This MPG is why I bought the 3.21

[Docwagon1776]

Makes me regret selling my k-5 blazer lol ... loved that tank, 46" swampers , filling up was the least of my worries then as is now .... i had a front dana 60 with 5.38s and full float in the back ... thing was nasty ... yeah I think I only got like 10 mpg but boy was it fun lol

Since we've completely derailed the thread anyway, I also had a K5. Not quit as built, 6" of lift and 36" tires IIRC. Locked it up just before leaving for the Army and sold it off for not much once I got into Camaros.

 

[ramffml]

If I was running a fleet, I'd worry about minor differences in fuel economy. I'm not. I'm not an appliance buyer, I'm a buyer of the driving experience. I'd rather drive a $5k truck without worrying about gas prices than drive a $65k truck and count nickles.

And that's fine, as long as we're not confusing our opinion (the extra money doesn't matter to me or you) vs the fact (the 3.21 will save you money every second you're in 8th gear with it).

We all have different ideas on where to spend our money. I ordered my truck very specifically, some stuff I wanted, some stuff I didn't. A (wasted) couple thousand on fuel over a 10 to 15 year lifespan of the truck is not something I'm interested in. That's why my truck was ordered with the bench seat, cloth interior, no sunroof, 8 inch screen, no ramboxes, no air suspension etc, all savings that adds up to many thousands by the time I'm done.

 

[Docwagon1776]

And that's fine, as long as we're not confusing our opinion (the extra money doesn't matter to me or you) vs the fact (the 3.21 will save you money every second you're in 8th gear with it).

We all have different ideas on where to spend our money. I ordered my truck very specifically, some stuff I wanted, some stuff I didn't. A (wasted) couple thousand on fuel over a 10 to 15 year lifespan of the truck is not something I'm interested in. That's why my truck was ordered with the bench seat, cloth interior, no sunroof, 8 inch screen, no ramboxes, no air suspension etc, all savings that adds up to many thousands by the time I'm done.

The 3.21 saved you money out of the box. The good gears are, what, $95 upgrade charge? Invest that at 4% and in 10 year lifespan you'd have nearly $142! Another fact, yet pretty easy to debate the significance of the savings.

I'll "waste" the money for the same reason I "waste" money on better airline seats when the cheapest seat goes to the same location. It's not a "waste" to enjoy it and screw being bored or uncomfortable and it's definitely a bigger difference in expenses then 87 vs 89 or 3.21 vs 3.92 and the other nickle and dime debates that rage here on occasion.

 

[KC5TGQ]

My 2019 Laramie with eTorque gets excellent mileage on the highway. 20-25. 25 on flat roads. The intown is another matter. Average only 18.5. The Hemi is a sweet motor, the sound alone makes me love it. With the high gas prices I do not get to listen to it as much.

 

[ramffml]

The 3.21 saved you money out of the box. The good gears are, what, $95 upgrade charge? Invest that at 4% and in 10 year lifespan you'd have nearly $142! Another fact, yet pretty easy to debate the significance of the savings.

Lets say we have 200,000 miles driven over the lifetime of the truck and we're comparing 16 mpg (3.92) vs 18 mpg (3.21) lifetime averages.

I'm in Canada so I work with liters and kms, and my gas is pricier, but doing the conversions and the math; at $1.86/liter (today's price) I save $9,700. At $2.20/liter ("tomorrows" price and we've seen it hit that already over here) I save $11,535.

Did I mess up the math? If I didn't, I'll take those savings!

 

[Yarek]

not to offend anyone: fuel economy almost always takes a back seat with me. I went camping in the mountains two weeks ago, and with gas prices near $6/gallon I told myself: I'll go easy on the throttle. 20 min into the drive I found myself flooring the truck, being pissed at people going crazy slow at 5am, blocking all lanes even though the traffic was still light overall. So I got ~10mpg out of my truck, while the best I ever got was 12.4. Ah well. I had a ball carving through the twisty roads in the mountains with the pedal pushed to the metal.

It would've been a lot cheaper to stay home for the weekend, rather than driving 600 miles in this utterly inefficient (but very fun!) truck, and drink water at home rather than beer and scotch in the mountains. It also would've been more efficient to take the freeway, rather than the twisty backroads but I rejuvenated and relaxed and that's worth something to me.

Again: I have this truck for fun (mostly) and I'm not running a cargo fleet. I paid a whooping $9k for it as it turned 20 years old and after I keep it for 10 years, I'll be able to afford to sell it for scrap metal if need be, and still be ahead vs. paying off a new(er) truck, even if it gave me 100mpg.

 

[IDSandman]

200k miles driven. Average 20kmiles a year equals 10 years or 120 months. The difference from 3.21 to 3.92 gears is roughly $1800, actually a little less but rounding for math ease, for those 120months. The saving per month is $15. All this using the OP’s numbers given they are correct. For a savings of a measly $15/mo, I’ll take my 3.92 gears all day erry day.
My buddies who have the 3.21 gears with trucks set up similarly to mine, ya know, like a truck. Real tires, canopys or bed caps, some with beefy bumpers, big hitches etc. They get almost identical mileage to mine with 3.92’s. After riding in mine and seeing how it pulls boats etc they all wish they did the 3.92.
I need to drive so I need fuel. Honestly don’t pay a whole lot of attention to my fuel mileage other than to make sure I don’t have an issue going on. I drive my truck for fun, it is fun, I mash it to get on on-ramps pass slow pokes etc. Plus the Hemi sounds so good when opened up!
These fuel mileage threads are funny.

 

[Docwagon1776]

Lets say we have 200,000 miles driven over the lifetime of the truck and we're comparing 16 mpg (3.92) vs 18 mpg (3.21) lifetime averages.

I'm in Canada so I work with liters and kms, and my gas is pricier, but doing the conversions and the math; at $1.86/liter (today's price) I save $9,700. At $2.20/liter ("tomorrows" price and we've seen it hit that already over here) I save $11,535.

Did I mess up the math? If I didn't, I'll take those savings!

View attachment 498184

My 10 year old truck has 77,*** miles on it. It'd take me something like 26 years to hit 200k. $11.5k over 26 years is not going to change my lifestyle in the slightest.

Digging out my original window sticker, my claimed highway milage is 19mpg and I suspect that's pretty accurate when I pay attention to speed limits (like in hostile states...) Looks like I'm doing better than the 3.21 in your example. Maybe weight difference, since I have a quad cab instead of crew cab? I'm even rocking the old junk 6 speed that so many people here dog until it's time to service the 8 speed.. Guess I'm having my cake and eating it, too.

Like I said, I'd rather drive a $5k truck and enjoy it without counting nickles then drive a $65k truck and be worried about gas prices. Think of all that depreciation, insurance, and registration I save. Makes gas a pittance. But my wife nags me about driving 'old junk' or 'old man trucks' so I gave up my Sanford & Son ways.

 

[ramffml]

My 10 year old truck has 77,*** miles on it. It'd take me something like 26 years to hit 200k. $11.5k over 26 years is not going to change my lifestyle in the slightest.

Digging out my original window sticker, my claimed highway milage is 19mpg and I suspect that's pretty accurate when I pay attention to speed limits (like in hostile states...) Looks like I'm doing better than the 3.21 in your example. Maybe weight difference, since I have a quad cab instead of crew cab? I'm even rocking the old junk 6 speed that so many people here dog until it's time to service the 8 speed.. Guess I'm having my cake and eating it, too.

Like I said, I'd rather drive a $5k truck and enjoy it without counting nickles then drive a $65k truck and be worried about gas prices. Think of all that depreciation, insurance, and registration I save. Makes gas a pittance. But my wife nags me about driving 'old junk' or 'old man trucks' so I gave up my Sanford & Son ways.

The point is not to focus on whether you get slightly better than the example (I'm certainly higher than that example as well), the example is there to have something concrete and to show how significant the savings of the 3.21 are with even just a 2 mpg difference over the lifespan of the truck.

And as far as I know, the sticker does not account for anything specific in the truck. In the 5th gens anyway, the sticker will show the same generic mpg for a hemi tradesman as it will for a hemi rebel.

 

[Wild one]

Just something to giggle about,if you remove the speed limiter,the 3.21's are faster wide open,lol.

 

[Docwagon1776]

Just something to giggle about,if you remove the speed limiter,the 3.21's are faster wide open,lol.

Does the truck have the power to accelerate to the rpm limiter in top gear? I've never pushed it into triple digits as far as I can recall. I've got other toys for that. 140 is about my pucker limit regardless of mechanical limits, though I've briefly touched 150's in a tightly controlled environment. I stayed away from zoomsplat motorcycles because I knew I lacked the self control to own one.

 

[Wild one]

Does the truck have the power to accelerate to the rpm limiter in top gear? I've never pushed it into triple digits as far as I can recall. I've got other toys for that. 140 is about my pucker limit regardless of mechanical limits, though I've briefly touched 150's in a tightly controlled environment. I stayed away from zoomsplat motorcycles because I knew I lacked the self control to own one.

With 3.21's i've seen 153,and it still had a bit more in it,but the road was getting mighty narrow,and telephone poles were going by like a picket fence,lol.I hang around with the local Challenger/Charger club,and i've had to prove the truck will keep up a few times,so it's seen the high side of 140 more then couple times

 

[Docwagon1776]

The point is not to focus on whether you get slightly better than the example (I'm certainly higher than that example as well), the example is there to have something concrete and to show how significant the savings of the 3.21 are with even just a 2 mpg difference over the lifespan of the truck.

And as far as I know, the sticker does not account for anything specific in the truck. In the 5th gens anyway, the sticker will show the same generic mpg for a hemi tradesman as it will for a hemi rebel.

Is 2mpg the actual difference? For who? The entire thread was about a focus on your specific example in one context, my specific example in my context and why I agree there's likely some difference but if that's a significant difference is much more debatable.

Sticker does show difference for drivetrains, at least here. I've been looking at a bunch of F-150s and stickers are ranging from 18 to 23 highway, all with the same 3.5EB and all 4WD, depending on trim. A Lariat gets better milage than a Tremor, which gets better milage than a Raptor, for example, assuming due to tire selection, gearing, and ride height. Broncos are the same way, a Sasquatch package Bronco will have lower milage on the sticker than a non-sasquatch of the same trim. Every generation Camaro I've bought has shown a difference on the sticker between the 6 speed manual and the automatic. Maybe due to CAFE standards in the US, I'm not sure, but they are definitely not the same across an entire product line in the US.

 

[Docwagon1776]

With 3.21's i've seen 153,and it still had a bit more in it,but the road was getting mighty narrow,and telephone poles were going by like a picket fence,lol.I hang around with the local Challenger/Charger club,and i've had to prove the truck will keep up a few times,so it's seen the high side of 140 more then couple times

Not without a helicopter spotting for me or a closed track. I've stretched the boundaries of my own stupidity a time or two, but I'm older and less death wishy these days. Generally.

 

[Wild one]

Not without a helicopter spotting for me or a closed track. I've stretched the boundaries of my own stupidity a time or two, but I'm older and less death wishy these days. Generally.

Up here the roads are pretty wide open,lol

 

[IDSandman]

With 3.21's i've seen 153,and it still had a bit more in it,but the road was getting mighty narrow,and telephone poles were going by like a picket fence,lol.I hang around with the local Challenger/Charger club,and i've had to prove the truck will keep up a few times,so it's seen the high side of 140 more then couple times

Not sure I wanna tow my 21’ bass boat at 150mph! Lol! 80mph though, yep! Hemi loves the fuel at that speed though. Lol

 

[ramffml]

Is 2mpg the actual difference? For who? The entire thread was about a focus on your specific example in one context, my specific example in my context and why I agree there's likely some difference but if that's a significant difference is much more debatable.

If the difference is only 1 mpg then it's still thousands. If the difference is 3 then it's many thousands.

Fact: the 3.92 will cost thousands more than the 3.21 over a 200K mile lifetime.

That is significant amount, you choose not to worry about it but it's significant nonetheless.

Sticker does show difference for drivetrains, at least here. I've been looking at a bunch of F-150s and stickers are ranging from 18 to 23 highway, all with the same 3.5EB and all 4WD, depending on trim. A Lariat gets better milage than a Tremor, which gets better milage than a Raptor, for example, assuming due to tire selection, gearing, and ride height. Broncos are the same way, a Sasquatch package Bronco will have lower milage on the sticker than a non-sasquatch of the same trim. Every generation Camaro I've bought has shown a difference on the sticker between the 6 speed manual and the automatic. Maybe due to CAFE standards in the US, I'm not sure, but they are definitely not the same across an entire product line in the US.

There is much discussion on this, for example in this thread below. It appears that Ram does not differentiate the 3.21 vs 3.92 on the sticker.

https://**************/community/threads/mpg-computer-lies-badly.11920/page-3#post-177841

 

[IDSandman]

C’mon man. It’s not “thousands”. Your math showed only $1800 over 200k’ miles. Again, if 10 yrs to get to 200k that’s $15 a month. Lol

 

[Docwagon1776]

Up here the roads are pretty wide open,lol

I don't miss much about Kansas, but the totally flat roads with nothing but amber waves of grain sea to shining sea is one of them. Even in my misspent youth I realized if I blew a tire they'd never find my corpse until they harvested...

 

[Docwagon1776]

With 3.21's i've seen 153,and it still had a bit more in it,but the road was getting mighty narrow,and telephone poles were going by like a picket fence,lol.I hang around with the local Challenger/Charger club,and i've had to prove the truck will keep up a few times,so it's seen the high side of 140 more then couple times

Oh, and you forgot to mention your MPG at that speed. Try to stay on topic. ;D