truck.

 

[Bigskyroadglide]

That’s what I’d like to do but dealer doesn’t want this truck and certainly no private party would buy it. This is the reason, I’d like Ram to at least buy back at a fair or better than fair market value, because it’s otherwise impossible to get rid of it with its history.
I’m trapped with a truck that according to my dealer lost 52% of its value in 1.5yrs and 40,000miles. Seems a bit much to me.
I guess the good thing is that I got 0% financing/4yrs

Unless you bought it from Granger, how will they know? Obviously the issue is not the truck but what they might give you for it?

My father was a car dealer for over 30 years, I never saw him back away from a trade because of mechanical issues. He would just flip the vehicle at the sale. And let it be the next person's problem.

I'm thinking the real reason is money not the truck......

 

[tron67j]

Read through this again. Is the only complaint right now a rough downshift? If so, that seems to be something others notice as well, not saying it is normal, but maybe releasing the TCU might help. But in any case, no harm driving to another dealer and just let them do their assessment and make an offer. As far as your case reads, everything is fixed and it has a new engine so actually a bonus. You don't have to really say anything, just pick what you want, and let them talk turkey.